machine4321

just curious as ill be recirculating the bov any way so no point in spending a ton of money on somthing im not going to hear , right ?

will it hurt power or operation in any way .

ill be maxing out a about 8psi (60-1 or t3/t4) on f20b (11:1)

thanks in advance

TEG777

you should be fine

supercreed2002

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by machine4321 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">just curious as ill be recirculating the bov any way so no point in spending a ton of money on somthing im not going to hear , right ?

will it hurt power or operation in any way .

ill be maxing out a about 8psi (60-1 or t3/t4) on f20b (11:1)

thanks in advance </TD></TR></TABLE>

Why are you going to boost a 11 to 1 CR motor?

...esteban

...cause 11:1 will make more power then say, 10:1, or 9:1...doesnt seem that hard to understand

supercreed2002

I know that, but on a 11 to 1 CR motor, you are a lot more prone to blowing it up. Completely doable, but you better have a good tune.

machine4321

its a budget thing at this point , that and no one makes pistons for my motor ,

guys with f20c and jdm itr havce pulled it off , so ill be conservative with the tune , im gettign way more injector thaen i need just in case

supercreed2002

You can also get a thicker HG or double stack HG....

machine4321

yea . thats the question i have in the other thread , cause i have budget for the HG. just trying to figure out the power difference vs reliability .

supercreed2002

you mean between the higher CR pistons and lower CR pistons? the lower the CR is, the less power you make, but is slightly more relibile

Jay_Sensing

Out of curiosity, why are you going to recirc a bov on a MAP car?

And I owned quite a few DSM's a while ago, if you crush the BOV, it will hold just fine. Left stock they tend to leak a bit at idle and let boost leak in the 15+ psi range on a stock 14b turbo.

machine4321

going for the low key approach, and to be honest i can only take so much bov noise when driving .lol ,

when im on it they sound great , but every day stuff gets on my nerves abit

GaRn

I have a DSM BOV, and it works perfect for me, I like it, I even like the sound.. its not loud unless you really get past 5 inHg, and at boost levels its like a WHOOSH..

I'm not one for loud BOV's, just something cheap that works, and thats what it does..

Jay_Sensing

I agree, it can be annoying but a 1g BOV is quite as hell man, even vented. Definately wouldn't get on your nerves and save you a bit of work.

Joseph Davis

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ...Lost &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">...cause 11:1 will make more power then say, 10:1, or 9:1...doesnt seem that hard to understand</TD></TR></TABLE>


Compressors are rated by the air they will flow, horsepower is a function of the amount of air an engine ingests, and at no time does your static CR dictate how much air the turbo you run will provide.

Is that hard to understand?

supercreed2002

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by J. Davis &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Compressors are rated by the air they will flow, horsepower is a function of the amount of air an engine ingests, and at no time does your static CR dictate how much air the turbo you run will provide.

Is that hard to understand?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Nicely put man...

Boosted Power

I've been working with Nissans, Hondas, Acuras and Mitsus and I've used quite a bit of 1g DSM BOV on some of the set ups.
They held 20psi fine on my bro's last set up. Like someone stated above, they do leak sometimes.
I also used the 1g BOV on my current SR20DET set up that's boosting 12psi. No problems.
I've used them on SOHC and DOHC Hondas pushing 11psi. Works fine.
We don't stick with them long, as we usually only use it to do prototypes of the custom turbo kits, etc.

machine4321

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by J. Davis &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">


Compressors are rated by the air they will flow, horsepower is a function of the amount of air an engine ingests, and at no time does your static CR dictate how much air the turbo you run will provide.

Is that hard to understand?

</TD></TR></TABLE>

i understand what every one is saying (and these are reputable people too )

in my mind the higher comp i though should technicly spin things up faster .
more comp would be more heat and i though heat/energy is what spools the turbine .


id love to do more reading on this if any one has some good links

GaRn

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by machine4321 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

i understand what every one is saying (and these are reputable people too )

in my mind the higher comp i though should technicly spin things up faster .
more comp would be more heat and i though heat/energy is what spools the turbine .


id love to do more reading on this if any one has some good links</TD></TR></TABLE>

Technicially it will, but probably minutely..

the motor will also make more torque off boost, and the whole torque curve will be better..

and back on topic, you said you will be recirculating? why? there is no need to do this, and would probably cause a lean condition at idle/between shifts on any honda with the MAP at the TB..

machine4321

if the dsm is as quiet as everyone say mabye i wont have to rec. it just gets anoying driving in traffic and its all you can hear (few friends cars).

plus im all about the stealth .

i dotn think it will cause a lean condition as the map doesnt read it untill it gets in the manifold anyway so its all accounted for , the dsm are different cause there metered at teh filter so any air that gets lost in the process the ecu doesnt know its gone and the fule isnt adjusted for it .

ScorpioMk

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by GaRn &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> there is no need to do this, and would probably cause a lean condition at idle/between shifts on any honda with the MAP at the TB..</TD></TR></TABLE>


um, how would it cause it to lean? recirculating bov's are for maf cars and its recirculated back in front of the turbo after the maf. if he did the same it would in no way change the a/f. if he made it dump into the actual intake manifold that would be possible but its never done that way.


Marcus

Joseph Davis

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by machine4321 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
in my mind the higher comp i though should technicly spin things up faster .
more comp would be more heat and i though heat/energy is what spools the turbine . </TD></TR></TABLE>

Yes, and no. Or maybe just no.

Heat is all well and good, but it's flow that spools the turbo. Try and spin a turbo with a blowtorch if you don't believe me.

What produces energy in the infernal combustion engine is oxygen reacting with fuel. What we are worried about is airmass. For a given volume at a given pressure, a hotter air charge is less dense, has less mass, and so you make less power off of it. So it doesn't go as far to spool your turbo - there's less exhaust coming out the *** end of the combustion chamber, less flow.

As far as CR itself... you need to lurk the NA forum, or better yet cut right to the holy grail and lurk m24x.zeroforum aka head porter central. You'll quickly find that a higher CR "works" to make more power by creating a greater suction on the intake stroke... you also find out that if you don't go with a wider duration camshaft to accompany that extra CR-related suction you LOSE power because the engine has to do work drawning the piston down before the intake valve opens. At the point of spool, varying CR marginally effects power output (power being neck in neck with airmass flowing through your engine, ASSuming good tuning).

We have peaky high strung engines, and we make it worse by upping the CR. We want turbos to start spinning at a lower rpm than we naturally make any significant power at. You see what we're dealing with? It comes down to displacement (or forced displacement via SC or nitrous) and specific output based on head design (and misc) that spools the turbo more than any other factor.


<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by machine4321 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">id love to do more reading on this if any one has some good links</TD></TR></TABLE>

I'm sending you a link in PM. Copy it, I'm deleting it in 24 hours.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by machine4321 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i dotn think it will cause a lean condition as the map doesnt read it untill it gets in the manifold anyway so its all accounted for </TD></TR></TABLE>

Yup, SD aka speed density systems measure load based on vacuum caused by the throttle plate acting as a restriction. Anything happening elsewhere in the system may change the VE of your setup and cause your car to run wierd without a retune, but a "leaky" recirculating bypass valve (DSM BOV) shouldn't hurt anything. I ran a Bosch bypass valve from a Saab on my CRX, and this incarnation has two crushed DSM units... two DSM units for $50 is cheaper than anything else on the market, work great, and they don't attract ******s. All a loud BOV has ever done that I can tell is let cops know what is up so they can harrass you, and get excited young men wanting to be your new best friend. Uh, sorry, I have zero interest in meeting excited young men.

Maybe you know what I mean.

machine4321

all of what you siad there made perfect sence .

and i totally forgot the sucking/blowing part of the motor , got to wraped up in the *** end

Joseph Davis

I'm an *** man myself.

"C'mere, sweetie!"

GaRn

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ScorpioMk &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">um, how would it cause it to lean? recirculating bov's are for maf cars and its recirculated back in front of the turbo after the maf. if he did the same it would in no way change the a/f. if he made it dump into the actual intake manifold that would be possible but its never done that way.


Marcus</TD></TR></TABLE>

oops, yea I was thinking bass ackwards from my DSM days..