bsmith100

I have an EK with a b16 and I really like the way it pulls once the vtec kicks in. I don't need a ton of horsepower. What want is to get a linear powerband that where engine pulls like it does when the vtec kicks in, all the time.

From 6k to 8k the engine pulls hard enough for me. Is there a way to get it to pull like that from 2k all the way to the redline?

Which turbo and how much horsepower do I need?

I have heard that many people suggest a T3/T4 .48AR 50 trim. I have also heard that a super 60 is better for a quick spool.

Any other ideas?

HiProfile

An eaton m90 supercharger in a custom case (not set up like a JRSC) would get you ***** from 2k to redline. So far rmcdaniel's kits aren't finished though...

If you think a 50% peak HP increase would be more than enough (~210whp vs ~140whp), a 60trim T3 with a stg1 turbine & .48ar housing will be fine. It will be making a few psi as early as 3k, and still have enough for 250whp at redline. If anyone tells you that "hot side" will suck *****, go research what srt-4 guys use. They go with a 50trim t3/t04e with a stg3/.48ar hotside when they only plan on running 20psi or less, and want 350whp of less.

bsmith100

Yeah I would think that either 210 or 250 wheel horsepower would be more than enough for me. So will the super 60 be making more power than a T3/T4 at lower rpms?

bsmith100

I'm not racing anybody, so I am not that worried about peak horsepower.

Here is what I am trying to avoid. When I am driving along, there will be a minivan, or some other lame car next to me. Sometimes all I want is to pull away from them so they won't be driving in my blind spot, or they won't try to get ahead of me and cut me off.

The problem is that I don't really pull away from them until the vtec kicks in.

So that's why I want the extra wide powerband, so I can pull away from losers who drive overly aggressively in low quality vehicles.

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

No. but it will make a bit more torque at a lower rpm level than most larger mid-framed hybrids. However, that torque will ONLY be at the lower rpm. once higher hp comes in, that advantage will then be lost. So you gain torque, but you loose midrange to upper-rpm power.

civhatch90

How about downshifting?

Also, wth is a low quality vehicle?

JdMtR

get a little baby trubo. shell work fine for what you want it to do!!

bsmith100

When I said a low quality vehicle I was referring to your typical minivan or rental car. If I am next to them and in 1st gear, and they have it floored, I won't really pull away from them until the vtec kicks in.

I would like to be able to pull away from them without having to rev it that high. There are times when shifting into a lower gear isn't really an option. Lets say I leisurely roll across an intersection after the light turns green. I shift into second, and then I notice a taxi flying up alongside me and I know he wants to cut me off.

I only have two choices here.

1) I can shift into 1st again, except then I lose drive for the 1/2 second it takes to shift, plus then I will have to shift into 2nd gear again fairly soon.

Or

2) I can leave it in second and wait for the vtec to kick in.

In either case I am at a bit of a disadvantage because of the narrow powerband.

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

It's not just a narrow powerband. you really don't want it to kick in that early on a FWD application. you'll just spin the tires that way, then look like a weirdo when you're screeching tires trying to pass a minivan on the street to get in front of them to another corner. You also have to remember that you are a 1.6 litre. VTEC or no, even a big engine'd minivan will take you off the line from the displacement of the car.

Do as you will, but you won't get the best of two worlds without sacrificing SOME characteristics.

bsmith100

I know, I know...

So would you say that it's better to concentrate on adding the boost on the middle and upper rpms instead?

The minivan will still toast me off the line, except then I will come screaming by him sooner once the boost kicks in.

Would you suggest the popular t3/t4 .48AR 50 trim turbo?

Then if decide I would like quicker spool I could switch to a ball bearing turbo.

Glove

for what you want outa your car, try

switching to ITR cams and giving it a bunch of timing.
supercharger,
b20vtec swap,
t28 turbo,


in that order.

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

Heh. just "switching" to a ball-bearing turbo will still give you the same problems if you choose the wrong one. Which turbocharger do you currently have? Is it still within the power level that you want?

bsmith100

I don't have a turbo yet. I am trying to decide which one to get. I saw that the GT2871 ball bearing turbo is also availabe in the T3 housing, so I was thinking that if I got a T3/T4 or a super 60 and I still wanted quicker spool, then I could always switch to the ball bearing turbo. I saw one store that advertised certain turbos as "drop-in" units. So would that mean I could basically just switch with another turbo that has the same housing?

I don't need that much power. I only want about 200 horsepower, but I want it as early as I can get it. My engine is stock, so it probably only gets 140 horsepower at the wheels (it hasn't been dyno'ed). If I could get that 140 horsepower from 3000 rpm and 200hp at the redline I would be happy.

Some people have told me that if I want more power at lower rpms then the first thing I should do, even before the turbo, is a B18C GSR engine swap. Is that a better idea?

Thanks!

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

I take it this is a D-series build. What you're asking for doesn't really require a GT2871R. The turbine housing is only ONE thing you'd have to change (even though they both may have a T3 turbine inlet flange, the 4 bolt turbine housing flange may NOT fit.

the T3 Super 60 for the D-series is best for the range of power that you're looking for. having a GS-R isn't a bad idea, but you need to really look more for what you're trying to do with the car, not just passing regular "minivan" traffic.

bsmith100

No I have a B16 actually, would the Super 60 still be the best choice for the type of power I want to get?

bsmith100

Is a B18 really a big improvement over a B16 for a wider powerband?

I realize it is 200cc larger so it has more torque, except I was thinking that the boost from the turbo would be enough that there wouldn't be much of a difference between the 2 engines.

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

The displacement is in the stroke, which is even more important than change in bore. This dictate HOW the torqueband is to be distributed, not top end power. The amount of stroke helps determine WHERE in the powerband the best range is, depending upon turbo size. For the B16, I'd say an equivalent 40-44lbs/min turbocharger would work as best as it can for what you're trying to do. Sounds more to me, though that you need a supercharger, not a turbo.

bsmith100

So the 40-44 lbs/min puts me with a T3/T4 , and then if I want quicker spool I could switch to a GT3071R ball bearing turbo later. The GT3071R is rated at the same air flow and is also available with a T3 compressor housing, so it should bolt up.

I was actually originally thinking about getting a Jackson Racing supercharger, and then I did some reading here. Everybody seemed to say how much better a turbo was, so then I reconsidered. I think I will go with the turbo, and then see how I like it.

I won't be upset if the turbo doesn't give me a super wide powerband. I like experimenting, and this is really more of an experiment than anything else. The enjoyment for me is in the journey I suppose.

Thanks for giving me an idea of what type of turbo I should try. Now I have somewhere to start off experimenting from.

VtecCarHauler

[QUOTE=bsmith100;41283380]Is a B18 really a big improvement over a B16 for a wider powerband?

B18 torque is a big difference to me. If you put a decent turbo setup on your b16 with a good tune it will change your personal definition of power. It sounds like you just need a little more torque. A high comp (11:1-12:1) B18 or B20 should do you good. Going turbo on a vtec Honda motor is in a whole other world. It takes more effort to setup and maintain but it is very rewarding when done right.

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

a "T3/T4" can be from 30-70 lbs/min, so it doesn't really narrow you down there. There are combinations that are the same range and similar characteristics as the GT3071R (45lbs/min). As I said in the previous post, there's more to a "bolt up" than a T3 flange. The return flange, oil feed restrictor and water lines ALL have to be connected and changed from a T3/T4. Only the Turbine housing is possible to bolt.

Why "bolt on" twice? Get the right turbo ONCE and never do it again

blaze the chemi

Why settle for one when you can set it up for both a turbo and super charger Low rpm torque from the SC and then more boost when the turbo comes in.

bsmith100

That seems like sound advice, T3/T4 .48AR 50 trim then.