Hello everyone,

HT has been the only helpful source for me through last year and my build.

Alot of people here have been alot of help, and yes i trouble you again.

The setup is a G23 - in a accord.

Gt 3782 turbo, NEPTUNE, stock map sensor, stock fuel pump, stock fuel regulator, no boost controller and 9 Psi of boost.

PROBLEM:

The behaves crazy by gears but only on VTEC - non vtec it runs happy all the way to red line.

2. hits the limiter kind of at 6000rpm
3. smooth till 4500 or so, VTEc engages then AFR goes crazy jumps from 11-20 and crazy.
4. Car runs through the rpm range but AFR says pig rich on vtec like 9.8

Below is a pick of a the location on the datalog where the problem happens most often.



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Most vitals can be seen in the pic. If you want to have a look at the cal or datalog drop me your email and i will send it to u.

Things we have done to find a solution:

1. Calibrated timing by light
2. The timing belt has been checked
3. Changed fuel regulators - pressure on boost around 3.5-4 bar that is 49-56 psi
4. Vaccum lines are good
5. PCV catch can setup done properly - valve cover vented to atmosphere
6. No wired ignition or fuel corrections on the map - no corrections at all actually
7. Boost control switched off
8. Anti Lag switch off
9. Boost never goes over 9 psi thus stick to stock map for now

Please try to help me. I fail to understand what is wrong.

AND YES everyone says get a TUNE but i dont have a respectable HONDA tuner in my country OR I would get it done.

My only chance or saving grace is your guys here on HT. My whole build has been build by H-T and its members please dont let me down now.

Kind Regards

 

PM'd. Email your cal and datalog files to me and I'll take a look.

 

Muckman sir,

EMAILED

Thank you.

Regards

 

According to your datalog and your gauge window it appears you do not have the wideband setup in Neptune so it cannot log AFR. To do that you want to go to Edit, Preferences, Logging.

 

The wideband band is not connected to the ecu.

Will try to get that done over the weekend.

ANything else you see catching your attention on the map?

Regards

 

are you running a log manifold by chance?

 

The injector duty shows a jump in fuel at the VTEC engagement which it should but I dont know if its enough without AFR. At this point you claim the AFR swings wildly. I cant see the AFR so I'm inferring that its either misfiring at that point or you do not have enough fuel.

I would try a couple things:
1.) Try adding more fuel to the entire high cam fuel map (say 20%) and see what that does for AFR.
2.) Pull timing from the entire hi cam ignition map (say 5*) and see what it does.
3.) Pull the wastegate spring and make a pull with no boost. See if AFR behaves the same. Always tune from a known safe baseline, especially when street tuning.

Other observations:
1.) You have ignition adjustments disabled which means your ignition does not ramp up with RPM (and other ignition trims) so your ignition is basically flat through the entire run at 22~23*. Being flat is not ideal but if you enable it now it will increase you ignition even more which may be too much. I dont know your engine well enough to say what is too much ignition advance.
2.) You need your wideband hooked up to the ECU. AFR is the #1 parameter you are concerned about in a datalog.

 

Sir,

I will add the fuel later when i finish work and bring u the results.

Also What i will do is reduce the ignition in general by 2-3 degree and then enable the ignition corrections.

The car initially ran well all over the board, when the engine had finished break in. I made a few runs and everything was perfect.

When we started to work on the top end of the map, we found the issue. Suspecting it was fuel pressure as it was dropping at time, i replaced the aem fuel regulator with a oem one. Now the pressure is stable but i guess the issue is tuning.

Yes definitely will try to find a way to hook up the wideband to the ecu asap.

Regards

 

Hey sir,

I have considered all the advices you gave above.

Added more fuel about 25% to the whole high map
changed maps to one where all ignition trims are enabled.
Reduced ignition timing on a range of 2-4 degrees on the high map

Problem does not exist off vtec i tested taking it all the way off vtec, i guess that is some kind of a base line for us.

At the point of vtec crossover the afr goes lean 18-20 and the car bogs down, is it possible that just at the point of crossover it needs alot of fuel?

Maybe i should bring the crossover point lower at around 4000rpm, what do u think?

I already emailed u the new cal i used and datalog.

Regards

 

what manifold setup are you using?

 

BMC street h22 manifold.

70mm skunk TB

Stock fuel rail, 780cc low impedance precision injectors.

Regards

 

I'm not able to read data logs the way some others can, however I had a similar experience on a 92 Accord with a h22 swap and 62/62. Problem with that car was the fuel tank had tons of rust which was causing the car to be extra lean when vtec would turn on. Same issue, VTEC off car revs fine. Vtec engaged and it hit a wall near 6000 rpm no matter what we did. Even throwing a set of id2000's didn't change a thing.

Yanking the tank out and sending to be cleaned, changing the fuel sock and filter and running fresh fuel through the system before cranking , allowed us to sort this car out.

Not saying this IS your problem, but it's something to look into.

 

Hey,

Thanks for sharing your experience, Very kind of u.

My car is a 1994, but has seen its days of abuse am sure. I found it lying on the side of the beach so ya that does not say much about it.

I will definitely try to get this done asap. Regardless if its the problem or not, but opening the tank and giving it a good clean with some new lines and filters cant be of harm.

Did you have a oil pressure gauge on the car? what kind of pressure it was running?

Regards

 

The car did not have an oil pressure gauge. We set fuel pressure to 55psi base and tuned from there.

 

Gents,

Hopefully tonight i should have the logs for the Fuel. Finally learnt how to connect the lc1 to neptune.

Though i tried this morning, this time it dint hit me on AFR but it hit boost cut and AFR was ok.

Then i tired again, this time it hit AFR.

If this normal the alternative behavior? I logged the AFR on laptop for the boost cut run if anyone wants to have a look.

Regards

 

Hey everyone,

So i spent some free time at work to redo the fuel maps.

What do u think?

High cam fuel



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Low cam fuel



Regards

 

what turbo manifold are you running? sounds like a backpressure issue, assuming tune is fine.

 

Running a custom made bottom mount by AFI Turbo, bolted on a T3 GT3782 with a A/R of 1.12 Manifold is Twin scroll to a single 45mm precision wastegate

Can you explain by back pressure issue please.

 

Here is a picture of the manifold

 

Here is a picture of the manifold

 

I made a event, log been a long time fighting this. any help??

ymptoms of the problem:

Before you start reading the below, keep in mind that each time, every time the same thing does not happen. It happens on and off, but it happens in the sequence given below

- AFR starts off stable from 1000-3500 rpm @ 12.5 WOT
- AFR starts to bounce 3500-4500 - 11.3-13.2 WOT
- AFR goes super lean @ 20 WOT around 5000 RPM - also Vtec cross over point - this is a fraction of a second but car does bog down badly
- AFR remains bouncy from 5000-7200 rpm around 11.3-13.5 WOT on 8 psi of boost.
- Battery voltage reduces from 13.5 to 12.9 and stable at 12.9
- Injector duty is 26% off vtec - jumps to 40-47% on vtec and is stable
- 1-2-3 have similar symptoms like above - 4th just goes super rich at 9.4 all over the place after vtec crossover
- Tired to removed 2 fuel on 4-5 gear no difference to situation

- Off VTEC the AFR is stable no problems. no issues.

HELP??

 

some checks that i have done so far

Checks already done.
- No dust in fuel
- Changed fuel filter
- Changed injectors from precision 780 low impedance to id 10000 high imp
- Removed resistor box
- Recheck injector wiring
- Tried modifying the map no difference seen in the condition
- Reset Demon
- Reset the wideband
- Checked for exhaust leaks
- Checked for intake leaks
- Checked all ground wires

 

some checks that i have done so far

Checks already done.
- No dust in fuel
- Changed fuel filter
- Changed injectors from precision 780 low impedance to id 10000 high imp
- Removed resistor box
- Recheck injector wiring
- Tried modifying the map no difference seen in the condition
- Reset Demon
- Reset the wideband
- Checked for exhaust leaks
- Checked for intake leaks
- Checked all ground wires

 

hi Honda 12v I am a neptune dealer if you need any help you are more then welcome to email me your map and your full engine specifications i can help you out my friend had the same problem with his car hitting a wall at 6500rpm...

what spark plugs are you running and what spark plug gap are you running?

also my email is siregcivic@gmail.com i will reply alot faster on that i dont come on honda tech that much

 

if your going to email me your maps, also please email me datalogs in 3rd gear from 2500-6000rpms just to start... if your car is going dangerously lean let off the throttle and send the datalog and let me know how lean its going...

I personally have had problems logging my wideband into my ecu so i use an innovative mtxl where i can datalog my wideband through usb input and neptune will log it directly into the software.. it works bitchen, the afr is exactly on the computer as it is on the gauge