blaze the chemi

I am having a problem with my 2000 Si. I have the AEM EMS installed, but when I change everything back to stock (injectors, plugs, everything!) so I can pass emissions, the car doesn't start. I think the wiring harness has been altered in some way. I need a map of some sort to verify if the pinouts have been altered in anyway. It is in the shop of on eof the Moderators here (not mentioning names) is looking at it. He can't figure out what the hell is going. The car runs great with the AEM, but the stock ECU doesn't fire the engine up. Anyone with any knowledge of rewiring with the AEM would be greatly helpful. I have been searching this topic on google and here for an hour or so. Thanks!

blaze the chemi

bump for help

Pioneer162

that really sucks man, that's exactly why mine is wired for quick release, all I have to do is pull the emanage (I know not aem ems, same concept though) and close the factory a/f loop. Same goes for my electronic boost controller. I can switch between turbo and stock real fast if I need.

These little guys save me soo much headache.


I couldn't tell you how your ems is wired up though, who knows what kind of customizations have been made. Have you looked at any of the wiring?

blaze the chemi

I have looked at the wiring. It looks like the B consol wires have been altered, but I haven't followed them at all. The car came with a "blue box", but was not connected. It doesn't say "emanage" on it, but I do think it is a greddy product. Did you have to do any rewiring with your emanage?

Pioneer162

If you could snap some pics it would really help determine how much has been modified, you've only got like a foot worth of harness accessible to work with. Worst comes to worst the most you'll have to do is remove all the custom wiring by matching up the incoming harness wires to those on the ecu plugs, once you're back to factory wiring, your ems should plug n' play, unless it's an older model. And why on gods earth would you want to replace an aem ems with an emanage?!?!

I only cut 3 wires on my harness (obd1), one was the a/f, I connected that to the emanage and from the emanage to the harness. I used identical round male/female plug connectors so I could unhook from emange and hook back up like stock. The other 2 wires I cut were A21 and A22 both were ignition signal, connected those together and hooked them to a single input on the emanage optional ignition harness, and from emanage they go out from the single output on the emanage and are split back into 2 wires for the ecu input. It looks sorta like this.

[signal]====>------[emanage]-------<======[ecu]

I believe your ODB2 ecu runs the ignition wires individually though......I can help you decifer the wiring diagram if you need. You know, tell ya what goes where. Everything else is strictly splice work, and those clips saved so much time, otherwise I would have had to cut every wire, solder together, tape up, etc, etc, etc... with the clips, you simply clip onto the wire. I'll snap some pics when I put in my auto timer and profec signal harness next week. But I think I did all the wiring start to finish in 3 hours......and some of that was taken up because I accidentally cut a wire and soldered it back together. (had to wait for the pen to heat up )

blaze the chemi

Thanks bro. I'll check it out. The reason I have to take the AEM out is because it is not OBD2 compliant. Since I have a 2000 I must have a system that communicates with the OBD. The emanage should not hinder this if I can install it back in with the stock ECU. I hope I don't throw any codes and if I do, I'm sure I'll be able to figure it out. Thanks for your help and I'll keep you posted. I don't have a digital camera or anything. No pics. I plan to convert it back to the AEM once I pass emissions.

Pioneer162

why don't you just unplug the AEM EMS, install the factory ECU, and just disconnect the turbo? You'd be able to pass without a doubt, with the emanage in place you won't throw any codes or anything, and on it's stock map you should be CARB legal, but my guess is you'd have to adjust the fuel maps to make your car run right, unless you're only running 4.5 lbs of boost (that's what the stock emanage is set to)

basically what I'm saying is that, if you use the emanage and retune it, you may fail because of that, but if you just unmount your turbo and plug in your stock ecu you'll be able to pass no problem, but this is assuming you haven't made any compression changes to the motor.

Let me know how it works out. I'm taking mine to get e-checked the day before I pull the motor, so I'll have 2 years before they tell me I can't drive it on the street

Gotta find a truck now.

blaze the chemi

I am trying everything shortly. The shop doesn't feel comfortable with the wiring. I have installed the stock ECU back, but it needs help and I am not sure how to disconnect the turbo. I don't have the stock exhaust mani or downpipe. The compression is the same. The internals are all stock. I have never had to do this because the car was always registered in a county that did not have emission inspections. I am getting the instruction book on the turbo setup so I should be able to see what I can do after reading it. Once I know how to pass it won't be a big prob in the future. Take care.

Pioneer162

What's questionable about the wiring? What is wired to the harness? As far as disconnecting the turbo, a manifold and down pipe will cost you less than the emanage, unless you get a really good deal on it. But to disconnect the turbo, simply unbolt it all, plug up the return line going to the pan, unhook the oil pressure sensor from the oil feed line and reconnect it back to the block, put back on your stock manifold, downpipe, and intake...run the stock ecu and you're all set to pass inspection.

However, if you still want to go the emanage route, that will save you a bunch of laboring under the hood, the stock emanage is set to 4.5 or 5 psi, if you wire that in and make sure the dials and jumpers are on the stock settings, you should be able to do that and still be CARB legal.

So you can do it one way and spend lots of time laboring, you can go the emanage route and straighten out all your wiring while you're at it, or you can just re-tune your AEM EMS to a lower boost setting maybe.

Have you even tried to get it tested yet? If so, knock the boost down some and try again. If you lived in my area, you could just ask the guys at the e-check to pass it. They charged me $100 bucks to pass, all they did was test another car and used my VIN

blaze the chemi

I have had it tested recently. That's how I know the AEM is not OBD2 compliant. The shops around here are stingy about testing another vehicle and using my VIN. I haven't found anyone that would do that. It would save so much hassle and I just don't understand why they can't use the sniffer instead. I'm sure I would pass that way. The harness is rewired in such a way that the stock ECU won't start the car. The CEL comes on initially like it is supposed to then shuts off. The engine cranks over, but doesn't fire. I have a few options that are starting to open up for me as of this morning. I'll let you know what's up.

Pioneer162

doh.....forgot about the ems not being obd2 compliant..... I don't know how they run thier tests there, but here they have to put it on a dyno...cars with RTAWD can't do that because they don't have 4 wheel dynos

How much trouble would it be to straighten out the harness wiring? What is wired into it that makes it all screwy? the EMS should have plugged right into the harness, no wiring required. If you think it's too difficult to get the wiring back to stock, spend a few bucks and get a new harness, or borrow one or something.

It's really hard to tell you what the best option is without seeing the wiring. If it's just the harness that is hacked up, $100 or less and you can have a new unmolestered one, but if there is other customized wiring, like ignition, grounding, or other electronics strung throughout the cockpit, they could be tapped into anything anywhere.......It can be a real bitch to come back and clean up someone else's wiring job. Let me know what you find out.

suspendedHatch

To install the AEM EMS, you have to de-pin one or more of the ignition wires and move them to different slots in the harness and/or add a wire or two. That is because there are slight differences in the ignition wiring between Civics. I was just talking about this to my friend who installs EMS's at a dyno shop in Whittier. Why don't you just take your car back to the shop that installed it or to any EMS shop that is available?

Pioneer162

I thought that was only with older models of AEM EMS, new ones according to thier site, require no modifications to the factory harness.

I guess they weren't very clear about that.....

suspendedHatch

I doubt it. Not to mention that just because they put a new version of the EMS out, all the distributers trash their current supply and get fresh inventory. I know some people have picked up EMSs recently that still had the old old old *** software.

Pioneer162

well I guess I'm glad I steered clear of EMS

just wish I had a 3-step.

.dave

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by suspendedHatch &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">To install the AEM EMS, you have to de-pin one or more of the ignition wires and move them to different slots in the harness and/or add a wire or two. That is because there are slight differences in the ignition wiring between Civics. I was just talking about this to my friend who installs EMS's at a dyno shop in Whittier. Why don't you just take your car back to the shop that installed it or to any EMS shop that is available?</TD></TR></TABLE>

What the **** are you talking about? I have an AEM EMS, I plugged it in, it worked fine. There is no mention of having to rewire/repin connectors on the harness in the instructions either. I bought it in the fall of 2003 also.

blaze the chemi

Well I have gotten the car back from the shop. They just weren't comfortable with the wiring. Great mechanics, just not electronics. Well I have looked at the pins. The B junction of the ECU has been altered. It was altered because of the blue box that comes with the Greddy kit. These pins are MISSING:
B6: IACVP
B7: ES(SOL)-EGR
B8: LS-HLC LSM (CVT trans related)
B13: ICM
B15: IACVN
B17: LS+HLC LSM (A/T CVT Trans related)
B25: SC LSP (CVT Trans related)
I am still looking to where in the heck these pins are going. I have noticed that there are 10 wires being directed into a male/female junction that is green in color near the ECU. I am still trying to match these up with something. I can also tell that my MAP wire is altered. I'm trying to see what is going on with it too. This is just an update. I have the schematics finally for the turbo kit.

.dave

I think (don't quote me I don't have a book or my car around to check) but that green connector goes to the OBD2 scanning port. Hijack that **** so you can pass emissions.

blaze the chemi

I finally have the pins out and will be soldering everything together after dinner here. I found a pin in the wrong consoul. Does the 00 Si have the same wiring schematics as the TEG? The missing pins I mentioned earlier can not be found at all? Even the EGRL in consoul C6 is missing, and it says Civic Only. Anyone know about this. I need the HELMS! Ordering it this week.

blaze the chemi

Success! I have installed the blue box. Soldering is a total ******* bitch down there and I would want my worst enemy to have to do what I just got done. I switched out my 550 cc and put back in the 310cc's that come with the greddy kit. The car starts, BUT, i now throw a code of 65. I'm going to check it out and see what it is. Now I'm off to another problem. Talk about a headache. At least the car starts now. Now to get emissions passed!

Turbogixxer

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by blaze the chemi &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The car starts, BUT, i now throw a code of 65. </TD></TR></TABLE>

65 Secondary oxygen sensor heater

That means your second 02 sensor is bad or missing (not connected).

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by blaze the chemi &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">They just weren't comfortable with the wiring. Great mechanics, just not electronics. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Very understandable. Wiring = time. You can not throw a $500 bill in labor to trace and fix a few wires. I am glad you got it figured out.