dfoxengr

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by asubennett &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
1) I am not a teenager. didnt say u were
2) I have a post bachelors education
3) Next time you see a, as you call them, "retarded" person at the mall or wherever refer to them as such in front of that "retarded" persons family and see what kind of response you get. I promise it won't be nice. like i said. best friends aunt is and they all call her that.

4) Would you have paid $1,000 for head work knowing your intake and exhaust ports were only going to be port matched? Knowing full well that Portflow and Alaniz will do everything that Endyyn did plus for less $.
read this BOWL , SS radii, AND CC work. geezbut then again i started doing my own porting.

5) I never attacked you in any post. I help people out, offer opinions about companies and parts from experience. But I do not come on here to call other people retarded. If you get upset with teenagers on this site perhaps you yourself should stop acting like a sterotypical teenager would act and stop to realize that a lot of teenagers on this site have twice the "know-how" that you or I could ever dream of. i am one of those. not so stereotypical huh.

6) You still have not elaborated on the difference between chamber work and bowl work. I am anxiously awaiting your knowledge on the subject. Seriously/ Not sarcastically. like i said. you know hw to search. do you even know what the bowl is.? seemingly not. and the SS radii? obviously no too.</TD></TR></TABLE>

dfoxengr

see the chininess in the rar. thats the bowl, but i dont think you know that since u compared it to the CC. short radii is the port floor in the bowl area.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by asubennett &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Bowl work vs. chamber work- care to elaborate about what the differences are.

And honestly do you see any port work done to the intake and exhaust runners beyond the port matchching. I don't. </TD></TR></TABLE>

thats because u dont know what the bowl is. i plainly saw it. even with the unlit pics. if the valves were out there would be a much better view.

asubennett

I appreciate it. (your explanation that is)

"I started doing my own porting" That is awesome. I hope you make $ someday employing the skills you have learned. And I also hope you lose your pompous, "I am better than everyone else" attitude. That won't help you accomplish much in dealings with other people. If somebody doesn't know as much as you it doesn't make that person "RETARDED".

You obviously know what you are talking about and have a lot of experience with cylinder heads. However, for future reference, there is a much better way to educate or explain things. And I still stand by what I have said all along. The original amount of $1400 for all of the work done is too much in comparison to the alternatives.

But again I thank you for taking the time to show me the "bowl" and the short radii

turboekcivic

i could have done taht at home... thats a poor job

slofu

cool, then how about a challenge?

let the original poster/purchaser give you the specs of his setup, you port a head to the best of your ability for his setup, send it or take it to the buyer, and do some track and dyno tests to compare them. then, if your work beats Endyn's, the original poster buys your head for the price which he paid Endyn + a fair core charge, and you can charge more to others, perhaps quit your job (if you're not a head porter), and make a shload of $ after we see the timeslips and graphs posted here on h-t. just be sure to run them on the same track and dyno, the same day, same driver, same place, same correction factor, etc.

since Endyn is likely better established as a head porter than are you, and has a good reputation (amongst many) / client base, surely the buyer won't have to worry about selling the head (perhaps to someone who's not seen the test) for what he paid, even if it's clearly inferior, since someone won't have to wait as long to have the work done, and will only have to cover shipping one way.

are you up for it?

b18pwr

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 92 civic VX B18c &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">B18c, CAI, Skunk2 Intake manifold, Skunk2 stage 2 cams, skunk2 valvetrain, DC-sports 4-1 header, Carsound high flow cat, Apex N-1 exhuast, Apex-i VAFC II, Skunk2 chippee p28. Crane ignition,B&M FPR and Gauge, Fluidyne Radiator,Tein SS coil overs, GSR front brakes with brembo slotted and drilled rotors..
186.85whp (Dyno tested 03-06-04)</TD></TR></TABLE>

So the only difference is the port work now? Are you going back to the dyno?
I would like to see if the Endyn port work makes power.

dfoxengr

i do not think i am better than anyone

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by turboekcivic &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i could have done taht at home... thats a poor job</TD></TR></TABLE>
ignorant people. honestly. im sure you have no idea what work was actually done either

StyleTEG

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by hybridvteceg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
ignorant people. honestly. im sure you have no idea what work was actually done either</TD></TR></TABLE>



They probably figure the gains come from polishing the ports, not reshapping the ports.

Yah, anyone can take some wetsand paper to your ports, its not gonna help you though.

Jamez

That looks like good work to me?? I guess the term "port and polish" leads to confusion as there is not a lot of porting and polishing but rather reworking and tweaking.

Yell88CRXsi

I would actually like to see fuckboy try and PnP a head if he thinks it's sooo easy. I bet that, not only does he NOT make more power, but that he does not make any power at all!

riceball777

to me it looks like they did not even port your head
when i got my head ported it looked way different than yours

asubennett

Granted it's not polished that is clear to see.

But beyond a port match to the intake manifold I don't see much material removed at all. Maybe it is just me. But the thickness of the port dividers looks the same as a stock head.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by hybridvteceg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i do not think i am better than anyone


ignorant people. honestly. im sure you have no idea what work was actually done either</TD></TR></TABLE>

Much better term than "retarded" At lease ignorance is something you can control.

dfoxengr

the divider is about 5% of port work./ bowl and ss radii ar like 85%
larry at endyne sayd that knifing the divider is not as good as people say. you want to keep it blunt for the same reason that the dinples are there.and since the WHOLE port want worked, it WASNT TOUCHED.....u must not have read the list of things done to it yet again.

granted THIS IS NOT A FULL RACE JOB
get that through you alls heads. this is their basic job and its 6-700$ that's why the whole port is not worked. every other company has this same option.
you dont "see" any material removed. that really cant prove anything since you cant precisely measure things with your eyes. again you CANNOT see the ss radius in his pics
also i know you didnt notice the work done in the comnbustion chambers. im sure you havent studied heads and all their lines as much as endyne, so i assume you dont see that the creases in the CC are gone.

you are ignorant too.^

asubennett

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by hybridvteceg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">the divider is about 5% of port work./ bowl and ss radii ar like 85%
larry at endyne sayd that knifing the divider is not as good as people say. you want to keep it blunt for the same reason that the dinples are there.and since the WHOLE port want worked, it WASNT TOUCHED.....u must not have read the list of things done to it yet again.

granted THIS IS NOT A FULL RACE JOB
get that through you alls heads. this is their basic job and its 6-700$ that's why the whole port is not worked. every other company has this same option.
you dont "see" any material removed. that really cant prove anything since you cant precisely measure things with your eyes. again you CANNOT see the ss radius in his pics
also i know you didnt notice the work done in the comnbustion chambers. im sure you havent studied heads and all their lines as much as endyne, so i assume you dont see that the creases in the CC are gone.

you are ignorant too.^ </TD></TR></TABLE>

The bolded portion is exactly why everyone on here was so frustrated. He paid twice that initially. SRD has refudned money so now it all works out ok. Why don't you get that through your head Mr. ummmm well I guess I will just call you God. Or Larry's best freind? Because they way you talk about him you would think he was your dad or uncle or best freind. I think the truth is you have just worshipped his website.

Endyyn is great. Endyyn is great. I don't know how many times I have said that already. The only thing in dispute is the amount he paid for the work he recieved. But you have just admitted yourself it is a $600-700 job. So, in contrast to $1400 paid, you can see why we were (pre-refund) justified to question what was done to the head.

92 civic VX B18c

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by b18pwr &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">


So the only difference is the port work now? Are you going back to the dyno?
I would like to see if the Endyn port work makes power. </TD></TR></TABLE> yes as soon as my car s back on the road, I will be taking it to the dyno and seeing if it beats it's old dyno #'s, and as soon as it happens i will post up the results

92 civic VX B18c

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by asubennett &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">


. The only thing in dispute is the amount he paid for the work he recieved. But you have just admitted yourself it is a $600-700 job. So, in contrast to $1400 paid, you can see why we were (pre-refund) justified to question what was done to the head. </TD></TR></TABLE> hold your horses there guy, the actual head work was 6-700$, and the rest of the money for for labor and shop supplies all of witch i have listed in an early post..

sittin on GOLD

iTrader: (1)

For $600-700 you could have gotten a full port and polish job.... i could have cleaned the head up better than that... did you get a flow bench test sheet..??

asubennett

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 92 civic VX B18c &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> hold your horses there guy, the actual head work was 6-700$, and the rest of the money for for labor and shop supplies all of witch i have listed in an early post..</TD></TR></TABLE>

I know what the other $ was for. But if you look at it that way then you paid $700 for your head to be removed and reinstalled with a fresh head gasket. That is insane labor for removing a few cam cap bolts and some head bolts don't you think.

The final price you paid after their refund is a very fair price. 600-700 for the head work and 200-300 for the labor. Pre Refund you were horribly overcharged.

92 civic VX B18c

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by asubennett &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

I know what the other $ was for. But if you look at it that way then you paid $700 for your head to be removed and reinstalled with a fresh head gasket. That is insane labor for removing a few cam cap bolts and some head bolts don't you think.

The final price you paid after their refund is a very fair price. 600-700 for the head work and 200-300 for the labor. Pre Refund you were horribly overcharged. </TD></TR></TABLE> Ok you did see the link to my car before it went to the shop did you? My car was burnt, after the normal stuff that goes along with a normal head replacement I also needed a valve cover, wire cover, valve cover gasket, throttle body and sensors, throttle cable, wires, oh yeah and a valve cover.........

It's funny how you make fun of the other guy for praising endyn so much when basically what your do in bad mouthing SRD...

dfoxengr

you still are not getting hat was done because you have no knowledge of cyl heads. sorry to tell you that.

oh and i charge 300-350 for a headgasket replacement because they are a PITA. not ridiculous at all. add his valve cover theres another 50-75$, all sensors and gaskets is probably 100+, and then whatever else he had done. 1400 was pretty fair in my eyes. thats what labor is all about. you cantdo it, so you pay someone else too. supply and demand sort of.

i dont praise endyne either. they just know their stuff is all. and they have certain methods that others dont utilize. simply stated.
oh and talk to larry or liveforphysics, they are basically geniuses when it comes to motor science, and you would be hard pressed to find a real enthusiast that thinks differently.

SYD

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by StyleTEG &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

So would the job be cheaper if you didn't have to spend 8 hours polishing?

I understand you want your heads to look high quality, but if there is no performance increase and there is a PRICE increase, I could care less what the head looks like. Very few are actually going to see the ports/chamber anyways.</TD></TR></TABLE>

i understand exactly what u mean..but also where fkned is coming from(i think)..though (you) may not care how it looks because your all about the performance aspect..the "common" non educated person, is gonna want it to be "pretty" and "shiny" and if it doesn't look so will automatically think it is a poor job..and we all know "bad news" spreads faster than good, especially in the automotive world..****.. H-T world for that matter ...though performance is most important im sure alot of customers are sold on how nice this and that persons head "looked"
especially web site pics ..without any proven facts on who does a better or even good job...

Fkned

My point is this,improving cyl head flow is all about size and shape,the texture of the ports has a little to do w/the performance but doesn't determine the outcome.If you were to take a stock B16 head and only remove the casting sand in the runners,nothing else,no valve job,size increace,or reshaping allowed.How much would you get in return??Importance of Honda head work goes like this:valve job,bowls,chamber,thinning guides,port matching.For a street Honda port matching is not really nessasary,unless it's way off, since the area already flows more then the rest of the port.
Everybody can say what they want about the head Larry did here but the work looks good to me.I don't agree w/ everything Larry does,as I'm sure Larry and other porters will say the same about me,but thats why there's options out there for you to try,every porter will do things differently and has thier own style of porting.
Everybody needs to chill,for the work he had done to the engine it sounds like he got a fair shake.

b18pwr

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 92 civic VX B18c &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> yes as soon as my car s back on the road, I will be taking it to the dyno and seeing if it beats it's old dyno #'s, and as soon as it happens i will post up the results</TD></TR></TABLE>

There is a lot of smack talking going on in this thread. Your dyno #'s will either put the smack down or verify what i think about "Endyn" . Good luck.

Joseph Davis

I'm siding with hybridvteceg, even though I don't know him at all. (Never dealt with Widmer, either, most likely I never will - this is an honest unbiased post) To paraphrase him, 85% of your gains in a Honda head are from bowl work and SSR, period. Some big name head porters are fanatical about their valve jobs, too, even though they don't like mentioning that as part of their mojo.

With the crappy low lift high duration Sk(J)UNk Stage 1-3 crap cams the Honda aftermarket is flooded with you want a smallish port to keep charge velocity high. Smoothing transitions in that oh so speshul way is where the gains are.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by hybridvteceg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">oh and talk to larry or liveforphysics, they are basically geniuses when it comes to motor science, and you would be hard pressed to find a real enthusiast that thinks differently.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I had a two hour phone conversation with Luke one night... I knew a little about everything we discussed, but he knew four sentences more and a touch more background material. His ICE theory was pretty far advanced beyond mine. I was impressed, second time in my life I've had someone younger than me gap me in knowledge. He's got a lot less ego about it than older dogs like me... or grumpy old Larry. You should hear Luke's list of ppl he looks up to; makes for a nice evening of methodically stalking their post history across every forum you can find them on.

slofu

Luke seems like a cool guy. Larry too. both know their ****, and are always experimenting to learn more. i can't blame Larry, especially at his age, for often being brief with people who ask the same **** he's heard at least a million times, and who argue with him over things which he's experienced, and to which most others have simply given a quick thought before arguing. he's been doing this stuff for ~40 years, and his life depends on it; it's his work, so he has less time than many of us here to BS when it won't make him $, and costs him valuable time. i'm just glad that he, and guys like him are around to help teach people like me. nothing which i've ever gotten from him has been less than top quality for a fair price, and he's only been friendly and helpful on the phone.

i also have to give lots of credit to RLZ, Omni, and Rocket for sharing their knowledge, and to the pgmfi guys for the open-source stuff, etc.; for doing lots of valuable work, and sharing it for free. it's like Linux; helps keep the market competitive/fair.