What does this have to do with forced induction?
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From: Bloomfield Hills, MI, USA
Re: What does this have to do with forced induction? (Tony the Tiger)
damn hell ya thats ****** nice. what kinda IM is that? anyways ya that big fluidyne prolly wouldnt be neccessary either if it wasnt turbo. what are the specs on that beast?
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From: Toronto, ON, Canada
Re: (gldndrgn14)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by gldndrgn14 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">hey tony. whats up? this is henry from the toyota forums. man you go all out on your cars. thats nice. but also got a question for you. if i am building an na engine, plan on doing a 2.2 storker from crower, with itbs, jun 3 cams(probably switch cams back out for stock gsr if turbo, but curious to see how it does), and 12.5 compression. what do you think about running a small turbo afterwards? like lets say a gt25, or even the same 1 as yours. you think running 1 bar boost would be fine with it running around 95 octane with xylene to bump the octane up a bit?
also, the plenum and fuel rail you got from rmr(ross) correct?
forgot, what vacuum log is that?
also, if you have a plenum for itbs, could you do water injection with 1 or 2 injectors and it distribute evenly? instead of having to have 4 injectors in each runner? i would think this would work but not sure.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Hey Henry, nice to see you here. Anyway, 12.5:1 CR is really to high for any kind of boost... To achieve that CR, the pistons would be a dome shaped which is something I wouldn't experiment with boost. And to be switching back to ITR or GSR cams with that compression, the motor would be under-cammed afterwards.
Either way, it would be hell to tune the car. However, I would never discourage someone to try something new
The fuel rail is a rail stock purchased from ATP Turbo... the stuff they sell by the foot. The vacuum log was a piece made by Hayward Performance from a long time ago.. I had it modified so it could be remotely mounted and tapped in a couple more NPT ports for the boost accessories.
Modified by Tony the Tiger at 11:21 PM 10/19/2004
also, the plenum and fuel rail you got from rmr(ross) correct?
forgot, what vacuum log is that?
also, if you have a plenum for itbs, could you do water injection with 1 or 2 injectors and it distribute evenly? instead of having to have 4 injectors in each runner? i would think this would work but not sure.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Hey Henry, nice to see you here. Anyway, 12.5:1 CR is really to high for any kind of boost... To achieve that CR, the pistons would be a dome shaped which is something I wouldn't experiment with boost. And to be switching back to ITR or GSR cams with that compression, the motor would be under-cammed afterwards.
Either way, it would be hell to tune the car. However, I would never discourage someone to try something new
The fuel rail is a rail stock purchased from ATP Turbo... the stuff they sell by the foot. The vacuum log was a piece made by Hayward Performance from a long time ago.. I had it modified so it could be remotely mounted and tapped in a couple more NPT ports for the boost accessories.
Modified by Tony the Tiger at 11:21 PM 10/19/2004
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Re: What does this have to do with forced induction? (donkiman)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by donkiman »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">damn hell ya thats ****** nice. what kinda IM is that? anyways ya that big fluidyne prolly wouldnt be neccessary either if it wasnt turbo. what are the specs on that beast?</TD></TR></TABLE>
It's the 51mm Jenvey ITB's I had when I was NA back the in day... I made a custom enclosure (or manifold) to replace the horns, and had the inlet positioned in the centre of the manifold for better air distribution.
It's the 51mm Jenvey ITB's I had when I was NA back the in day... I made a custom enclosure (or manifold) to replace the horns, and had the inlet positioned in the centre of the manifold for better air distribution.
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Re: (jarelee)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by jarelee »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">sweet set-up, ******* crazy!
did you make your intake plenum yourself? just wondering if you had anymore pics of the intercooler piping attached to the plenum. Thas a trick plenum. Just wondering how you mounted the t/b.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yep, I made the plenum -- it is made out of a 4" Aluminum tube, cut across near the bottom, and welded onto a custom flange (that matches the bolt pattern on the ITB's). The port openings on the flange are machined to have something that is almost like a velocity-stack. Made two caps to cap the both outer ends, and a 2.5" tube in the middle of the manifold as the inlet.
This is a better pics of how the pipe is attached to the plenum. I am planning to make a smoother bend because the 90deg silicon boot I am using now seems too sharp of a turn
did you make your intake plenum yourself? just wondering if you had anymore pics of the intercooler piping attached to the plenum. Thas a trick plenum. Just wondering how you mounted the t/b.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yep, I made the plenum -- it is made out of a 4" Aluminum tube, cut across near the bottom, and welded onto a custom flange (that matches the bolt pattern on the ITB's). The port openings on the flange are machined to have something that is almost like a velocity-stack. Made two caps to cap the both outer ends, and a 2.5" tube in the middle of the manifold as the inlet.
This is a better pics of how the pipe is attached to the plenum. I am planning to make a smoother bend because the 90deg silicon boot I am using now seems too sharp of a turn
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From: Toronto, ON, Canada
Re: (accordfreak)
Too bad I don't have a good welder, and I do not have a big enough garage to have my own welding station.
I basically do all the cutting, fabricating and spot welding, and have a good friend of mine to do the final welding. I have been doing this for all my pipes, exhaust, etc... for the turbo setup. It costs about $50-75 to get all my stuff welded, and it is far better than spending $1000+ on a welder plus equipment/rods/gas
I basically do all the cutting, fabricating and spot welding, and have a good friend of mine to do the final welding. I have been doing this for all my pipes, exhaust, etc... for the turbo setup. It costs about $50-75 to get all my stuff welded, and it is far better than spending $1000+ on a welder plus equipment/rods/gas
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From: My Home Town, USA
Re: What does this have to do with forced induction? (donkiman)
I got off easy, I didn't have to hide anything to hide my turbo. Most of my friends know it is turbo and when I pop the hood to show them my motor, they all pointed at the y8 intake manifold at first saying, "oh there it is (the turbo)" 
These kids aren't into cars though. I showed them the turbo and where it is, now they are all saying "I dont get it"
These kids aren't into cars though. I showed them the turbo and where it is, now they are all saying "I dont get it"
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From: Norcal
Re: What does this have to do with forced induction? (beepy)
dood ive had cops look right at my turbo and not see it , this will further fool alot of cops , which in cali we really have to worry about.
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From: Winnipeg, manitoba, Canada
a huge turbo and low C/R is like putting 10 liters of air in a 1 liter space
a small turbo and high C/R is like puttin 5 liters of air in a 0.5 liter space
the same but different, right?
so if Tony has gained a whole bunch of throttle response, what did he lose? usually when you gain such a good aspect, you lose out on something else. is there a down side?
a small turbo and high C/R is like puttin 5 liters of air in a 0.5 liter space
the same but different, right?
so if Tony has gained a whole bunch of throttle response, what did he lose? usually when you gain such a good aspect, you lose out on something else. is there a down side?
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From: hopped' in a CL9
Re: (z6)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by z6 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">a huge turbo and low C/R is like putting 10 liters of air in a 1 liter space
a small turbo and high C/R is like puttin 5 liters of air in a 0.5 liter space
the same but different, right?
so if Tony has gained a whole bunch of throttle response, what did he lose? usually when you gain such a good aspect, you lose out on something else. is there a down side?</TD></TR></TABLE>
my guess would be that he looses top end... The car looks like it pulls really hard 1-threw-3.. but at the same time all his throttle response is being gained from the faster spool directly at low RPM.. if you look at most BB style turbos they have a very linear power curve.. this is great for traction and out of the hole... but the GT28RS has its limits like anyother turbo.. it is a great turbine but up top is not where this turbo likes too be too much, because the GT28RS will start to fall on its face in 4th gear.. Although Tony's car is a lot diff b/c he has increased comp. and is running various ammounts of other mods that help make up for top-end power and this is why his car keeps making power up-top.. but it wont pull as hard up top if he went with a GT3071 .63 a/r and more lag and more boost, but he would be slower out of the hole with street tires.. Tony didnt want this, instead he made a very fast streetable car.. racing on the street and at the track are two diff. animals, so you can do the math and see why Tony's car is an animal on the street..
My hat goes off to you Tony, that is one fine beast you have engineered there
a small turbo and high C/R is like puttin 5 liters of air in a 0.5 liter space
the same but different, right?
so if Tony has gained a whole bunch of throttle response, what did he lose? usually when you gain such a good aspect, you lose out on something else. is there a down side?</TD></TR></TABLE>
my guess would be that he looses top end... The car looks like it pulls really hard 1-threw-3.. but at the same time all his throttle response is being gained from the faster spool directly at low RPM.. if you look at most BB style turbos they have a very linear power curve.. this is great for traction and out of the hole... but the GT28RS has its limits like anyother turbo.. it is a great turbine but up top is not where this turbo likes too be too much, because the GT28RS will start to fall on its face in 4th gear.. Although Tony's car is a lot diff b/c he has increased comp. and is running various ammounts of other mods that help make up for top-end power and this is why his car keeps making power up-top.. but it wont pull as hard up top if he went with a GT3071 .63 a/r and more lag and more boost, but he would be slower out of the hole with street tires.. Tony didnt want this, instead he made a very fast streetable car.. racing on the street and at the track are two diff. animals, so you can do the math and see why Tony's car is an animal on the street..
My hat goes off to you Tony, that is one fine beast you have engineered there
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Re: (manikgsr)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by manikgsr »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
my guess would be that he looses top end... The car looks like it pulls really hard 1-threw-3.. but at the same time all his throttle response is being gained from the faster spool directly at low RPM.. if you look at most BB style turbos they have a very linear power curve.. this is great for traction and out of the hole... but the GT28RS has its limits like anyother turbo.. it is a great turbine but up top is not where this turbo likes too be too much, because the GT28RS will start to fall on its face in 4th gear.. Although Tony's car is a lot diff b/c he has increased comp. and is running various ammounts of other mods that help make up for top-end power and this is why his car keeps making power up-top.. but it wont pull as hard up top if he went with a GT3071 .63 a/r and more lag and more boost, but he would be slower out of the hole with street tires.. Tony didnt want this, instead he made a very fast streetable car.. racing on the street and at the track are two diff. animals, so you can do the math and see why Tony's car is an animal on the street..
My hat goes off to you Tony, that is one fine beast you have engineered there </TD></TR></TABLE>
Right on, great post in summarizing my setup The GT28RS isn't a high RPM breathing turbo, but when slapped on our high revving Hondas, it does the job well. But because I have so many parts involved in pushing power at a higher RPM, such as the ITR cams, the cam timing, the different injector position, ITB's etc... the power held to 9200RPM pretty well. From my observations, the power should be levelling off at about 8500RPM, but holds it until 9200RPM.
This setup was to achieve between 300-320WHP, but with response and traction. The GT28RS is perfect if it can hold 300 or so WHP up to 9200RPM. Anything larger will juse cause my powerband to be peaky and lose response. My goal is to try to get the response as close to my previous 220-230WHP NA setup, and be able to bang through the gears on the 1-2-3-4 shift. Anything after that I am not interested in. So far, I am pretty happy, except for the crappy gas mileage..lol (420km per tank)
my guess would be that he looses top end... The car looks like it pulls really hard 1-threw-3.. but at the same time all his throttle response is being gained from the faster spool directly at low RPM.. if you look at most BB style turbos they have a very linear power curve.. this is great for traction and out of the hole... but the GT28RS has its limits like anyother turbo.. it is a great turbine but up top is not where this turbo likes too be too much, because the GT28RS will start to fall on its face in 4th gear.. Although Tony's car is a lot diff b/c he has increased comp. and is running various ammounts of other mods that help make up for top-end power and this is why his car keeps making power up-top.. but it wont pull as hard up top if he went with a GT3071 .63 a/r and more lag and more boost, but he would be slower out of the hole with street tires.. Tony didnt want this, instead he made a very fast streetable car.. racing on the street and at the track are two diff. animals, so you can do the math and see why Tony's car is an animal on the street..
My hat goes off to you Tony, that is one fine beast you have engineered there
</TD></TR></TABLE>Right on, great post in summarizing my setup
The GT28RS isn't a high RPM breathing turbo, but when slapped on our high revving Hondas, it does the job well. But because I have so many parts involved in pushing power at a higher RPM, such as the ITR cams, the cam timing, the different injector position, ITB's etc... the power held to 9200RPM pretty well. From my observations, the power should be levelling off at about 8500RPM, but holds it until 9200RPM.This setup was to achieve between 300-320WHP, but with response and traction. The GT28RS is perfect if it can hold 300 or so WHP up to 9200RPM. Anything larger will juse cause my powerband to be peaky and lose response. My goal is to try to get the response as close to my previous 220-230WHP NA setup, and be able to bang through the gears on the 1-2-3-4 shift. Anything after that I am not interested in. So far, I am pretty happy, except for the crappy gas mileage..lol (420km per tank)
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From: Toronto, ON, Canada
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by z6 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">a huge turbo and low C/R is like putting 10 liters of air in a 1 liter space
a small turbo and high C/R is like puttin 5 liters of air in a 0.5 liter space
the same but different, right?
so if Tony has gained a whole bunch of throttle response, what did he lose? usually when you gain such a good aspect, you lose out on something else. is there a down side?</TD></TR></TABLE>
On high compression motors, the only thing you lose is the larger margin for error that you get with low compression and the ability to run lower grade gas; and depending on what your total HP goal is, the amount of total horsepower and torque that can be created will be affected by static compression.
Although you are thinking of airflow and volume inside the chambers, one main benefit with higher compression is more "squish". From this, the engine would actually make more power with the same amount of air and fuel. Often called efficiency or closer to complete combustion.
A lower compression motor will still only get filled whatever space that is inside the cylinders before the compression stroke (when valves open). It is safe to assume that a high compression motor will still be able to fill the same amount of air and fuel into the engine -- given the fact that the cam selection and cam timing are set for higher static compression -- but the only difference is the actual squish.
But with higher compression, the compression stroke/combustion will be less stable (hence requiring higher octane) and more susceptible to weather changes (air temp, etc...)
So whatever turbo you chose, higher compression will automatically make more power everywhere with the same given airflow and fuel. Drawback is much higher chance for detonation and preignition, the need higher octane. Too much compression will lower the ability to pack more boost (and be stable), and it will solely depend on the type of gas you are running.
a small turbo and high C/R is like puttin 5 liters of air in a 0.5 liter space
the same but different, right?
so if Tony has gained a whole bunch of throttle response, what did he lose? usually when you gain such a good aspect, you lose out on something else. is there a down side?</TD></TR></TABLE>
On high compression motors, the only thing you lose is the larger margin for error that you get with low compression and the ability to run lower grade gas; and depending on what your total HP goal is, the amount of total horsepower and torque that can be created will be affected by static compression.
Although you are thinking of airflow and volume inside the chambers, one main benefit with higher compression is more "squish". From this, the engine would actually make more power with the same amount of air and fuel. Often called efficiency or closer to complete combustion.
A lower compression motor will still only get filled whatever space that is inside the cylinders before the compression stroke (when valves open). It is safe to assume that a high compression motor will still be able to fill the same amount of air and fuel into the engine -- given the fact that the cam selection and cam timing are set for higher static compression -- but the only difference is the actual squish.
But with higher compression, the compression stroke/combustion will be less stable (hence requiring higher octane) and more susceptible to weather changes (air temp, etc...)
So whatever turbo you chose, higher compression will automatically make more power everywhere with the same given airflow and fuel. Drawback is much higher chance for detonation and preignition, the need higher octane. Too much compression will lower the ability to pack more boost (and be stable), and it will solely depend on the type of gas you are running.
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Re: What does this have to do with forced induction? (DC2EATER)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by DC2EATER »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">maybe stupid question, but if boosted why is the valve cover breather connected to the upper charge pipe?</TD></TR></TABLE>
