Dude something has been wrong for awhile...Hello art *waves*

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Jay Dirt &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">what about letting honda guys run aftermarket blocks to make up for the lack of displacement our motors have to the domestics, can you get big bores out of dart blocks or any other companies im not familiar with?


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Yes but at this time for most people 2.2L-2.3L is only availble with off the shelf parts...the 2.3L is on the edge though for most people to build. I we wanted more it would take someone with alot of knowledge to have it custom done.

"That EcoTec build book basically shows how to make an 1100 hp engine"

You ever try to call ytour local GM parts counter about this....I did and this is a total joke! you couldnt build one of there motors unless you defiently know someone!

Howard

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by AR Fab &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">you couldnt build one of there motors unless you defiently know someone!

Howard</TD></TR></TABLE>

Why not just buy one of the six engine and tranny's that the GM team shows up to events with? Crated and ready to go; I am sure that they could spare them

 

OK, time for my 2 cents. Away all weekend, and I'll admit to skimming a lot of this thread. I'm at work after all! I'll just throw out some comments, in no particular order.

NHRA's history has proven that rules and restrictions will NOT take away the advantage of big money, R&D, and testing. If NHRA takes away automatic trannys and limits tires to 26 inches and takes away methanol......and if GM, Darrell ***, Gary Gardella and Kenny Tran still want to win, they will spend the money, do the R&D, do the testing, and come up with another winner. Count on it.

Someone asked what was so different from NHRA rules to NDRA rules; not enough to account for anything.

As to the comments about payoffs, corruption, etc., NHRA's history speaks for itself. Anyone with an ounce of business sense KNOWS that NHRA could never have survived for 52 years, achieved the success they have, gotten a sponsorship with Coca-Cola company, etc. etc. etc.......if they made and enforced rules via corruption and payoffs. It's just nonsense to even talk about.

I think the Hot Rod class will rebound. Just going to take time for people to make the committment. Once Gary and Kenny get the Xtrac figured out, pave the way for the rest of the crowd, I think it will help a lot of Honda racers make the decision to step up.

I gotta go back to work. Just wanted to share some of my thoughts, for what they might be worth.

 

If everyone is racing for the "love" of racing, why not just race in a class you can afford. If you don't have the dough for a $30,000 tranny, find it. Hot Rod is a Pro class, not advanced amateur.

 

How many people do you know that can just scrounge up some money and slap together a NHRA Pro Stock car and campaign it? It is hard and costs a LOT of money. How many people want to see 16 high 9, low 10 sec cars. You wanna try to please 16 racers or a couple thousand fans paying $50 a weekend.

 

Good post lastlaugh...The lack of racers is a little disturbing. But the loudest cheers or gasps from the crowd the whole weekend came from the record setting passes. Sub 10 sec All Motor, Sub 8 sec Pro FWD and low 8 Hot Rod. That's what the croud wants to see. People don't want to watch hotrod cars run in the 9s all day ever if there are 16 cars.

**But there was a huge cheer when a 10s civic ran down the Mopar in eliminations. Everyone loves an underdog.

Changing the rules will not make the class closer. Those with the R&D talent, testing budget and facilities will still win...it's foolish to think otherwise. Thats racing...not just import drag racing. It happens in F1, NASCAR, SCCA, NHRA Powerade, the list goes on. Import drag racing is becoming a legit racing series with some serious support and will start attracting serious sponsors enjoy it.


Modified by rxdave85 at 9:48 PM 4/20/2004

 

theres not a couple thousand fans at nhraimport events. there were a couple thousand fans back in the day at battle of the imports when cars were running 10'S

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SEFIxCivic &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">theres not a couple thousand fans at nhraimport events. there were a couple thousand fans back in the day at battle of the imports when cars were running 10'S</TD></TR></TABLE>

Moroso was mega packed, the grandstands on both sides of the track were filled. That event packed them in for sure.

 

Pro FWD is still in its infancy. Give it a year and I am sure that there will be well over a .5sec seperation between the two classes.. Slowing down cars will not make the industry or the crowd turnout grow any faster. Ask yourself this...Why do so many people come to the domestic NHRA races and not sport compact races? The average race fan doesnt know or care much at all about the internals or the engineering that goes into a top fuel rail. All they care about is the feeling when two nitro methane rails or funny cars hook up and thunder down the track. Now sport compact doesnt exactly have any nitro classes yet so the next step down on the domestic side is Pro Stock. Pro stock is in slow motion after watching the nitro methane guys run so whats to fun to watch about them? They have close races 90% of the time. The first and last qualifyer is seperated by about a tenth and normally 30+ cars show up for 16 spots. The sport compact scene is still relatively new and the fields slim but slowing down other cars in the class not the way to make more people show up the the races and therefore draw bigger sponsors. Now I agree that close races are essential to the excitement of "slow" cars (which relative to top fuel or top alcohol every sport compact car is) so my vote is for a system of rewards for the slower cars in the field.


Modified by 88CRXHybrid at 10:28 PM 4/20/2004

 

As far as Pro-FWD and HR being so close I think its pretty much agreeded that its not a problem with HR. I think its great that HR cars are going so fast. Whats not great is lack of turnout for HR and having one or two teams dominate everbody. The best suggestions I have seen are the REWARDS and weight penalties for displacement. The max displacement for HR is obviously set to cater to the domestic crowd. I dont know of anybody running that type of displacement on a highly boosted 4 cylinder HR Honda. Maybe the K-series but I dont know of anybody succesfully campaining it yet. But I dont believe thats the biggest thing hurting honda. WHERE IS THE HELP FROM THE HONDA CORPORATION? Sure they may given a little help to a few select teams but until they get behind a team like Mopar or GM have, with millions of dollars, R&D, and parts we are going to have to get used to watching domestics get farther and farther ahead.

 

The NHRA isnt going to do anything about the factory teams, they know its unfair to the smaller guys, but they dont give a **** because they are still Domestic at heart. They know nothing about our market, they have these old ***** trying to run the series without accepting any advice from the racers.

Basically "money talks, bullshit walks" and thats how it is. GM, Ford, Chevy, etc are all big time sponsors with the NHRA in their other series so they cant make them look like the loosers. And the way the factories see it is hey were just trying to sell cars, they want to show american muscle over import muscle...

Why does everyone want to race with the NHRA anyways, what cause they have the ******* Wally? The Wally doenst represent the import market in anyway its still a domestic trophy to me...Go race with a series that is going to listen to the racers and make the right changes to each class to keep things competitve......Seacrest Out!!!!!

If you want to beat the NHRA stop going to their events, stop supporting the people who arent doing **** for you guys. Hey if no one races with them they will have to adjust..IF they want to play hardball lets give it to them.....cause if they dont have the numbers(spectators/racers) they lose sponsors and they cant have that hahaha LOL....They care about the sponsers not the racers.....again "money talks, bullshit walks"

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by jinxproof99 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

as far as factory sponsorships.........that was just a matter of time. and now times have changed and unfortunately, honda wants nothing to do with it.....for the most part. if i were a serious "hot rod honda guy", i'd be more upset with the entire honda corporation then i would be at GM/dodge/NHRA.

no offense to anyone here. hondas are still my favorite "sport compact"..lol.</TD></TR></TABLE>

The thing is, Domestics have their roots in drag racing. GM/Dodge were major contributors to the bigger is better era of yester year which is what ultimately evolved into what drag racing is today. Companies such as Honda, Mazda dont share the same backgrounds and or company interests as their domestic counterparts. Even after the import markets large and quick rise to popularity, it still doesnt seem like the the major import manufacturers will be gaining interest any time soon.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Honda Logic &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">.....again "money talks, bullshit walks"</TD></TR></TABLE>

Me and you must think and type alike about the exact same topic. I posted this a couple of weeks ago:

"Rado and Norwood start building a car(withing the legal rules of that time) that is going to make a big step, not only in speed but safety. Mopar, GM, and other billion dollar corparations that are the good ole boys of the NHRA had put big bucks into producing there Pro FWD cars and didnt want that investment to get its *** kicked on the regular.

Money talks, bullshit walks and the NHRA banned Rado's car."

 

I agree everyone likes to see records fall. But the most enjoyable races I have been to were the early races were it seemed everybody was on a more or less even playing field and the Hot Rod, Quick, Pro FWD (NIRA) you could actually relate to. They were cars that were driving on the street just a few yrs ago. I hope that IDRC is succesful with its "grassroots style" style program. I also Hope that the NDRA can keep the big coperate cars out of competition and maybe hope in the future they can come out west.

 

I think we just all need to step it up a bit. Work harder for sponsorships, look beyond where we are for sponsors, and step back and take a look at the GM cars. What is working for them?

Sure GM and Mopar have R&D money....but we have the biggest R&D department in the sport right here. Instead of asking for rule changes, everyone think of ways we can step up and show them who runs this joint.

What can be done to make our cars better?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by old guy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">OK, time for my 2 cents. Away all weekend, and I'll admit to skimming a lot of this thread. I'm at work after all! I'll just throw out some comments, in no particular order.

NHRA's history has proven that rules and restrictions will NOT take away the advantage of big money, R&D, and testing. If NHRA takes away automatic trannys and limits tires to 26 inches and takes away methanol......and if GM, Darrell ***, Gary Gardella and Kenny Tran still want to win, they will spend the money, do the R&D, do the testing, and come up with another winner. Count on it.

Someone asked what was so different from NHRA rules to NDRA rules; not enough to account for anything.

As to the comments about payoffs, corruption, etc., NHRA's history speaks for itself. Anyone with an ounce of business sense KNOWS that NHRA could never have survived for 52 years, achieved the success they have, gotten a sponsorship with Coca-Cola company, etc. etc. etc.......if they made and enforced rules via corruption and payoffs. It's just nonsense to even talk about.

I think the Hot Rod class will rebound. Just going to take time for people to make the committment. Once Gary and Kenny get the Xtrac figured out, pave the way for the rest of the crowd, I think it will help a lot of Honda racers make the decision to step up.

I gotta go back to work. Just wanted to share some of my thoughts, for what they might be worth.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Like Jim says its all about the money if you dont have it your fucked.....No money = no R&D, no testing, no 30K parts.....**** i dont know a team out there that can rent a race track for a month and test the **** out of there car without having to sweat about parts or money. Guys the answer is infront of your face No money=No win

**** and the only reason the NHRA is so successfull is cause there wasnt anywhere else to race back then.....And if the NHRA was is so great why would someone need to creat the IHRA??????? SPonsors like coca cola ****...sounds more like rich white guys helping each other get richer...this has nothing to do with racing.....see as you all can see its all about sponsors($$$).....I said Show me the Money!!!!!!!

 

this suck you guys come on here and cry about this stuff and tell every on to stop going to the nhra races ,the racers in most part are not crying its you internet racer!!! people just have to work harder do some testing and try new things !!!! we are not going to kick gms *** crying !!! all you guy are just going to **** this **** up for the people that will work for the wins you guys need to find a new sport becase all you do is cry about ****

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 4piston &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I think we just all need to step it up a bit. Work harder for sponsorships, look beyond where we are for sponsors, and step back and take a look at the GM cars. What is working for them?

Sure GM and Mopar have R&D money....but we have the biggest R&D department in the sport right here. Instead of asking for rule changes, everyone think of ways we can step up and show them who runs this joint.

What can be done to make our cars better? </TD></TR></TABLE>

Whats working for the GM cars is $$$$. I know you say work harder for sponsorships but you obviously have no idea. You think someone like greddy is going to give you a trailor, car, **** load of R&D, etc.....I doubt it they dont have enough money for that ****...And as for us honda guys having the biggest R&D department i think your wrong. i dont know anyone out there who wouldnt sweat if they blew a motor on the dyno. GM blows a motor on the dyno ohh well grad one of the 3 in their trailer.....I know plenty of guys who dyno the night before and blow up and cant race the next day...Money is what it has come down to, you need it to win....

 

Oh my God , Here we go with the internet racers. First of all I think We all pushed the limits to the honda motors. For about $40,000-50,000 we can build a 8 sec ecotec race car. Its the fact that everyone wants to do it with hondas. You can buy the same **** that Matry and Nelson has from GM and go just as fast. Its not our fault HONDA wont help us. Dude and People will always race with NHRA. dont minpulate people to thinking that NOPI will take all the racers. So if Marty and Nelson decide to run Nopi then what? If GM decides to run all the series than what.???

Whos fault is it that HONDA doesnt want to help us.? Get honda to step up to the plate We spent enought $$$$ on honda in the past 10 years.

Everyone in Sport FWD is crying about JASON and BRIAN... they are not corprate sponsored jason is running 9.80 and brian is at 150mph .... I stop building my Sport Fwd copue becasue of them. And what a joke with a multi-million dollar buget all they got is low 8s... Gary gardella is right behind them with no major sponsors. stop crying and do your homework.. With the amount of time you guys sit on h-t .... i rather not say.

oh and it was $20 with parking to come watch at Moroso. and they was about 20,000 spectators. anmd about 200 entry for car show and race cars. where do you guys come up with $50 and some have good points that i agree with but most of this is BS. 3 years in the making give it a lil more time.

 

4 piston you are right !!!!! we are going pro fwd and have no money but we work hard and i think we will do just fine and you will here no crying from us..

 

good luck to Fabman.. I know you guys can do it. Hope to see you and Leevon out ASAP.

oh and i guess Jesus padilla, Bisi moto, and Bubba built are corporate sponsored.? cus no one can catch them.? why isnt Mopar .4 tenths in front of them?

 

Give it time everyone, as mentioned earlier, this sport compact racing is still in its infant stages. Fabman is right, we all need to keep working hard and maybe Honda may step up. Hey, I've been building my car for almost five years and I stopped looking for sponsors a long time ago. Don't worry, this **** isn't going to die. I'll be damned if this ever ends! Honda for Life!

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by camp1320.com &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

oh and it was $20 with parking to come watch at Moroso. and they was about 20,000 spectators. anmd about 200 entry for car show and race cars. where do you guys come up with $50 </TD></TR></TABLE>

It was $20 each day, $30 for both. Bring your girl or your kid and it adds up. Plus you think your not gonna get thirsty? I said a $50 weekend and thats on the cheap side.

 

No your nit picking. $50 anit **** for you and your girl and parking and drinks. go to a club or a basket ball game and tell me $50 isnt cheap, not to metion its less than 3 hours. NHRA sport compact drag racing is the whole day 8 hours plus you get to see the bikini contest. Not to metion the Gators and water mociscions in the ponds.