Finest

Most people run with a basic air to air intercooler.

Can an air to water intercooler be daily driven? What's all involved in plumbing up a system like this? I understand how it works basically, but what about the water? Is it circulated? Does the water get hot after driving for a few hours?

Thanx in advance...

whagkangmakulet

anyone? Is there a factory made cars with air/water IC?

rtype11

I know that the Mustang supercharger (vortech) sells an aftercooler, which is basically a/w IC, the only problem is keeping a fresh supply of cold water to it, involving pumps resevoir etc...great for the track, not too sure about streetability.

VTC_CiViC

Makes me wonder if one could adapt a Vortech A/W aftercooler from the Si kit to a turbo. Nice little A/W unit for track use.

Rob03Pro5

hasn't that been done already? I could've sworn I've seen an Si Vortech with an aftercooler on it.. I could be mistaken.

dbman96

That's more or less what he just said...

The Vortech SI kit includes an Air/Water cooler.

A/W are just as streetable as A/A if executed properly - the water circulates to an externally mounted radiator which should theoretically keep the IC water at or nearly at atmospheric temperature. You CAN also ice them down for track use.

D-Man

SiR Kid got one..he's show a pic of it in his last post

Rob03Pro5

Doh! sorry guys.. just woke up.

Arturbo

Some people run the air/water intercooler, which is cheaper than a air/air, on the street but I dont see the point and I'll tell you why.
First of all lets assume your air/air has a 100% effiecency, which it doesnt. That means it will cool the air to 100% the ambient temp. So if the air outside is 75deg, then the IC will cool the intake charge to 75deg. But remember I doubt my air/air has a 100% effiecncy.

Now the air/liquid can cool 100%++ or below ambient temp if the liquid is cool enough. So this means the drag racers use ice water for a run, then change it out every run to have the intake charge the temp below ambient(air temp outside in easy terms) and the temp of the ice water. That is pretty good temp for an intake charge if you ask me. But after everyrun the ice is all melted. Now for the street you need to run a water pump to run the water to and from the air/water IC. But you also need a water cooler, kinda like a radiator when driving on the street. So that means if you are driving around town and you put Ice cold water in the water tank, then it still has to go threw the water cooler/radiator and it will only cool it to the ambient temp. So you have the same cooling capabilites you would with a air/air.
Did I make any sense? If I didnt then on me....

Rememeber KISS....
art

VTC_CiViC

I see what your daying Art, the question is, since we know the A/A doesn't have 100% effeciency (more like 80% I belive), does a A/W even at ambient temp (which a daily driven system would normally be operating at) have a closer to 100% effieciency or no? If not, or it's only like 5% better, then it's probably not worth the expense, of it's 10% or higher, then it may be a viable alternative to the avg. A/A IC.

SiR Kid

Mine is a TRUE water to air intercooler system. Besides all the extra hoses, noisey pump <that can be turned off while not running the car hard>, and higher expense, I LOVE IT!

It is a beyotch to fit all the stuff, but I've never had any leaking issues, or anything.

Here's a few pics.






[Modified by SiR Kid, 3:09 PM 11/20/2001]

dust

SiR Kid and FastNSX, could you give a little more information on your system? I'm considering the A/W route and would like the thoughts of those actually using and A/W system. What are you using for a water tank, or are you using one? Was it much trouble to get the actual intercooler to fit in? any other hints, tips, tricks you can share is greatly appreciated.

Finest

Nice setup SIR Kid. That's a total sleeper. Exactly what I was going for.

Now on to the questions. Where do you keep the water tub/pump? When you drive it on the streets, does the water "heat soak" or get hot? For the radiator, does it cool down the water enough? Sorry for the tons of questions, but I'm considering a stealth setup like yours too. And if it's more efficient, then that's another plus.

Maybe you can hook up a temp probe in the intercooler and measure what your intake temps are. I'm curious if it's better than the typical air/air IC after a few hours on the streets.

SiR Kid

The pump is on the frame rail just under the intercooler.

The tank is an aluminum unit me made to fit where the old resonator box was.

The system total holds about 2.5 gallons of water, and heat soak is not apparent even after VERY spirited driving at 7psi for an hour and a half. I can even turn off the pump if it's getting annoying, or I'm not going to be pushing my car <freeway driving> Base GReddy kits are non intercooled, right?

Best part is, when I do line up to race at something arranged, I can fill up the tank with Ice at the quickie mart around the corner, and no one the wiser, turn off the pump til I'm about to race.... Nice icey water going through the system. 100% efficiency, can we say?!!? If I wanna keep it cool, just turn off the pump and let it sit stagnant, no heat soak. then turn it on a few seconds before the run.

I love it.

The hardest part about installing it all is the hose routing. Period.

Prelussion

I found just the web site you'll should look at, because i was looking for the exact thing, and now i have overcome the problem with the base Greddy kit not coming with a I/C. http://www.autospeed.com/A_0090/P_1/article.html

i'm thinking about finding a core from an old eclipse turbo, and have it custom enclosed in 3mm alumnum sheetmetal and run my water through that, down the bottom of the sheetmetal, down where the resonator used to be, and back up and to a motorcycle radiator to cool the water again. Also the article i just linked to does say that some of the Subaru Legacys did use air-water I/Cs.

shamoo

Jaguar XKR

Lsos

The Typhoon, or whatever that fast Chevy truck was.

SiR Kid

Typhoon <SUV> and the Cyclone <Truck>

92sleepR

Looks like we might have a movement going here

There is a A/W ic turbo B20 teg that a guy on the Endyn board has that is the cleanest setup i have ever eyeballed. The header is an equal length tubular stainless steel design based on a CART type turbo header. It places the turbo to the left of the engine above the transmission.

His compressor outlet is plumbed directly into the IC which is plumbed directly into the throttle body. The total intake track from the compressor to the manifold isn't more than 30". Can you say INSTANT BOOST. Add a properly sized ball bearing turbo and that thing spools at like 1,500 RPM. ZERO LAG!!!!

I'm planning to do the exact same thing to my hybrid hatch. I get a stiffy just thinking about it.

Mike