okay, i want to go ahead and clear somethings up about the "Carrillo" product line, yes the company's name is spelled "Carrillo" not "Carillo", anyways this information is somewhat usefull/technical and has been taken from both:

+ Carrillo's Site

and their sister company:

+ JEpistons Site

also the link to an earlier thread Earl created, about Carrillo A-beams on a previous build he was doing, over 2 years ago... where i was asking him for any info. on these rods i could find, b/c apparently no one on here knew anything worth my time:

+ Earl's original thread about Carrillo's A-Beams


to start this off there are a total of 5 different b-series vtec connecting rods manufactured, JEpistons sells/boxes 2 of them and they both come with the smaller 5/16" bolts, the WMC for the "pro-a", and the CARR for the "pro-h" with the part numbers:

JEpiston part numbers:
__________________________________________________ __________________

1. "A5433HB827F90"

which is the "a-beam" or "pro-a" however you want to say it, and features a 5/16" SPS-WMC5 rod bolt, max tq. of 38ft/lbs, and a weight of 445 grams.

2. "H5433HB826B86"

which is there"h-beam" or "pro-h" however you want to say it, and features a 5/16" SPS-CARR rod bolt, max tq. 45ft/lbs, and a weight of 453 grams.

this info. can be found on page #16 in the JEpistons sportcomp.pdf catalog here:
+ JEpistons SportComp. Catalog
__________________________________________________ __________________


Carrillo manufactures 3 diff. b-series vtec connecting rods, that have nothing to do with JEpistons facillity, 2 of them are the "pro-h" and 1 of them is the "pro-a"....here are the part numbers:

Carrillo part numbers:
__________________________________________________ __________________

<U>pro-H</U>

1. "AA-VTC&gt;-65433S"

features a 3/8" SPS-CARR rod bolt, max tq. at 65ft/lbs, and weighs 505 grams.

2. "AA-VTC&gt;-65433H"

features a 3/8" SPS-WMC6 rod bolt, max tq. at 45ft/lbs, and weighs 500 grams.

this info can be found in Carrillo's.pdf catalog on page #8 here:
Carrillo's Catalog

<U>pro-A</U>

3. "AA-VTC&lt;A-55433"

not sure what bolt this features, but im guessing its the SPS-WMC5... due to its super lightweight of just 411 grams.

this info is found on page #11 in Carrillo's catalog linked/posted above.
__________________________________________________ __________________

"We initially introduced this part to the marketplace through our sister company, JE pistons. We wanted to distribute the part slowly to make sure we could meet manufacturing requirements. The success of the new A-Beam has been tremendous. We are now formally introducing the Pro-A to the entire performance community."

this was taken right from Carrillo's website... i did not know this until i spoke with Richard over at Carrillo when i called him asking the differences about the CARR bolt sizes of the JEpsiton boxed Carrillo's h-beams vs. the House Carrillo's h-beams... he basically told me the JEpistons boxed rods were for mild/replacement motors and weret processed for JEpistons with smaller bolts for there lower price market... he also informed me that the only way to get a set of "house" carrillo h-beams for a honda with the 3/8" CARR bolt was direct threw them and they weren't hooked up with any distributers... this means that JEpistons is a way bigger distribution client then in-house Carrillo, thats why the teamed up with them b/c JE is a gaint in sportcomp. and is affiliated with more distributers.... and also they wanted to offer a cheaper priced product-line to the sport.

so chances are if your a dealer for Carrillo, they are comming from a JE plant and in a JE box, b/c JE has licesening to sell a Carrillo product as Carrilo, but when you get the box it has JE on it... also Richard told me that JE will never and cant sell the 3/8" bolt with the h-beams b/c of the license agreement.

so what does this have to do with the "pro-A" rods... well first off these statements were made by Earl in this thread in the summer of 2005, from this thread Earl's original thread.

def. a hard company to deal with agree'd but JEpistons always sold the rods, when they were manufacturing custom to JE specs by Carrillo... and he sits here trying to push pauters on me which is also an excellent rod, but iobviously wasnt interested in the pauter rod.

I respect Earl a lot, he is very helpful... but before you badmouth a Company, did you even have a real Carrillo boxed rod... or did you have the JE boxed rod... also your at fault for not doing what was reccomend in the parts catalog, listed on their site... you cant be confusing Carrillo parts at fault if you have the weaker JE version... then you need to look at the JE catalog and not the Carrillo for specs and info... any pics of the boxes, and if you spoke with Carrillo you would more then likely not have said that, b/c you would know that JE sells the rod as well, there are 5 diff. rods.

i have more to add later but im tired as expletive.





Modified by manikGSR at 11:22 AM 2/14/2006

 

If Eagles are understating their HP claims, then what makes Carrillo any different. Just because a company rates it a a few hp less per cylinder than the other company, doesnt make one better than the other. We shouldnt base our decisions on that.
In defense of Carrillo, I dont think they said in exact words to "F-off" to Earl. That may be the feeling that Earl got with the answer that they gave him, but we dont have a complete transcript of the whole conversation so its not our right to comment if he was done wrong or not.
I have utmost respect for Earl, and if Carrillo was totally rude and yelling at him or something, then yes the Carrillo staff may have done wrong. But if Carrillo staff said, sorry Earl, we cant do anything for you since this was used in the wrong application. Then that was the right answer to the issue. Again, we werent there to witness the whole thing so YOU have to look at both sides of the story and the possibilities on what could have happened.

I thought this post would calm down after awhile. But I think we're leading in the wrong direction again. I was hoping my previous comments would show some light on the questionable issues.

This post is beyond being informative to just fighting. This is one of those posts that should be deleted since its not doing anyone good and just making matters worse.


P.S. manik, I would have had to take a nap right after, if I wrote down what you wrote. haha.

 

there is no way on God's green/blue planet that Carrillo rods are worse than stock.
you can not prove that they are worse...anywhere at anytime.
I have piles of stick rods, they oval way too easy.

I am not a domestic guy......but the daytona 500 is coming up.....restricted motors...the rods in there are lightweight for ~6.200"c-c usually ~535g I think.......a huge chunk of the field will run Carrillo.....9200+rpm for 500 miles........thats alot
I use all the rods on the market........scat, eagle, manley, Crower maxilight, Crower billet, Carrillo A beam , Carrillo H beam straight beam, Carrillo H beam Tapered beam, Pauter, Cunningham....I am not biased, I don't get a better price from one company to another, I don't get sponsor from any of them....all those rods have certain limits and performance......weight is directly related to HP that reaches the ground, so it is a factor, more so in allmotor than forced induction obviously.
if you want to use stock rods, fine, if you want easgle, fine....but don't come whining to me if they don't perform as "you think" they should perform.
One eagle rep told me a few years back that they rods were good for 750 hp......I said yes, in a v8....I said what about a 4cyl, he said 750 hp......lol........I do not think he knew what a 4 cyl was....lol

 

I've used eagles with success and now I use Manely rods. I never ran stocks in any of my setups.

I just dont see myself spending money on rods that are not up to their par.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by exospeedAMcrx &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">If Eagles are understating their HP claims, then what makes Carrillo any different. Just because a company rates it a a few hp less per cylinder than the other company, doesnt make one better than the other. We shouldnt base our decisions on that.
In defense of Carrillo, I dont think they said in exact words to "F-off" to Earl. That may be the feeling that Earl got with the answer that they gave him, but we dont have a complete transcript of the whole conversation so its not our right to comment if he was done wrong or not.
I have utmost respect for Earl, and if Carrillo was totally rude and yelling at him or something, then yes the Carrillo staff may have done wrong. But if Carrillo staff said, sorry Earl, we cant do anything for you since this was used in the wrong application. Then that was the right answer to the issue. Again, we werent there to witness the whole thing so YOU have to look at both sides of the story and the possibilities on what could have happened.

I thought this post would calm down after awhile. But I think we're leading in the wrong direction again. I was hoping my previous comments would show some light on the questionable issues.

This post is beyond being informative to just fighting. This is one of those posts that should be deleted since its not doing anyone good and just making matters worse.

</TD></TR></TABLE>

i agree 100 percent... im not comming at Earl at all, as i respect him too... but i was just posting real info, b/c im running i am real h-beams in my shortblock and when i was researching and getting parts lined up there was no info, and i had to figure it out myself... no i dont want a cookie, i just dont want anyone else to go threw the stress or out of their way over a freakin set of connecting rods... its not worth it, i learned a lot from this experience... and yes i know the h-beams are much stronger then the a-beams and all, but these are 2 very confusing companies with variations of the same part... but Carrillo was very helpful with informing me of this, all i had to do was place one phone call..

i just hope he wasnt using the real carrillo boxed rods, b/c the JE rods are def. lesser quality... if shaun over at ERL see's this and has any pics of my the rods in my build post em up... b/c they built my motor twice once with the JE h-beam rods and then again with the real Carrillo's h-beam... im glad i caught this before the car started up and saw 40lbs... b/c carrrillo told me that i needed the 3/8" carr bolt for my FI application.


Modified by manikGSR at 10:41 AM 2/14/2006

 

you sound like you fell asleep after hitting the last key......LOL

 

gnite guys. turn off the lights on this post and lets go to sleep.

 

^ haha i know i know, i did pass out for like 5 mins at my computer desk..

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Turbocivic94 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Since you love Carrillo rods why dont u do the testing. I would not buy these rods cause they're not worth the money. Why the expletive spend $600 for rods that are worse than stock ones.

End of story</TD></TR></TABLE>

Its not that I love Carrillo......Carrillo performs as designed.
I love running engines, I am getting sick and tired of seeing all these threads with blown up engines, recipies for making ticking time bombs, engines that should never be assembled, but yet insist on it....and then the 'assemblers" come on here and say "it blew up"......DUH !.....so this is to try and limit blowing engines up....i guess if we support blowing up engine, then delete this.....and lets put in 5 lb cranks, 100g pistons, 150g rods and lets do some destruction.

 

LMAO ahahhahahahha

 

Thanks for spending the time on your post. I have been thru JE pistons and must say I have never seen any machines making rods there. I can't even imagine a company with the history of Car(R)illo allowing anyone else to make rods under their name. I was told by JE that both companies must stand on their own and JE was selling rods made by Carrillo for a period of time. I have no idea what the current status is or was between the 2 sister companies. Last I heard, JE was not selling any rods, either their own or Carrillos.
My facts are as follows...
1)I bought rods that came in a Carrillo box
2)I installed them in a customer's high WHP engine.
3)There was no bolt problem with them. They just bent.
4)I replaced the rods with Pauters for my customer at no charge.
5)Their web site stated they were made from the same blanks as their expensive rods and the only difference was there were less hand operations and more machine operations, therefore the cheaper price. Right or wrong, I relied on that statement.
6)They have a great rep. I relied on that.
7)They offered me no help what so ever. They could have straightened them quickly. They could have replaced the bad ones. They could have taken them in trade on their better rod. They chose to just dismiss me.
8)If I f...ed up in choosing Carrillo, fine. I make mistakes, who gives a sh.. I made it right for everyone involved.
9)My intent is only to share my experiences, good or bad. The only way I can respond to Carrillo is to never buy their rods again...and I do buy a hell of alot of rods. I'm sure this will not effect Carrillo in the slightest.
10)This will be my last post on the subject.

 

AMEN

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by earl &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">7)They offered me no help what so ever. They could have straightened them quickly.</TD></TR></TABLE>

So you can straighten a bent rod without compromising it's structural integrity?

 

sure why not, its like putting a crank in a press to straight it no? NOT
there are few master that straighten a crank and they do not use a press, that makes it worse, rods are more difficult.

kids, don't do this at home.

the rods are scrap now, bent twisted.its just a matter of how much....hang them for a souvenier............or throw them out.....I wouldn't even consider selling them.....its just knowingly passing around a problem to someone else.

 

how much whp did they hold though?
500,600,700,800,900, 1000?...be good to know........data aquisition
maybe the engine detonated.....those are lightweight rods......there is no way they can take the pounding that a heavy rod can.

 

Man, If these rods were junk...how come rods advertised as holding 50hp per cylinder held over 600whp and only bent? I don't think a stock rod would have just bent...It would have come out the motor and said Hi. So I guess this goes to show that even the inferior 'junk' Carillos still did 600whp and didn't break.

 

Wow, I love starting controversy......not

The only thing Im gonna take from this is Im GLAD I sell Carrillo rods. I mean, wtf....the rod they said is designed to take 50hp per hole has taken 150whp per hole. I think its money well spent

Oh, and for the now NEW Carrillo haters where I mentioned something about wreaking a companies image, somehow knowing fully thats what some people would take that away with this thread. Carrillo is responsible for the design of the now famous H beam that everyone and their uncle copies. Im faily confident that they know what they are doing----obviously when a 50hp rod will take 150whp before failure even when another issue, like tuning could have totally been the factor here.

Carrillo
Making a mistake and it blowing up in your face I've been there Makes us all stronger

 

Just for the record, I threw out the 600whp figure.

Earl said it was considerably more than that.

 

So even the more better I suppose, 150whp+ per rod

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Suprdave &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Man, If these rods were junk...how come rods advertised as holding 50hp per cylinder held over 600whp and only bent? I don't think a stock rod would have just bent...It would have come out the motor and said Hi. So I guess this goes to show that even the inferior 'junk' Carillos still did 600whp and didn't break.</TD></TR></TABLE>

You know, after reading all the posts about how krapy these rods must be because of the 50hp per cylender rating, I was getting ready to make the same comment.
Ive broken rods in half when they were rated for more hp than i was giving them, but these rods bent slightly with 400+ hp over what they are rated for! That right there shows the quality in Carrillo's rods.

As for the customer service, as others have said, we wernt there to hear the actual conversation so i wont judge it.

I do appreciate the fact that Earl shared the info with us so we dont make the same mistake.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Laughing Man &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

You know, after reading all the posts about how krapy these rods must be because of the 50hp per cylender rating, I was getting ready to make the same comment.
Ive broken rods in half when they were rated for more hp than i was giving them, but these rods bent slightly with 400+ hp over what they are rated for! That right there shows the quality in Carrillo's rods.

</TD></TR></TABLE>

Although it sounds convincing that a 50HP/cyl rod is only bent at 600+ WHP, but the such low power rating only shows that the rod could not handle anything more than 50HP/cyl reliably. My definition of reliability would also mean I would get support and some sort of negotation from the company in case something goes wrong. Think about it, 50HP/cyl is only 200HP for a Honda (BHP is presume), and if you do end up breaking that rod at say 280HP, now the guys over at Carillo can dismiss you. That means if I put these rods in a mild JDM ITR motor build with about 190 WHP (200+ BHP), I am considered "using them for the wrong application". Rod strength do depend on a whole bunch of variables, but if you pass that "magic" number, well, good luck. Why don't Carillo make the power rating higher? Well, I guess the rods aren't really that much quality for the price IMO because they could not gamble any sort of failures at anything more than 50HP/L... It's definitely something to ponder about

 

just weld 2 sets of ls rods together and ride.

 

I think this is an informative thread.

Obviously the Carrillo rods were used in the wrong application. This is good to know. When I was building my motor, I almost picked up a set of Carrillo Pro-A rods and I had every intention of trying to make well over 600 WHP. Having it now brought to my attention that they would fail, I'm glad I didn't get them. I'm sure I probably would have done more research about them before buying if I had decided to go that route, but I personally prefer an H-beam rod and the Eagles have been proven to handle a serious amount of power without issue, so those were the rods I used.

Oh, last time I talked to Eagle about their 4G63 rods, they stated they were good to 1000 HP. 250 HP a hole is pretty good. I wonder how they would react if you snapped at rod at 950 WHP though and tried to return them. It would still be within their application range, according to them, but that is some serious power to try and guarantee a part will work at. Is it better for a company to rate their rods at the maximum limit? Or is it better for them to be conservative with their ratings?

The Carrillo A-beam looks to be a rod designed for high RPM use. Notice how thin they are up top? Now seeing pictures of everything I would be scared to put any real combustion force thru those rods, but I bet with a light piston on an N/A motor, they would probably handle any RPM you could build a valvetrain to keep up with.

Earl, thanks for the post. The guys that have been voicing their opinions without trying to turn it into a "slam XXXXXXX vendor just to see their sales drop," thanks for your thoughts as well.

 

I bet if it made 600 hp and didnt bend carrillo would be advertising that on their site......

all motor rods take 600 hp!!

 

i would say the problem isn't so much that they bent, but the way they handled the situtation. Basicly shoving it back in earls face isn't something i want to go threw

eagle