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I have started the alignment. For the supplies, I picked up some sand bags to simulate my weight (no I'm not 100 pounds, im a lot heaver, but these will have to do for now -__-), some concrete blocks to raise the car off the ground, and some lineoleoum tiles to use as "toe plates" lol.
That stuff was left over from alignments that I did to my RSX in the past:
With the ride height adjusted to appx 5 inches all around from the ground to the Jack tabs, I tightened up my coilovers and lifted the car up onto the blocks and "toe plates" lol.
And then I began the typical sequence for alignment on a hunter rack, but with the blocks and "toe plates" instead.
1.) rear camber
2.) rear toe
3.) front camber
4.) front toe.
So far, the only step I have done is my rear camber-- which I set to negative one degree on both sides.
The setup consists of a plum Bob hanging next to the face of the wheel. Measure the distance from the top of the string to the top of the wheel, and measure the distance from the bottom of the string to the bottom of the wheel.
By subtracting the shorter value (hopefully the length between the string and the bottom off he wheel) from the longer value (assumedly, the distance at the top of the wheel), you can get one side of a right triangle.
The hypotenuse of the right triangle ends up being your wheel face diameter and you use trig to calculate the camber angle.
Here is a screenshot and a pic of some calcs for the rear, driver side:
For the rear, pass side I did the same. To get a rough validation, I used the accelerometer in my cell phone and an angle finder app:
If the angle reading comes to about 89 With the phone next to the wheel's face, then the trig is approximately correct. Both values should be about right For the alignment to mean anything in the end, given the inaccuracy in my "instruments" lol.
Alright people, so I've been working away at the car pretty steady and I haven't had time to update this thread.
With that being said, let's get to it.
Since I last posted I finished my alignment. Better yet, I actually got the car on the ground and I took it for a spin.
Check it out...
Here's the remaining steps for my alignment-- when we last left off I was doing rear camber. Next on the list was toe, then front camber, then front toe.
Knowing the track width for the eg civic, I assumed that it was the same for the ej2 with the integra suspension. I could be wrong here, but it's the best I could do given I am running something custom. If you all have any tips, let me know.
Here's me stringing up the car with Jack stands. Knowing the track width of the rear of the car and the front of the car, I can measure from the wheel hubs to the string and set the Jack stands closer or further away from the front and rear to get a geometric center for the car:
After setting the rear toe, I torqued all of the bolts in the rear of the car for the LCA's and RTA's and then I moved to the front to adjust camber.
Lastly, I stringed up the car again, and proceeded to prepare for my front toe adjustment. To keep the wheel straight, I tied it with string to the seat mounts. You can use a hockey stick, suspended from door to door and tie the steering wheel to that, but my garage is too small.
Note the 100 pounds of sand:
And finally, she was ready to go on the ground. Unluckily, however, it was snowing when I woke up the next day, thus preventing me from taking my civic out with slicks > : (
After THAT day, I went to work, got home, and went straight to the garage to take her for a spin!
The eibach springs are super stiff, but the konis are well valved. The car is quick and responsive, but it still handles bumps well. It is also smooth and comfortable, as a well-set-up street/track car should be. Keep in mind, it's smooth for a car with stiff suspension.
This won't out-ride your grand mom's Lexus, kids.
Anyway, that's all I have for now.
I will be readjusting ride height and checking various arms and bolts for loosening for a little before she is ready for inspection.
I also ordered some NT-05's for a crackhead deal from DiscountTire.com...but you guys will have to wait to see that.
If you need to calculate the track width don't forget to take the wheels into account. The factory specifications are valid for +45 offset wheels, so for example using +35 wheels increases track width by (45-35)x2 = 20 mm. You probably did this but I thought I might add it, just in case.
If you need to calculate the track width don't forget to take the wheels into account. The factory specifications are valid for +45 offset wheels, so for example using +35 wheels increases track width by (45-35)x2 = 20 mm. You probably did this but I thought I might add it, just in case.
No question is a stupid one. Thanks for the suggestion bud.
This is actually something people need to take into account. I'm using the same wheels front and rear.
That means that it changes the overall track width of the car (assuming different width or offset), but as long as they are the same wheel front and rear, that's all that I care.
I measure from the string to the center of the wheel. So if they are the same wheel in the front in rear, the difference in track width between the front and rear will not change overall.
The track widths on their own will change, but I am looking more specifically at the difference between the rear and front.
[(front track width) - (rear track width)]/2 = (difference between distance from the string to the center of the wheel in the front and Distance from the string to the center of the wheel in the rear)
Assuming the eg civic has the same track width (and this is where it gets sketchy, because I'm using integra type r stuff):
58.1" - 57.7" = 0.4"
0.4" / 2 = 0.2"
So, I will have to be 0.2" further from the string in the rear than I am up front I'm order To have a geometric center for the car (approximately).
3/16" is closer to 0.2" than 4/16" is, so I went with 3/16".
It's hard to be as precise as I was in my parents' driveway. The house I rent with my roommate has a very small garage and it makes it difficult to have space to move around and take measurements and make adjustments.
I want to readjust ride height and align again at some point...just dreading the task.
So today I decided to adjust my ride height and check my front camber with more accurate methods. So, I grabbed a fine, small, metal ruler that I found and I headed home to Chelsea.
When I got home, I saw something I didn't suspect-- my Nitto NT-05's arrived at my door!!!
I took them inside, grabbed some food, then I got the car up on blocks again and began to check ride height.
The new ruler was really helpful. It was too short to measure from the Jack tab to the ground with the car on blocks, so I cleaned the ground beneath the car and used a 2x4 as a reference point.
For reference, the wood was 37 mm high:
With that being known, I put weight in the driver seat to simulate my body weight...I don't weigh 100 pounds, but I figure a bunch of brake rotors, beer, and a rear trailing arm would help add some weight!
Then I took the measurements:
FD: 130 mm from wood to Jack tab
FP: 137 mm
RD: 152 mm
RP: 152 mm
So, I decided to raise the front driver side, remeasure, and start adjusting camber.
This time, I was able to take the stair off of my garage door and use that to elevate the Jack stand above the wheel height. I didn't have to use a bunch of random pieces of wood and tile, and it was much easier.
However, a regular camber gauge would help a lot:
Finally, after adjusting camber to -3 up front and adjusting ride height, I put some loctite on my camber bolts and called it a day.
I will be adjusting toe again when I get done mounting my tires....but time was limited tonight as I am going back to my parents house for the weekend and have to pack-- in addition to aligning a civic and putting tires in my work hatch (her name is arcie):
After I get my Nitto tires mounted, I will adjust toe on the civic, loosen my ebrake a tad (since the rear is dragging a bit), and then I will get my hawk pads.
One day I'll get my coupe back to life. Until then, thanks for the inspiration!
That's awesome to hear man. I didn't expect this much positive feedback on the build honestly. Most people don't appreciate a purpose-built car without flashy power adders or body mods or expensive wheels.
Even then, they don't like to see "track day cars" they like to see "race cars" with cages and huge, wide tires, and swaps.
this is kinda similar to my build
but my drive train is still stooockkk
Same here man. D15b7
sweet sweet oversteer
So I got the tires mounted and they're really, really sticky. Probably as good as my R6/R7 slicks when they're warm (I haven't heated them up yet, as I've only autocrossed on them). Here are the old slicks sitting on my friend's shop floor:
And here's my friend mounting the Nittos:
Even with Nittos, I knew the car would still rub in the rear.
Having used an Eastwood Fender Roller before, I know that they're not of the greatest quality. All of my friends said, "but bro, that's the name brand." And I said, okay, then why was I able to strip the weld-on nut when tightening the wheel that swivels on the arm?
With that being said, I decided to go on eBay and look at good old Chinese stuff for sale. I found this beauty for $50 shipped and the Eastwood one was ~$125 shipped IIRC:
While under the wheel wells, I noticed some rust beginning to form in various spots. So, I took action to stop the rust and to protect the sheet metal-- but I did not do any body work to make it look pretty-- just preventive, functional stuff. Here's the driver's side repair:
And after rolling, here's what the driver's side, rear fender looked like:
The passenger side rust was a bit worse. It was beginning to eat at the QP and not just the wheel well:
So, I ground down as much of the rust as possible...even though it had to leave a hole in between the wheel well sheet metal and the QP sheet metal, but I then cleaned it off with solvent and sprayed it with some paint I had laying around...I really gobbed it on, so hopefully it stays:
For reference, here's how I started the rolling on my fenders:
Because of the range of adjustability on the fender roller, I was afraid that if I went straight to rolling this lip, that I would just end up pushing the fender out, rather than rolling this lip in.
So, I took a wrench, and crimped back the lip in various spots along the length of the wheel well arch before actually rolling.
From the outside it looks great, as you can see from the rear, driver-side pic. Here's what it looks like from the inside:
A couple nights after, my friend came over with his 95 OBD 1 M3. He wanted me to touch up some wiring in his engine bay that a rat chew through, so I fixed it all up.
***Sidenote: funny thing about soldering BMW to my Chinese wires is that the BMW wires had a film on the copper-- I had to sand them before they soldered properly to the Chinese wires.***
Before we did that to his car though, we took the Civic for a drive. It was my first time giving it some muscle on exit ramps and around corners. OMG, this thing can hook! It corners incredibly flat, drives incredibly smooth, and you really have to mash the pedal like a mad man to get any appreciable speed hahah-- what a blast.
I thought it wouldn't be as good because of the sluggish steering ratio-- but man was I wrong.
When I got home and finished helping my friend, I pulled her in the garage, had a couple of beers, and went on the internet to source my next parts:
I went with HP Plus pads because the DTC 60's that my friend recommended are used on his H2 Integra with a B16 swap, Toyo RR's, and a full cage with no interior. I highly doubt I will need that aggressive of a compound for a street car.
I went with the ATE Blue because my other friend is a NASA instructor and he said that for the price, it's the best pedal modulation you'll get...If you want better, he said to go with Castrol SRF, which is baller stuff.
Currently, I'm also working on sourcing an Integra steering rack. Apparently, to get it to fit this chassis, all I need to do is grind a bracket LOL. Gotta love Hondas.
You said you didn't like losing to 2.0 civics, so you bought a 1.5 civic instead of upgrading your current car?
You missed the point of this car's inception if that's all you got from my intro.
Go back and read through the build thread. Point is less weight, less money on consumeables, less power to cover up for driver error, better learning opportunity as a result.
Plus I want to run Honda challenge eventually and I need to get in one of the chassis that are popular for the class I want to run in.
Power never was and never will be the end-all-be-all. Power is far from the most important thing when you're just getting into DE's like me.
Also, keep in mind, I am coming from autocross where people switch from mustangs, evos, sti's, and other powerful car's to get miatas....
Does that make sense when power comparisons are brought into the equation? No.
Does it make sense when you compare the cars and what the driver wants out of them? Absolutely.
My brother has a brand new gt350 that he will be taking to the track with me this season.
I'm sure if I get tired of not having a lot of power, I'll jump in that or I'll take the daily (rsx type s with intake and exhaust) and romp on some people
I did the steering rack swap on my 95 dx heres my 0.02$
you need the u joint and the 'weather seal' that goes around the rack input shaft from any integra they are all the same ls gs gsr itr w/e 15$ from junkyard
you need to bend the oem lines and delete one the new rack only has 2 lines
you need flare nut wrenches to remove the old crusty lines 6$ from china central
i couldn't remove the old tie rod ends from the rack without breaking **** 40$ for greaseable ones from rock auto shipped also 7$ grease gun from china central
oem fluid is 6$ a bottle from the dealer you need 3 if you dont spill it or have leaks i bought 6 and flushed the fluid after a week and have 2 left for leaks when it starts leaking because the ****** is almost as old as i am
180$ from who gives a %&$@ auto parts for the rack they accepted my EG rack as core
replace anything that is broken
works just like stock but better
if you plan on doing motor mounts or servicing rear mount or doing poly bushings now is the time the sub frame is a bitch to take out and put on and the rear mount is kinda buried
egay urethane mount inserts + 2 auto parts store motor mounts $80 no more engine slop
Power never was and never will be the end-all-be-all. Power is far from the most important thing when you're just getting into DE's like me.
Also, keep in mind, I am coming from autocross where people switch from mustangs, evos, sti's, and other powerful car's to get miatas....
Does that make sense when power comparisons are brought into the equation? No.
Does it make sense when you compare the cars and what the driver wants out of them? Absolutely.
QFT
When trying out, for example, an electronics-rich Evo, and then switching to my bare-bones Civic, I never feel the urge to upgrade cars. I like getting to drive the car myself. This means without a bunch of power steering, traction control, ABS, twin clutch/paddle 2-pedal trannies, etc. getting in the way.
All that, even if in the end, it translates to slower lap times. The little Civic always brings a smile to my face. I don't recall ever owning or driving any other car that ever did this. And as an added bonus, it is waaay cheaper to run.
The day I will decide to get rid of the Civic, it will most likely be because I no longer have the time to work on a 20+ year old car and I will need to have something that is newer/more reliable. Not because I think it is too slow.
I did the steering rack swap on my 95 dx heres my 0.02$
you need the u joint and the 'weather seal' that goes around the rack input shaft from any integra they are all the same ls gs gsr itr w/e 15$ from junkyard
you need to bend the oem lines and delete one the new rack only has 2 lines
you need flare nut wrenches to remove the old crusty lines 6$ from china central
i couldn't remove the old tie rod ends from the rack without breaking **** 40$ for greaseable ones from rock auto shipped also 7$ grease gun from china central
oem fluid is 6$ a bottle from the dealer you need 3 if you dont spill it or have leaks i bought 6 and flushed the fluid after a week and have 2 left for leaks when it starts leaking because the ****** is almost as old as i am
180$ from who gives a %&$@ auto parts for the rack they accepted my EG rack as core
replace anything that is broken
works just like stock but better
if you plan on doing motor mounts or servicing rear mount or doing poly bushings now is the time the sub frame is a bitch to take out and put on and the rear mount is kinda buried
egay urethane mount inserts + 2 auto parts store motor mounts $80 no more engine slop
did you do the rotors with your brake pads?
My plan was to plug the holes for the valve located in an upright position within the rack. Fill it with fluid, plug the holes, be good to go.
Then I was going to take the lines that come from the rack piston side of things and loop and vent THOSE lines. It's based on an article I read a little while back for the swap.
However, after reading the amount of work involved, I may leave it all alone for this season and just deal. It'll be good to learn how to shuffle steer anyway, lol.
Yes, I did buy Centric Premiums all around. They're blanks. I used them on my RSX and am still using them for daily duty and they have yet to crack or warp. Love them.
also look at this thread
The Definitive D15B7 / A6 / ZC Cam Post - D-series.org
i bought the cam this morning and have the rockers from the crx as well
Hmmm...how much more power? Never knew about this.
All that, even if in the end, it translates to slower lap times. The little Civic always brings a smile to my face. I don't recall ever owning or driving any other car that ever did this. And as an added bonus, it is waaay cheaper to run.
Yeah, I get people who really value power-- because trust me, I love to go fast.
But it's not about power for me in the end. I just think it's slightly short-sighted to read a whole thread about a car meant to be cheap and fun and then come to the end and make a comment like, "bro, why not more power?"
Maybe I'm just being butt-hurt and taking it the wrong way but whatevs. We're all adults here and are supposed to be able to discuss differences.
However, I'm glad you and I agree on the same things! Fun, reliable, cheap track day cars.
Im thinking ill do (z6 bottom end, b7 or y7 head, oem crank) all gone through the machine shop eagle rods vitara pistons junkyard turbo p28 ecu bisimoto cam
tune for as much power as the clutch and tires can handle
Im thinking ill do (z6 bottom end, b7 or y7 head, oem crank) all gone through the machine shop eagle rods vitara pistons junkyard turbo p28 ecu bisimoto cam
tune for as much power as the clutch and tires can handle
Lol, holy ****, we have two ends of the spectrum in this thread-- those who dgaf about power and those who are crafty with adding power. Kudos to you Hahah.
I don't think I'm going to do anything with this engine. Eventually, whether I sell this and buy a fully prepped honda challenge car, I will be running a stock b16a2 with intake, exhaust, and probs type r cams with dual oem valve springs.
Raise the rev limit to 9800, give it a tune, and I should be good.
I may be wrong on that rev limit, so don't quote me, but my one friend runs his integra at that power level and with that setup and it sounds beastly....plus he's fast as **** on the track.
Hahah, true sir. I just want the b16. Common setup, stock internals, high revving N/A monster, sounds sexy, simpler to do (in terms of work required vs all you suggested).
Hahah, true sir. I just want the b16. Common setup, stock internals, high revving N/A monster, sounds sexy, simpler to do (in terms of work required vs all you suggested).
Theres pros and cons to everythint, I suppose.
If I was going to do engine swap stock for stock would do b20z no brainer
If I was going to do engine swap stock for stock would do b20z no brainer
Yeah, there is this local guy who has a B20z with stock internals (only upgraded cams and valvetrain), and he eats my car for lunch on the straightaways (and I have a B18C Type-R). If/when my engine blows up, I plan to keep the tranny and go B20z with the same kind of upgrades. That + the valvetrain upgrades will cost the same as another Type-R engine, be quicker and the replacement engines will be way cheaper.
For a track car, there is no need to swap heads and do all the shenanigans to upgrade to VTEC.
02-09-2016, 05:21 PM
Re: EJ2 Civic Track Rat Build
