boostlsveg

iTrader: (12)

Hi guys I ditched the pro1s in favor of another set of cams and was wondering which would b better for my setup the kelford 176t or web 35-522 turbo cams. Setup is 84.5x 89 ~9.5-1 gsr with. 6265 .82ar with a top mount. Will mainly b a drag car with some street use. Thanks for any advice! Mike

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

Can't go wrong with either. Kelford 176Ts work well. Other than the GSCs, I'd have gone with them. Web s the standard for a full race camshaft, so its Tomato, Tomaato.

Natural Aspirations

Since when?

boostlsveg

iTrader: (12)

yea I originally ditched the pro1s for the t1s but after I got rid of them i figured I would try to grab something better if I could. I also ditched my pro series springs for the 85lb supertech springs since both of these need them.

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

Kelford 176-Ts are similar to the GSCs. All are good. Its simply a matter of your preference.

turboedc2

any feedback on the 176ts?

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

They've been out for over 10 years. Had about 5 or 6 B-series VTECs with them. They don't come on Honda-tech, with bunch of feedback, but I'm sure you can find them on other sites to find reviews.

It's a camshaft that really, only men get. Meaning, those that don't give a **** about stock idle, have specific needs, and the tuning management to work with them; just like a web or a GSC.

You can actually use a slightly lower seat pressure spring (85lbs) than the GSC with these camshafts, but be ready to change idle timing and allow for a higher rpm idle (1100-1250) with these, just like any other "MAN" camshaft.

I guess here are few areas to see from a quick search.


176-T specifications

The rest is on you to make the comparisons to what you feel is best. When you're coming to this area of change for 600-1000hp, there are no "masses" to follow.

turboedc2

Lol I'm on pro1s now at 700hp just looking for some gains thanks

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

You'll get them, but you're not going to get a dedicated thread like the GSC thread that Myles created 2 years ago.

You'll more than likely have better luck from the dedicated drag racing forum than here.

wantboost

iTrader: (2)

Here's an interesting question.

176Ts or T1s?

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

That's like asking..... Royal Blue, or Navy Blue?

Another thread on reviews
Reviews on Kelford 176-T

V-SPEC 1

Buy both and compare

wantboost

iTrader: (2)

Well at the power level where that type of cam is needed which would be more ideal? Granted each setup is different and different types of driving styles and purposes need different cam profiles obviously.

But just for giggles let's assume a mid 500s 2 liter B VTEC motor, something like 12.5:1 static on E85 with an emphasis on maximum torque production without impacting high rpm power production...

I think we've all seen what the GSC T1s are capable of, at least I know me and TheShodan have, in regards to the kind of midrange torque they produce while making awesome power on a properly tuned setup. How would the 176Ts compare? I haven't been able to find much "concrete" data on the gains the 176Ts make.

If I had the cash or support I would be willing to test both once I get my 2l motor done, I don't see much point in doing a comparison on my 1.8l 10:1 engine unless that's something people would be wanting to see. I have access to multiple dynos locally and once I get this money pit running I would be willing to put in the time and effort to do a proper comparison if I had the spare change laying around.

Maybe something like a 3 way comparison, OEM cams (GSR seem to be the popular go to, not buying ITR/CTR cams unless someone loned them for the test), GSC T1s, and the Kelford 176Ts. It would be best to do it initially with no changes in tuning between the cams to get a sense of "drop in" power even though they aren't exactly "drop in" and then show the differences after re-tuning for each cam profile.

If someone could get me the actual cam card data for the T1s I could do a rudimentary comparison to the 176Ts.

wantboost

iTrader: (2)

Never mind. Found the T1 specs for the high lobe. They are more aggressive than the 176Ts in every aspect. More duration and lift.

GSC T1

288/276 Duration
260/254@1mm Duration
12mm/11.5mm Peak valve lift
109/115 Center line

176T

284/275 Duration
254/246@1mm Duration
11.25mm/11.00mm Peak valve lift
108/115 Centerline

What I really want to see is the data on the primary lobes as your typical street application will spend most of the time on the low cam. I know the T1 profile has fairly aggressive primaries, can't find any feedback on the primaries on the 176T. Anyone know this info?

I wonder if I contacted the respective companies if they would give it out.

extremeracer

They are quite close in specification actually, on paper the GSC's seem to have a slight edge.

turboedc2

How is the wear on Valvetrain On the gsc I see they are billet

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

No additional wear on the flat tappet lifters or the LMAs. I still have hyrdaulic LMAs, they're just new. The wear you're concerned about really can be prevented by proper initial break-in procedure, which is included in the GSC cam card.

You still need to properly break in the camshafts like any other flat tappet system by using proper camshaft lubricant. A good oil additive with ZDDP is a good idea as well. So, all my oil changes are with Brad Penn Oil.

Some people still use Shell Rotella T6 oil, but it still needs a ZDDP additive, for the newer blends that are being produced

I used this on my GSCs: