Quick question guys, Is anyone already compared and measured the TB of the automatic F20B vs the Manual F20B?

everyone says automatic have smaller one, Right.

But i could be a great help for people who want to buy one to know the size of the automatic F20B, this way, they could take measurement before buying a F20B.

as for the OBD1/2 question, My GF have the Manual T2T4 F20B into her 97 CL. The engine run on the OEM main harness of the OBD2 CL and running with PCB OBD2 ECU.

here's some pitctures

 

i know (because i have dealt with 3 F20B motors) that the manual one is 62mm (looks exactly like a b18c5 TB) for sure and the auto is around 58mm. I bought the last one and told the shipper to give me the one with the 62mm. Most of them act like you're speaking a 3rd world language so what i did was tell him how many of them they had. He said 5. So i said look for one with a flywheel and one with a flexplate. Once he saw the flywheel one (which is the one i ended up buying) he saw how big the TB was. So i told him from now on thats how he can tell.

 

This is a precise info! tnx buddy!

 

No problem my friend

 

So everyone talks about 8 wire or 9 wire dizzys and stuff..I bought a car with an h22 wiring harness in it and the dizzy plug has 11 wires. Any ideas on wth it is for?

 

well autodynamics and the Bernard guy are two different people or companies........so this guy sells the 5th and reverse gear set for the t2t4 tranny.......would i beable to replace the h22(m2a4) fith and reverse with the f20b(t2t4) 5th& rev....?

also, does anyone know if any, what piston rods from other motors are direct replacements for(f20b).......or do they have to be special ordered or custom made

 

As far as them being different companies or affiliates i wouldnt say no. 4 years ago while finding and sourcing f20b parts. Bernard28, autodynamicsusa's ebay store, and I kept in constant contact about internal parts and eventually he told me he offered head sets and IACVs for the F20B through their website only which happened to be autodynamicsusa. And he told me if i needed to get any parts not on the site or ebay store (all OEM) then he could get them from the dealer for me. Im not going to argue this as i dealt with him personally for a long time.

Ive been building the F20B motor for the last 2 years and i can tell you it does not share rods or pistons with any other honda motor. On my personal motor (built) im using rods from Eagle that are the companies universals for B series motors (5.862) and custom pistons from CP. It was either that or make custom pistons and rods. Only things you could use from a USDM motor for the F20B piston and rod is B series rod bearings, F23 rod bolts, and H22 piston pins. You can use Hastings 85mm piston rings I have the part number at the shop.

 

As far as them being different companies or affiliates i wouldnt say no. 4 years ago while finding and sourcing f20b parts. Bernard28, autodynamicsusa's ebay store, and I kept in constant contact about internal parts and eventually he told me he offered head sets and IACVs for the F20B through their website only which happened to be autodynamicsusa. And he told me if i needed to get any parts not on the site or ebay store (all OEM) then he could get them from the dealer for me. Im not going to argue this as i dealt with him personally for a long time.

Ive been building the F20B motor for the last 2 years and i can tell you it does not share rods or pistons with any other honda motor. On my personal motor (built) im using rods from Eagle that are the companies universals for B series motors (5.862) and custom pistons from CP. It was either that or make custom pistons and rods. Only things you could use from a USDM motor for the F20B piston and rod is B series rod bearings, F23 rod bolts, and H22 piston pins. You can use Hastings 85mm piston rings I have the part number at the shop.

As for the trans you should be able to swap out both the 5th and reverse, the only thing im not sure about is the differentials. I know there is a difference between Usdm and Jdm differentials but the T2T4 and JDM H22 trans could possibly swap them but im not sure about the diffs but i am about the gears

 

ok just for the record i wasn't trying to spark a debate at all.....what i did was look up the company and called them and by the guys response to my questions......"do you sell motor parts for f20b, huh!.....what! duhh!"
i was like ok no connection, but as i read your response i noticed the usa at the end and that is probably the difference and why i didn't speak to the right people.....

ok good stuff man i definately appriciate the knowledge and willingness to share.....i have an accord w/h swap and now i'm doing something different. so don't want another h......really i'm interested in the t2t4 tranny. do you know where i can by just that tranny?

now my swap is going into an ob1 car and from what i understand these f20b motors start at what?......99'/00'......am i going to have any problems with this swap?....or will it be just a harness issue....?

if you don't mind, i would like those part#'s for replacement parts and this time i will try autodynamic(USA) and see what happens.....after that the next stop i guess is Bernard28ebay

if there is any other info you feel i can use pls feel free
thx.

 

you can try hmotorsonline.com for the trans. I know i seen one on ebay recently for around 1100 or less but i cant remember. These motors came between 98-01 in auto (180hp) and manual (200hp) He (bernard28, which i dont see his ebay store anymore) gave me the part numbers when he was figuring out what i needed.
with the swap the IAC will be the one thing that causes issues unless you use the H22 upper manifold plenum, That way you can use a two wire IAC (F20B has a 3 wire rotary style one that i believe only certain EK and 98-up accords have)

Swap is easy. You can take the civic harness and first swap out the injector plugs and then plug the injectors up to the civic harness. then as you lay the harness over the motor; lengthen, change, add etc to the Civic harness to match the motor. Simple but time consuming especially if youre trying your best to keep it looking as stock as possible ( Looking good!) But its very easy trust me if i showed you, you would trip out.

 

X2 truth

 

i may hold you to that oppertunity to trip out lol!.....so when you say swap out injector plugs you mean from bseries to f20b or something else.

i noticed u just said civic and not any b-series specifically......so it sounds like you are saying that the civic harness is a straight plug and play into the f20b and that i have to use the civic injectors in place of the f20b ijectors.....am i on the right page?
i want to know in your opinion is the difference of torque b/t f20b(140tq) & h22(160tq) that big adeal

ps i called steve at hmotors and he has tranny and motor.

 

I mean to remove the pins from the Civic/Integra/Prelude/Accord/Odyssey injector plugs (de-pinning) and insert them into the F20B plugs. or cut off the plugs and solder the F20B plugs on. You can do this using any harness to start. Only reason i said Civic harness is because thats the car you said you had. B series is the same with negligible differences here and there. Trust me you dont want to use any Civic/Integra injectors on an F20B because they only flow 240cc as opposed to the 310cc of the F20B. So F20B injectors/Civic Harness and just swap out inector plugs.

Its not entirely plug and play. Some of the plugs will reach their sensors and some wont. Some have different connections (like the back=up light switch) and need to be changed.

So if i were doing it, i know the stater solenoid wire and VSS connections need to be extended. The IAT, MAP, TPS, injectors and IAC will reach. Back-up switch, oil pressure switch connections need to be changed. F20B injectors are saturated so no need for resistor boxes. And i run the injector wires between the runners of the IM, not over like stock. Very clean look. Ill post some pics in a bit. but overall, very easy just be ready to spend some time. nothing that comes out great just happens

 

i said that i had a civic?.......really!....... i never owned a civic in my life. i'm an accord man thats what i am swaping actually an Ody but same thing.....after talking with Steve @ hmotors i'm actually thinking of another H with sirt tranny.....maybe i'll used the f2b's intake mani. if decide to go with the H is the harness situation the same or different. thx

 

Ahh i see. Simple mistake everyone makes them but you know hondas are virtually the same when it comes to the harness anyways. But same thing with the H motor except you dont have to worry about the IAC part because it is a 2 wire IAC like your Accord/Odyssey.

If youre still going to be using the F20B mani remember it uses the 3 wire IAC so it would be easier to swap out the upper plenum with one from an H

 

ok cool but you are really killing me with Abrev. IAC and all the others u listed above WTF!.......you have to spell it out for me i'm a noob at this so to speak lol!

 

IAC= Idle Air Control Valve (front of manifold near throttle cable bracket)
IAT= Intake Air Temp Sensor (across from brake Master cylinder on manifold)
VSS= Vehicle Speed Sensor (below the throttle body on the trans)
MAP= Manifold Absolute Pressure sensor (on top of throttle body or, on some models, on the firewall or in a black box on the firewall)
TPS= Throttle position sensor (on throttle body facing towards the firewall)

 

Here's the swap i did for my brother (F20B, EG coupe) Just a few pics











It drives so very well without vtec, you almost dont feel the need to get it up there. Past 6k, it feels like a semi just passes you and you realize it's chained to your car and vroom youre gone. Pulls very hard up to the set 8200 redline. Dont mind the clutch hose it was just mocked up (it now runs behind the motor), this pic is WAY back in January 08. Matter fact, thats when the Chargers beat the Colts in Indianapolis in the Divisional Playoffs that year (a Saturday i think) Entire swap took 1 1/2 days in my backyard (no bullshit i can rack em at the shop or on the concrete from start to finish)

 

im sorry to hear that you had to do all that work with the injectors. all you had to do is file of the nubs on the injectors and the civic harness fits over them. the only reason that nub is there is to make sure you dont put the clips on backwards.

and you think its bada$$ now at 8200 get it tuned and see what 8750 redline with 3500 vtec feels like the thing is retarded and i only have the auto cams. gona get the type-s cams real soon. i would highly recomend getting a ecu from them http://www.phearable.net/ please do not run the base map forever thinkin your good. you need to go get tuned.

 

???? It is tuned. Its a manual version. I gave my brother the recommendation (and he agreed) until he gets a valvetrain upgrade there will be nothing past 8200. its on Hondata s300. The F20B's stock injectors look nothing like the OBD1 Civic or Accord plug. it looks more like the Scion/RDX plugs but even then its still a little different. I was telling ceebee9 if he's going to use the F20B injectors just pull the pins from the back and insert in the Civic connector or change them. NONE of that is hard at all. So you dont have to be sorry for anything but misinterpretation of what i told him. No biggie

Stock block and head F20B (Manual version)
Stock valvetrain
Euro R intake manifold and Power Products 68mm TB, IM thermal gasket
RC 440 injectors
Camp1320 Header
T2T4 tranny
Compression tested at 215-220psi across
Manual tensioner
3IN intake with V-stack
198.7hp and 151.1tq
93 octane
Dyno Dynamics

And this was with a bad distributor (Code 9 and bad ignitor), and 2 dented runners on the header (Runners 1 and 2) It now has a Distributor King dizzy and he said it runs harder than before. We are busy guys so we're trying to figure some track time with her (Plus he has to get some slicks anyway)

 

yo jr its me again, i was going threw some old threads talking about t2t4 back in 02...seemed like no one knew what they were talking about.

so now 7yrs later i assume we all know a little more. now! the t2t4 is from the jdm f20b sir-t lsd manual? right!....(1) the accord euro R is the f20b right!(2) my understanding is that t2t4 tranny has the same gears 1st- 4th as jdm H22a and the 5th is the accord taller gear giving you the more economical drive in fith at higher speeds...Right!(3) like the H23 shares the 1st & 5th gear as the H22a and shorter 2nd,3rd &4th gears no vtec.
in my jdm-H22a 70mph i'm just under 4000rpm i hit 120mph at the top of 4th gear i still have stock p13 so thats it for me i can't exceed 120mph speed limiter shuts it down...i read some where that honda bult the newer f20b specifically for the accord to have the H performance but still remain an accord which had a lot of economy factors....i have a buddy here that has an H22a with t2t4 tranny and he says that in 5th gear at 70mph he is at around 2000rpm but he does have Hondata and the car is tuned so i'm sure if this is a stock feature or if it is a tuned feature...do u know? BTW... what does ATR mean lol!

 

Sir-T is manual and has the T2T4 tranny
Euro R has an H22, Accord SiR and SirT have F20Bs
ATR means Accord Type R
Trans gearing and Final Drive ratio has to do with the rpm not the tune So basically you wouldnt be able to tune in a cruising speed and rpm. Otherwise everyone would have 35 or more mpg. It is written that honda designed the F20b to race in the 2000cc and lower class, with the Accord being the reciever. (dont quote me on that, thats what ive read over the years)
on the T2T4 5th gear i dont know for sure. But my brothers 5th gear lands the needle in almost the same spot as the H22 trans did (had to change trans to get the diff bearings changed on the T2T4)

 

And this was with a bad distributor (Code 9 and bad ignitor), and 2 dented runners on the header (Runners 1 and 2) It now has a Distributor King dizzy and he said it runs harder than before. We are busy guys so we're trying to figure some track time with her (Plus he has to get some slicks anyway)[/QUOTE]

i have ran into the distributor problem as well...
i have the 5 wires from the harness but i have 8 on the distributor,,
What is the distributor King???? jw.
do you guys know how to wire in the wires into the ditributor?
any help will be greatly appreciated..im almost done with the swap as well
f20b into 97 acura cl

 

might wanna talk to L3G10N (clue: he's on page 4 with 2 big pics of a CL) as he swapped an F20B into his girlfriend's 97 CL so he might be very familiar with the wiring. if you look online in the search engine put Distributor king. it is a company that deals specifically with brand new distributors for all kinds of cars, but they have a long list of honda applications.

 

ok....i have both dizzy's laid out....obd1(f20b) & obd2(f22b)

OBD2 f22b -- OBD1 f20b
BLUE -- BLUE
BLACK/YELLOW -- BLACK/YELLOW
YELLOW/GREEN -- YELLOW/GREEN
YELLOW -- YELLOW
BLACK -- BLACK
Ive managed to match the 5 colors but the F20b dizzy have an extra 3 wires....
? -- WHITE/BLUE
? -- YELLOW/BLUE
? -- WHITE
so my question is where do i hook up the rest of these extra wires? do i jus leave them out?
i also know i got to tap a wire onto the tach blade..and i attach this tach to the negative terminal on the coil? or i heard connect it to the blue wire off the ICM?
can sum1 help me PLZ.....in desperate help. =\