Syncro damaged?
#1
Syncro damaged?
Hope someone here can give me some advise... 2 weeks ago, I started experiencing very difficult engagement into 1st from stand still with the engine running and notchy 3rd gear shifts when driving. I suspected it was my MTF, so I changed it out for some Motul MTF. Car ran fine for 2 weeks and then today, it started again. Reverse gear is hard to go in too. I can shift easily into any gear with the engine shut off. I have a clutch type LSD and a buddy of mine tells me that clutch LSDs have to be rebuild every year or two. Can a delayed rebuild cause this?
The strange thing is that it was fine when I drove it the first half of the day. I parked the car on a slight slope for about 2 hours and when I started to drive it again, it started acting up. Sounds stupid, but can parking on a slope cause this? I wasn't engaged in any gear parked on the slope. The only unusual thing I was not doing since yesterday, was to engage into first just before the car stops at the lights. I find it so easy to engage 1st when doing that. Right now, I even have trouble doing this sort of engagement into 1st. I practically have to jam it hard to get into first. What can be the problem?
The strange thing is that it was fine when I drove it the first half of the day. I parked the car on a slight slope for about 2 hours and when I started to drive it again, it started acting up. Sounds stupid, but can parking on a slope cause this? I wasn't engaged in any gear parked on the slope. The only unusual thing I was not doing since yesterday, was to engage into first just before the car stops at the lights. I find it so easy to engage 1st when doing that. Right now, I even have trouble doing this sort of engagement into 1st. I practically have to jam it hard to get into first. What can be the problem?
#2
Honda-Tech Member
Re: Syncro damaged? (garyc17)
if reverse is the only problem, then don't worry. common in some hondas, i notice them more on d-series trannies. with the car runnning, put the shifter into 1st, 2nd, then reverse. it'll work everytime. i'm positive.
#3
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Either the synchro's are going or your shift forks are bent. Usually though when a synchronizer starts to go you start getting a grinding noise right as you start to upshift into a gear.
#5
Honda-Tech Member
Re: Syncro damaged? (garyc17)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by garyc17 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
The strange thing is that it was fine when I drove it the first half of the day. I parked the car on a slight slope for about 2 hours and when I started to drive it again, it started acting up. Sounds stupid, but can parking on a slope cause this? I wasn't engaged in any gear parked on the slope. The only unusual thing I was not doing since yesterday, was to engage into first just before the car stops at the lights. I find it so easy to engage 1st when doing that. Right now, I even have trouble doing this sort of engagement into 1st. I practically have to jam it hard to get into first. What can be the problem?</TD></TR></TABLE>
oh and about this, next time you park on a hill, put the e-brakes first then put it into gear. then when ready to drive, remove it out of gear the release the e-brakes. you should always use the e-brakes when parking on a incline.
The strange thing is that it was fine when I drove it the first half of the day. I parked the car on a slight slope for about 2 hours and when I started to drive it again, it started acting up. Sounds stupid, but can parking on a slope cause this? I wasn't engaged in any gear parked on the slope. The only unusual thing I was not doing since yesterday, was to engage into first just before the car stops at the lights. I find it so easy to engage 1st when doing that. Right now, I even have trouble doing this sort of engagement into 1st. I practically have to jam it hard to get into first. What can be the problem?</TD></TR></TABLE>
oh and about this, next time you park on a hill, put the e-brakes first then put it into gear. then when ready to drive, remove it out of gear the release the e-brakes. you should always use the e-brakes when parking on a incline.
#6
I'm not getting grindings alot. But due to this notchy shifting, I might be grinding slightly. My grindings are not audible but can be felt in my palm as I shift into the gear. Are these shift forks expensive?
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#10
Re: (garyc17)
Either your MTL is too slippery or the shift fork is bent...
Are you SURE that there wasn't some point before all this that you jammed it into gear...
The LSD won't effect shifting if the clutches are shot in that it will just not work right and eventually it might bind up if it's making metal to metal contact.
It's possible it's the synchro's but I doubt it... synchros will just grind and grind progressively worse...
If it's out of the blue like that then it's most likely damage... like a bent shift fork.
Are you SURE that there wasn't some point before all this that you jammed it into gear...
The LSD won't effect shifting if the clutches are shot in that it will just not work right and eventually it might bind up if it's making metal to metal contact.
It's possible it's the synchro's but I doubt it... synchros will just grind and grind progressively worse...
If it's out of the blue like that then it's most likely damage... like a bent shift fork.
#11
Re: (NonovUrbizniz)
I don't recall jamming it into gear before all this happened. This problem actually started when I left my car at a spray paint shop. The spray painter must have damaged the car. This was because the shifter started to get notchy after I collected my car. Surpisingly it was solved after I changed out my MTF. But it lasted for only 2 weeks till today. How much is it gonna cost me for a bent shift fork? Does the entire gear box have to be opened for replacement? Any pics of a shift fork? I searched and it seems a faulty clutch can cause notchy shifts too.
#12
Re: (garyc17)
http://home.cinci.rr.com/mistab0ne/tranny.html
Great tranny reference.
search and I'm sure there's a how too on shift for replacement... or maybe not...
I wouldn't do it w/o a helms anyway if I were you...
You have to open up the trans.
Great tranny reference.
search and I'm sure there's a how too on shift for replacement... or maybe not...
I wouldn't do it w/o a helms anyway if I were you...
You have to open up the trans.
#13
Is there anyway I can confirm my shift fork is the cause of this problem? Will using a wrong MTF cause this? I am running on Motul 75w90 LSD MTF now. Previously it was on Caltex SAE 90 LSD oil.
Modified by garyc17 at 12:08 PM 8/26/2006
Modified by garyc17 at 12:08 PM 8/26/2006
#14
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Fluid is most likely not the culprit here. Yes, you do have to take the tranny out to replace it. I am almost 100% sure that it is a fork by what you have said and I wouldn't try and fix it yourself if you have never cracked open a tranny. What kind of tranny is this, d,b,h, or what.
#15
Re: (singleslammer)
Its a B tranny. So I can just skip the clutch bleeding and jump straight to conclusion here? What about the new MTF lasting for 2 weeks? Why would a bent fork problem be isolated temporarily with new fluid? But one problem I have always had was downshifting into 2nd. It is always so sticky and sometimes force has to be applied.
#16
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It's not because of the fluid, it was probably getting progressively worse and it was fluke it happened when you changed the fluid. If the slave cylinder is engaging and disengaging correctly then I wouldn't bother bleeding it, but I guess it never hurts.
#17
Re: (singleslammer)
Alright, I'll be bleeding the clutch shortly. If there's no improvement, I'm preparing to send the car in for some gearbox overhaul. I'll be checking my carpet in the car as well for oil and the master cylinder where it attaches to the clutch pedal for leaks. I am getting this squeek sound at the last inch of travel when I depress the clutch. Could it be a cylinder failure symptom?
#18
Okay the bleeding has been done. The problem is still there. No improvement at all. I was thinking of swapping out my master cylinder first. Or should I jump straight and overhaul my gearbox?
I only noticed the fluid coming out of the clutch system being very black.
I only noticed the fluid coming out of the clutch system being very black.
#19
Honda-Tech Member
Re: (garyc17)
The problem is that it could be multiple things, such as a synchro and/or a shift fork. Could even be a sleeve issue. Tranny's are sometimes hard to pin point whats wrong and you just have to take it apart and inspect everything.
The problem going into reverse doesn't really say anything, since most tranny's have a hard time going into reverse sometimes, and you usually need to slip the clutch to get it in.
The problem going into reverse doesn't really say anything, since most tranny's have a hard time going into reverse sometimes, and you usually need to slip the clutch to get it in.
#20
Okay, I just had a chat with a buddy of mine who used to drive an EG Civic. It seems he has deduced it to be a Master cylinder problem. This is because I am having difficulty engaging into almost every gear. If it were a syncro problem, it would only be unable to engage into that specific gear and it would crunch too if it did. I am not getting crunching. Its just hard to get it into most gears on the go. Especially 1st gear at the lights.
#21
Re: (garyc17)
It is possible it's a clutch master... you didn't mention the squeek or the leak.
Frankly I doubt it though...
If the master was leaking it would most likely be all but impossible to shift the car once your foot had been resting with the clutch peddle depressed all the way...
IE if you held the clutch it would gradually get harder and harder to shift (because the fluid is leaking out and slowly releasing the clutch)... if you pumped it repeatedly then held it, it should be a bit easier to shift.
Frankly I doubt it though...
If the master was leaking it would most likely be all but impossible to shift the car once your foot had been resting with the clutch peddle depressed all the way...
IE if you held the clutch it would gradually get harder and harder to shift (because the fluid is leaking out and slowly releasing the clutch)... if you pumped it repeatedly then held it, it should be a bit easier to shift.
#22
Re: Syncro damaged? (garyc17)
I know when my synchros went It started in a couple of gears and just progressed to all gears, its a good grinding noise. In the beginning I too changed my fluid and it did help the problem, thing is it just delayed the inevitable.
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