los1

ok so i been doing ssome homework on h23 vtec before i jump into it and heres what i been able to put together correct me please where ever i am wrong
i am going to be using the following parts
*h23a1 block
- h23 connecting rods
- type s pistons
- h23 crank
- add oil squirters
*(A) heres my first question for the block cylinders can they be machined or rehoned? i ask cuz i read somewhere something about the sleeves being a differnt type of metal.
* for the top end
- vtec head either bluetop or something else im not sure i need to get a head still so any suggestions welcomed
- obd1 wire harness
- ob1 distro
- obd1 ecu
*(B) ? #2 exactly what ecu would i use i read p13 but that they are hard to come buy, also i read something about chipping one and getting a tune i belive it was a p28. so anyone that has some correct info on this and would like to share id appreciate it
*(C) also would i need a jumper for the wireing ? i know rywire has the wiring made but i wanna keep the build at a minimum cost so is rywire a must ?

" i think the biggest issue imma have is the wiring aspect of it"
*as for the tranny any suggestion are also welcome i know lsd forsure but im not too familiar with h so i would like to see if any one can help me out with some tranny stamp numbers or tranny lable or whatever they call it so i can go looking for one
** this set up is most likley going into an ef tho so feel free to imput any info and suggestions


*thanks in advance*

los1

come on guys all these views and no comments ?

ESP.net

It is much easier to purchase the H23A Vtec Blue Top motor from an engine importer for less then a $1000 then piece one together, plus will be more reliable and stronger...

yroachy

You've got 4 thread on this topic now. Have you read any of the info on h23 vtec Frankenstein in the prelude FAQ section. There should be all the info you need there. There is also info on prelude online and prelude power. Search is your friend for this!
As for your list, you need h22 timing gears belt and waterpump, as well has the coolant pipe on the back of the engine for an h22. As for ecu, you should really get a standalone/ hondata but a p13 could run it, just not to it's potential.

BlackCatt

The frm sleeves can be rehoned, need to follow the procedure
outlined in the manual. There is also a thread in the FAQ.

1funryd

Why would you build and H23vtec vs purchase one thats all together ready to go, minus some part swapping to be emissions compliant.

If its 5th gen lude, it should all right up, this motor is OBDII and 5th gens are OBDII.

los1

*well i been doing a lot of research online, goggled everything and been snooping around a prelude forum too the reason i ask so many ?'s is because a lot of stuff people put online is bs, you gotta remember not everyone that has input knows they are talking about. so what i do pre build i look for stuff that keeps coming up and ask a lot of questions. the more an answer comes up the more accurate it will be.
*the reason im am trying to build one rather than buy one is cuz i rather learn the h series rather than have to pay people to fix it for me i work on b and d series and just rebuilt a k so im familiar with it but i wanna learn this h series so mostly its for the experience.
** thanks for the imput i know i ask some noob ?'s but i just wanna know it all lol

oh yeah and i got two complete h23a1 for 200 buck so i figured why not

typemismatch

Because the frank bumps the compression through the roof, which makes it much more powerful. I'm looking to hit the 250-275whp range with mine when I get it together, a blue top won't touch that.

typemismatch

Also need H22 water pump and lower timing gear, basically any of the gears that touch the timing belt have to be from an H22. That being said, you'll want to use the timing tensioner setup from the H23.

You'll also need the water pipe and thermostat housing from an H22.

While the motor is out, remove the balance shafts. Kaizenspeed sells a kit for about $125.

Since you're looking to put this into an EF, you'll be doing an OBD0 -> OBD1 conversion.

I have an OBD1 JDM p13 lying around, but I wouldn't recommend using the p13 except to get it to start and run until you can get a chipped ECU to tune on. Don't be confused, this build requires a tune to be safe. I would recommend a chipped p28 if you are using an aftermarket intake manifold, or you plan on gutting the IAB butterflies out of the stock H22 IM. If you want to use the IABs or knock sensor, a chipped p72 would be the answer.

If you're in need of a chipped ECU and you can't source one, get a hold of Tony from HandCommand, he's pretty much the **** when it comes to chipped ECUs. He's the only guy I'll send ECUs to anymore. He's out of the Twin Cities.

As to honing the block, don't worry about it unless there are scores in the cylinders. Just have a machine shop clean it up with a plastic brush. There are two reasons for this. First, finding a machine shop that will do it can be a pain. Second, sourcing oversized type-s pistons is getting harder. Honda isn't making them anymore. At least that's what hmo told me. If you need to hone, and you still want to do this build, you can always look at Mahle gold pistons. They're stronger than stock and FRM compatible.

If you still don't have a head, I know of a couple guys that might have an H22 heads lying around. A couple of them were H2b guys and they're parting out, and one is a Prelude guy. You'd have to pay for shipping from Minneapolis area though.

typemismatch

There are a couple guys on here that have quite a bit of frank H motor build experience. Snobordboi and q16racer are two of them, and I'm sure there is at least one more I've talked to, but I'm gapping out who right now.

I'm a nOOb to this build, but I've just recently had mine assembled at the machine shop so I've just done most of the research you're doing now.

los1

thanks for the help *typemismatch* i didnt even know about the timming gears i read a lot of stuff on this and not one of them even mentioned it thats why i ask so many ?'s. what pistons did you run in your set up ? , imma start hunting down the h22 parts i need in the mean time imma break the blocks down and take them to the machine shop like i said i have two engines so i can pick and choose the parts that are in better shape. as soon as i get this going ill make a build thread to show progress. thanks everyone that is helping *

snobordboy

To add to what Typemismatch said, a P13 will run a basic frank ok, even with a bit more compression, but if you get beyond that a tuneable ecu is a must. I ran mine last summer on a P13 with a Neo, but only really used the Neo to drop vtec down. This year if I tryed that, my motor wouldn't have even run, due to the cams.

Before my first build, I spent 2-3 months reading and re-reading everything I could find on these motors, everyones build logs, played around with Zeal's compression calculator a ton, and finally ripped into my motors.

I started with a complete H22A, and a shortblock from an H23A1. Used everything H22, except the H23 crank and rods, and used the h23 manual tming tensioner. I deleted balance shafts and oil squirters, and totally went through the whole engine, spending probably 2-3 full weekends at my shop just cleaned and hot-tanking parts. In the end I was very happy with my outcome, until I roasted a piston with nitrous

This year I rebuilt the bottom end the same, but set my ring gaps way higher, to avoid a piston failure like last summer. My head has all new springs and retainers, and Skunk2 Pro1 cams, and so far is doing well. I was going to type-s pistons instead of the H22A pistons, but didn't want to mess with the sleeves at this time, since the type-s pistons I have are oversized.

snobordboy

The way I built my engine, I tryed to keep as close to what Honda did as possible, so I kept the rods matched to the crank they were on, in the same order, and used the block that the pistons came from, and kept the pistons matched to their original bores. Not sure it helped anything, but I felt better about it all. As with other Honda engines, keep the main caps together with the block to be used, to avoid having to line hone them to match.

The easiest method is still going to be to find a complete H22 to build from, or swap the crank and rods into like I did.

los1

yeah thats smart imma start looking for a h22 complete

typemismatch

I used the type-s pistons, I picked up a set dirty cheap through another forum I sometimes go on.

los1

OK thanks and a correction I got a h23a1 complete block and a h23a complete long block to work with the h23a has a bad piston but I got it all for 200 bucks

typemismatch

You only want the crank, rods and maybe the tensioner setup from the H23 blocks. Throw the rest away, well, don't throw it away literally ... those are the only parts you need for the H23V setup.

FYI, there is no physical difference between the H22 and H23 blocks. You just need everything from the H22 to make a VTEC motor. So keep the blocks, they're good spares if/when you blow something up.

snobordboy

Well if one block is in fact an H23A, then it will be a 55mm main block, where the H23A1 will be a 50 mm main block. Those cranks will not interchange.

However.... if the H23A is truely the H23A bluetop, and in good shape aside from 1 "bad piston" and the cylinder walls are ok, just round up a set of H22 pistons, have them put on the H23A1 rods, and use the entire rest of the H23A.

Or, track down a set of type-s pistons either in the bores that you need if the walls are ok, or get an oversize set and have the block bored and honed to match them. Doing this with the H23A rods would allow you to keep a nice compression ratio, while not sticking out of the bore at all, and use the floating wrist pin setup.

los1

now im confused cuz the block stamp shors h23a but the valve cover is not the blue top how do i put up pictures so i can further explain my situation with images ? but yeah the h23a has a bad piston #3 all else looks good

i found a link to a engine supplier that has an example of an engine like the one i got its a 92-96 h23

http://www.japangeneralmotor.com/ind...3a-engine.html

Kane666

theyre both stamped h23a. one has vtec one doesnt. if you want 275whp you will not be getting it doing the build you're trying to do. you need a lot of machining, better pistons than the type s, an aggressive top end build. you need to read that thread. im having someone build my engine and i know all of this. theyre building it so it doesnt die right away. the way youre going itll die.

los1

can i get a link to the thread or wat thread are you talking about?

los1

hey gusy im back at this lol im about to purchases h22 water pump and oil pump today just wanna make sure, i will need them for my set up right ? i dont wanna buy stuff i dont need