ek44

heres my set up:
b20b motor with non-vtec head work done (cams/port+polish/bore tb/intake manifod) with jdm gsr tranny (itr clutch, flywheel, pressure plate, shift-linkage, intermediate shaft, water/oil/fuel pumps, timing belt, b20 head gasket, gsr axles)
* i will not put a vtec head on the motor since i sold my b16 head already. planned to go b20vtec b4 but decided now just b20 with some head work done *
(i would like to stay with oem as possible bcuz of budget but still would like to know the best)
questions:
-whats the best oem ecu for b20b non-vtec? (ls, crv, shipped p28,...etc...?)
-whats the best intake manifold for b20b non-vtec? (original low rise intake manifold, ls, gsr, itr, skunk2, venom, str,...etc...?)
-whats the best head? (ls or stick with the original b20 head)
- what are my choices for decent cams i can use? (if possible, please compare a couple different cams for me to decide on. eg. web cams, skunk2, crower, crane,...etc...?)
- does it matter which one? obd1 or obd2? which one will be better?
- cant think of any more now. been stress out for the past month on my project 1 (b20vtec) and now on project 2 (b20b).

anyone any suggestions?
thank you.



[Modified by ek44, 6:58 AM 10/7/2002]

krazn

well...if you insist on not having vtec...i say just spend a little money on letting ur engine breath easier. i can't tell you what to do cause there are so many options. ill just tell you my plans and if you decide..you can copy me.
since i too am not planning on getting vtec head anymore....this is my future set up. skunk 2 manifold... dc 4-1 headers. 70 mm TB..not sure which brand yet...aem cold air intake...and exhaust...but not sure which one at this moment.
w/ those things breathing your engine...you should feel an instant power gain. cheap and safe bolt ons w/ no worry....cept the worry on ur wallet...hehe. i also plan on geting a lightened fly wheel..even though that has nothing to do w/ breathing...

vtec is overrated i think. i mean...i'm not hating on vtec (i wanted it myself...but i can't find anyone here in the east coast to do the LS/Vtec conversion the correct way)....but....sum ricers out there think it works like turbo or naawwws. you can actually make any head breath easier...it takes work. the great thing about vtec though...is that it lets it breath for longer period of time...and saves you gas while doing it. good luck on you project.


[Modified by krazn, 7:37 AM 10/7/2002]

ek44

thx krazn. much appreciated.
ill get the basic bolt ons (i/h/e) after the motor is complete and my itr flywheel is also balanced and lightened to 11 lbs.
thx and good luck on your future project too!

anyone else with different ideas in mind???
thank you.

MugenGTR

oh yea! yet another b20b non-vtec! I got my b20b awhile ago and everyone keep tellin me to go vtec and i refused! feel better now that there's a lot more of you non-vtec ppl out there. Anyways, if u wanna make power just get the basic bolt on like fpr, injectors, intake, exhaust, headers, programmed ecu, and if you have a lil more money cams and pistons are gonna make MAJOR differances since b20's are low compression and the cams should help out a LOT! lemme know how ur goes. my b20 is still kickin ***!

MugenGTR

oh yea, for REAL power, b20 turbo!

krazn

yeah...b20 turbos should be hot. too bad i dont have 3 grand....
plus my car is my ONLY ride...so i really can't risk playing God with it and messing it up...hehe im' content w/ my LS.

DevinW

Hurray for non-vtec B20's! (DevinW, who will be installing his B20 after Christmas and going NON-VTEC N/A)

I believe there was a lad named HX_Guy who had a B20 non-vtec setup for a while. Had all the bolt-ons (2.5" exhaust I think too), 11.6 CR (methinks), and crower 62404 cams. Made somewhere in the area of 170 hp @ the wheels. With a GSR tranny he did low 13s I believe on slicks. This was in a relatively heavy HX coupe, too!

ek44

..... how well would a oem stock 98 civic hatch DX ecu run on the b20b if compared with crv ecu and ls ecu?
thank you.

JCushing

your forgetting devin that he didnt even have a p+p head and he also hit 150 TQ which is the important thing... as far as ecu use the ls and use the skunk2 mani. cams use either the 403 or 404 crower...

DevinW

JCushing...yes that's true! He wasn't even fully built...I forgot to mention that. I remember reading once about him saying he could probably hit 12s pretty easily with a port and polish

DevinW

Hey ek44,

I have a 96 LS 5spd ecu for sale if you need it. It should work better than a 98 DX ecu....let me know if you're interested, I'll let it go for a good price...

Charlie Moua

iTrader: (3)

Heres what i would do.
*stick with OBD-1(more tunning options)

*get an LS ecu (hondata stage 2 tunning) only works on OBD-1, this will allow you to do full tunning throughout the entire powerband, also take out the rev limit _____________crv ecu is an auto

*get the Skunk2 intake manifold. (haven't heard good things about the JG manifold, venome is over rated and STR is mainly for turbo motors)

*Cams get the CROWER 62403 or for more rev in the higher RPM get the 62404. Both requires you to get aftermarket valve springs, and retainers.(might as well get some over sized valves....) I've heard a lot of good things about WEB cams but they are mainly custom & more expensive.

*B20 head works fine. some good porting & your ready to go.

*get some eagle rods(B20 rods can't take constant reving in the 8.5-9k range, they will but not for long)

*also get some higher compression pistons perhaps JE 10.5:1 or even better Importbuilders custom pistions 11.8:1. If you want to use the full potential of the Crower 62403-4's you will need to get your comp ratio up.
_____________OPTIONAL______________
*****bore out to 85mm damn that would be nice
*headers (JG w/ racing b-pipe , toda, or JDM ITR)
*really light flywheel (toda, jun)
*MSD ingnition for high reving monstor
*slightley bigger injectors
*-*- get a GSR/ITR or z10 block guirdel for added block saftey for high revs.
* good breathing intake and exhust.

with the right drivng variables (driver, temp, slicks) you could easly see low 13.s

krazn

damn charlie...you got his whole car built for him already...haha.

hey charlie...who makes 85mm tb's?


[Modified by krazn, 3:37 PM 10/8/2002]

DevinW

Don't forget the transmission...for N/A apps go with either a GSR, B16 or Type R tranny...LSDs will come in handy as well!

JCushing

i think he meant the bore of the engine should be bored out to 85mm.. and 85mm TB would kill all low end on any 4cyl... a 64mm or 66mm tb would be a better choice..

Charlie Moua

iTrader: (3)

It's all good i would love to see more fast honda on the street laying the smack down on other domestic. The more the better, no need to hate on others racers or hid secrets on tunning/building motors. The only thing i cannot stand is RICER's.

-Well this is the setup that I am currently building up, but lately turbo has been on my mind. I might just run all motor it start out with then get a small turbo and boost around 8-10psi. remember you can still boost with high compression but your limited to the amount of detanation you can prevent=lower boost applications. I would also have to swap out the 62404 with the stock cams.

***I think the largest TB that i've seen on daily driven hondas are 70mm and Importbuilders has them. not sure how much they are though.

Charlie Moua

iTrader: (3)

thanks for pointing that out defintley will play a mojor role in what the times are. I would of loved to coment on it by he wannted info on motor so i stuck on topic. LOL

traction is front wheel drives biggest hurdels in drag racing= transfering 400hp to the asphalt is not easy as doing it with a stock D16..hehe LOL

krazn

yeah...thats wut i thought you meant.... the biggest i've seen is 70 mm tb as well. i've seen it for $319. not bad. i'm saving up for one right now to go w/ my skunk 2 manifold.


[Modified by krazn, 6:59 PM 10/8/2002]

DevinW

Haha, well i guess I went off topic then

I think a limited-slip diff and some nice Z10 bars would help keep that power on the ground...with some nice stiff springs and shocks

And Charlie keep me in mind if you ever go to sell your 62404s

B20B_Eg6

Finally I found some more people that are runninng B20 non-tecs. you guys kick ***. What do you all have done to them and what kind of car are they in. I've had mine in for about 2 months and shes running strong. Not much done to it yet, My set ups a B20B, 94 LS ECU, Skunk manifold , B16 Del Sol stock Exhaust Manifold,BM FPR, and GReddy SP. Best time so far is 15.1 @89mph 2.2 60ft. also had the sohc FPR on at the time that was hurting alot, made a big diference when i got he correct fuel pressure. Just thought I'd post to al my fellow B20 Non-tecs out there, theres not many of use out there so we have to stick together. Let me No your set ups and 1/4 times I'm really curious. peace

JCushing

yeah well its pretty obvious what its in (check sig). just a stock b20b with a skunk2 intake mani and b&m FPR. car didnt run well without the b&m cause it was 10psi too low... im bout to do up a R cai and itr 4-1 headers then prolly jsut drop in some 403 cams from crower. then kinda go from there... i have a heavily ported head in my attic waiting for either a turbo or some nasty all motor cams..

krazn

yes...us non-"vtec yo's" gotta stick together haha. i chose the b18b cause it was cheap. i did kinda regret it at first...but...i started to like my PULL on people. gotta love the torque.... we should coin up a new phrase like.... t0rque y0


[Modified by krazn, 2:18 AM 10/9/2002]

ek44

thx everybody for their input.
keep them coming!

my set up so far:
b20b motor , skunk mani, 403 crower cams, ls ecu-hondata stage 2, gsr tranny, 11 lbs itr balanced and lightened flywheel, itr shift-linkage, itr inter shaft, itr clutch -looking for itr tranny with lsd , custom 2.25" piping or itr's piping, hi-flow cat, z10.
hows this set up? ill let every one know how i did. any more ideas?
my buddy with stock b20z in ek on gsr tranny pulled 15 flat in the 1/4 mile. impressed me.


[Modified by ek44, 5:44 AM 10/9/2002]

DevinW

Well I'm still getting parts for my swap, but so far my setup is:

'99 B20Z
Type R clutch/flywheel
LS intake manifold
B&M FPR (on it's way soon)
Type R AEM CAI
B16 exhaust manifold
Z10 block girdle

I'm looking for a B16 or Type R tranny..also have to get linkage etc (see sig )

When I put the block girdle in, I might also put in some ARP rod bolts...and possibly have the rods shot-peened. My exhaust plans: JDM DC 4-1, 2.5" in/out carsound cat, 2.5" custom exhaust with oval Magnaflow muffler and resonator.

After that it's cam gears, S-AFC, Crower 62404 camns, Crower valvetrain....won't be for a while though I still have to get the engine IN my car...



[Modified by DevinW, 12:57 PM 10/9/2002]

SuperCivic

just thought i'd chime in w/ my setup..


89 Si
99 B20z, Y1 w/ LSD, skunk2 mani, b&m fpr, exedy organic clutch, exedy chromoly fly, iceman intake, stock b16 exhaust manifold to custom 2.25 exhaust..