pbomers

i can't decide what is best and most cost efficient to do as far as fuel management for my 97 civic. it's obdII right now and when i turbo it i dont' know if i should switch to obdI and use hondata or what. i like Zdyne, but can't imagine swapping to OBD0. i've heard AEM EMS is kinda hard to tune and expensive. i don't really want to do the AFC hack. i guess i'm looking for options more then anything. the main thing i don't like about hondata is that i have to spend so much money to get a version that i can tune myself. any and all ideas are welcome. smc maybe?

THANKS GUYS!

Etylorcen

I'd say find someone who can help you with the aem and get that. The hondata really isnt cost efficient for obd2 cars. Just my 2 cents...The afc hack and a btm can be a good poor mans solution.

pbomers

the problem with EMS is it's almost 1000.00 isn't it? i guess you gotta spend the money to have the good stuff. do i still get to keep all the stock features of a honda ecu like with hondata or does EMS replace the ecucompletely?

symba

I'm no AEM EMS guru, but I can at least tell you that it's a full standalone so it completely replaces your ECU

tygsr

The EMS is more than 1000, more like 1200 or so. BUt, it is well worth the money. THe hondata will end up costing that much if you are obd-2 because you haft to buy and obd-1 ecu, jumper harness, plus the hondata unit itself. In my opinion the EMS is the best way to go for obd-2. IF I were obd-1 I would have gone with HOndata due to the cost efficeny.

Mase

hondata is much easier to tune, hands down, however, if you are looking for something total bad ***, sell a kidney and buy the EMS and a DIY wideband o2 so you can enable the autotune feature EMS has, thats if you are skilled enough to set it up.

shadowdawn

What if you are REALLY interested in tuning a "standalone" yourself but don't want something ridiculous with an insane learning curve that you have to goto school for.... I'm thinking something that will allow you with the directions and internet help provided plug in and get your car at least started within the first hour.... then a matter of learning the little things to get everything "runable" then a little while longer to get the actual tuning done....

I'm obd2 and converting to obd1 is expensive and hondata doesn't seem to know what versions what and prices are going up with all different features blah blah....

Is the ems really HARD to get working/understand/use?? I mean this car is a 100% street car, not looking for full race.... but if the price difference is not all that much I'd rather go with whats easier to setup.... I am more then willing to learn/research when I get whatever unit.

symba

I have a question.......What is it that makes the AEM EMS so hard to get started versus the ease of Hondata? I'm completely clueless to tuning but I've been searching this debate off and on for the past 5 months as I slowly build my custom setup. I want something that I can tune myself once I'm proficient enough..I have a good tuner for the AEM thats local in Orlando. I also have Vaportrail in Tampa to tune Hondata and most of us know the guru he is with that...But eventually, I want to be able to maintain things on my own..That's part of the fun...Burning chips for each tune doesn't bother me..I also will have wideband o2. I'm leaning towards Hondata cause I hear that its easier to tune despite the chip burning.

Sonny

Download the demo software for each system and play around.

You will quickly see why Hondata is the standalone of choice for most people.

Sonny

turbotypeR@SPEC

Apexi Power FC!

GB

I've been wondering the same thing about the EMS vs Hondata ($$ on an OBD-2).

I know many people are turned away from the EMS because it is extremely complicated and allows anything and everything to be adjusted, but what if you don't care about learning everything all at once?

Does anyone know if it have base configurations for the stock engines that you can progressively fine tune at your own leisure (like learning photoshop ) or is it this whole f-ed up mess that stops you completely like using unix for the first time?

_Shadow_

My tuner swears by the PMS system. I'd look into that. I kinda regret getting hondata on my OBD2, I had to convert over to obd1...if I had of been smart I would have gotten the PMS, it even comes with a pocket programmer so you can change everything right there in the car!!!! Ahhh live and learn I guess.

So here is the line up:
Budget racers - AFC hack
OBD1 cars - Hondata
OBD2 cars - PMS (cost effective) Excellent alternative to one below
OBD2 car who wants all the bells and whistles- AEM EMS

blah blah blah

GB

I looked into the PMS and it definitely looks like a good way to avoid buying an ecu and adapter...I'll definitely take a closer look.

It also seems like it is most popular in GA and the southeast. I might ask the company if there are any experienced tuners in SoCal that are familiar with it because that could be a problem...I know a DSM owner who moved from the northeast to this area and he said the DSM shops are few and far between compared to back east.

SiRkid

FOR obd2- AEM OWNZ
unless yoru scared of it..
then you can go hondata but in the long run it will cost the same if not more for a 4b set up cause you need to buy a harness and diff ecu.

tegpilot

I agree, AEM EMS rules....no need to be skerd. Yeh EMS is a true standalone but its no where near as difficult to set-up like a DFI or what people are saying
...the basemaps are all downloadable and set up all the factory parameters already so u should be able to start up and drive your car as if it were stock. They also have maps constantly available that are already set up for mods like turbo, superchargers, etc... yeh u still have to tweak a few things for your car but these maps help out alot-often u only really need to mess with the fuel maps 1st.
Also, all the "add-on" features Hondata offers at additional cost are all included in the AEM and if any more new features are developed they are also downloadable for FREE
I noticed that Hondata charges $300 to get the latest version of its software where AEM just recently released its latest version and includes automapping, anti-lag, and any bug fixes...
I don't wanna rip on Hondata cuz i know lotta guys doin well with it, but I honestly don't see how burning new chips everytime fuel/ignition map changes is "easier"...and its easy "tunability" due to less parameters to adjust will soon catch up and become "limitations"...Of course the AEM has alot of parameters, its replacing the stock ECU, but these often are already set-up off the base maps.
With the AEM all u need is a laptop and knowledge or someone who has it and the forum support is moderated by at least 2-3 AEM engineers who teach and help u out as much as possible along w/ the users whom often solve each others problems...
The price is worth it, ($1200-1300) when u add up all the top Hondata extra stuff u need, it comes close to this price and still has less features....wait a lil while longer until more and more peeps have the AEM dialed in and u'll see some big gains from it
-just my .02 cents


[Modified by tegpilot, 9:53 PM 11/1/2002]

b18bturbo

if anyoen is interested n the obd 2 models i have 2 left selling cheap 1150 shipped.

falcongsr

holy SH#%$^ what part numbers! thats cheap!

(AEM IS INCREASING PRICE!!!)

Carlito Brigante

http://www.carmodifications.com

link ecu.

simple to tune, its plug and play and they even offer you base maps for your setup.

i have one on hold.

b18bturbo

30-1000 30-1001 30-1010 and one for the supra all ecus will be increase by 5 % retial pricing at the end of the week all AEM products are going up in price.

Carlito Brigante

viren can you im me on the price for a 00 si thanks.

1strdtko

Can anyone name one shop with a good reputation who can tune a car with an AEM EMS? I live in Tucson and would be willing to drive to CA.