1fstevo

I thought I worked out the problem but it came back again while boosting 15 pound.
To summarize the past, basically oil keeps on leaking out of the pan gasket and only happen during boost. After 4 gaskets, i changed to new oil pump, new cam seals and all other possible seals there is.
The motor is B18C1 built with stock sleeves. Boosting for a whole year at 15 pound no problem. At the end of the year, oil start to appear near the pan. That when I decided to fix the problem, changed the head and maintance the motor. I didn't touch the block at all so still using 9:1 comp. stock bore JEs, crower rods, and total seal ring. ARP studs and stock headgasket.
After I changed the pump and seals, the car don't leak anymore until I ran a couple hard run at 15 pound. I inspect the gasket which it totally torn apart. Gasket is split in several sections where major oil leak is coming from. Nothing else is leaking. Did a compression test and showed up 155 accross at the dot. Did a leak down and showed 3-4 percent leakage. I always thought it's the rings but the test shows no sign of bad wear. Now I am wondering if it's the PVC system which I did open loop. Basically, I replaced the pvc valve in the black box with a hose barb welded on it and ran a tube to a moroso catch can that has a filter attached on the top to vent it out by it self. There is absolutely no oil in the catch can all this time. Next I am also wondering could the cylinder wall flex so bad that only in boost condition could the compression pass the rings causing excessive heat and pressure in the crankcase thous cause weakest spot to blow. I decided to sleeve the block and redo my block before the tests but now I feels that if it's not blown yet I want to race til end of the season which is not that far away.
Anyone have suggestions?

1fstevo

Anyone please? I have four days until englishtown race..... really need to solve this problem.

Arturbo

Oil pan flange? Try a whole new oil pan.

lazerus

are you sure your PCV is not clogged anywhere, can you blow into the valve cover if you pull your PCV valve off? if the pressure in the crankcase doesen't vent, pressure builds up and will blow the weakest seal.

it's just a guess, but it's something to check. another thing you could do is actually make the PCV well, a PCV, and get a vacuum pump and hook it to a catch can and have an air pump making a slight vacuum in the crankcase... this will boost performance a small percentage.

something has to be blowing the seal out, hope you find the culprit!!! I hate gremlins like that!

Oh yeah, you have the PCV Valve VENTING the crankcase right? (ya never know!)


[Modified by lazerus, 9:19 PM 10/1/2002]

1fstevo

It's a new oil pan. Tried both new oem pan and moroso, both does the same so I elimitated the cause.

I have no PVC valve. It is replaced with a barb and hosed to the catch can. It's not connected to the manifold for vaccuam source. I let it vent it self which can probably be a problem. I havn't sucked on the valve cover breather either .
How would air not vent? there is no pvc valve. Only cause would be not venting enough. Where to buy the vaccuam pump, being thinking about it for a while. Maybe I'll try to use the location before the turbo after the air filter for vaccaum source, kinda like the greddy turbo kit setup except the hose is not connected to the breather but to my hose barb pvc replacement on the black box behind the motor, you think it'll work?




[Modified by [Evo]Hybrid, 6:33 AM 10/2/2002]

1fstevo

I searched supra forum and found that turbo pcv setup need vacuam regardless. so best way is to hook up the breather to the turbo inlet for vacuam source under boost and rely stock pvc setup under vacuam condition. Hope this will solve my problem and save others from doing the same as me.


[Modified by [Evo]Hybrid, 7:45 AM 10/2/2002]

Ri5e

If you blow one of the two upper rings, you'll get a lot of smoke from the PCV valve and oil dipstick hole. That will also cause a lot of pressure to build up in the Crank and build up pressure in the head if its not vented.

1fstevo

No smoke anywhere. except raw gas pouring out of the tailpipe .

sutrusu

what kinda oil are you using? you could be using a really thin synthetic or something. when i used 5w30 on my LS it would leak out of all the gaskets!!

DeepSi

Am i reading this right, your oil pan gasket is breaking apart? I am assuming you are using the oem rubber oil pan gasket. I just can not imagine what would cause that to be torn apart.

Here is a bump, so you can figure this out.

-deepsi

GraphiteAccord

it breaks out in the same spot every time...correct? perhaps you should clean this spot, even try bending the oil pan flange towards the block a bit ....

1fstevo

Yes, the pan gasket split in several sections, causing multiple leaks.

It never split in the same area.

I use 10w-30 mobile one and switch to castrol syntech 10w-30 and no difference ( still 10w-30 ).

Before it blew under boost, the gasket is perfectly snug and tight, I never over tighten the bolts. The Pan is new and stock. The gasket is new oem part.

Anyone has it happened to them?

black92si

PCV-Positive Crankcase Ventilation. That is all.

1fstevo

If crankcase pressure is so high which blew the gasket, why don't the pressure vent either through the valve cover breather which I have a filter on it or vent to my open filtered catchcan. Like I stated earliar, I have open loop system, No pvc valve or hooked up to the manifold. The theory is if the pressure build up high enough, it would vent out to the near exit: either behind the motor of the accumulator or out of the breather. Once again, I have no pcv valve, it is replaced by a barb which runs a hose to moroso can and a large filter on top of the can. No vaccuam source on the system.

black92si

you need to have the PCV valve hooked up. when the piston goes up, it compresses the air/fuel mixture. when it goes down, what do you think happens? it will pressurize the crankcase. with the PCV valve hooked-up, it will create a small vacuum in the crankcase which should help save you a few oil pan gaskets. try hooking the PCV valve back up and then let us know.

1fstevo

having manifold vaccuam pulling crankcase pressure is stock setup, closeloop setup is for emmission purpose. I would definatly say with alittle vaccuam it would help but the honda pcv valve is under rated for boost condition. How would you pull with vaccuam when there is no vaccuam during boost? Only condition that it would pull by manifold pressure would be low load under 0 psi and it still won't pull under idle since pcv valve is designed with pintle closed at -14.7 psi. I elected open loop with no manifold detached which allow both the breather and the crankcase to vent by it self. Obviously it's not working. Best way is to use a vaccuam pump but that's last resort. I will put back the stock pcv system back since many of my friend never had this problem under stock condition. Only problem they have is getting oil in the intake system. Even with a catch can, how much can you really suck through the little hole of the pcv valve? I tried to suck through it, I got dizzy .


[Modified by [Evo]Hybrid, 3:10 AM 10/3/2002]

black92si

you are right, your motor will not see any vacuum under boost conditions. i must not have been paying attention. in any case, you need to vent the crankcase somehow. i am sure that your oil pan gaskets are not leaking due to installer error. try re-installing a PCV valve and reconnecting the valve cover to the intake pipe. we all have our cars setup with a PCV valve and have never had a problem like yours. i hate feeling stupid.

GraphiteAccord

pull the dip stick out of the hole

1fstevo

All right, I am ready to blow another one ( hope not ), all stock pcv setup is all back in the car ready to run: please work, please work!!!

dustin

Can you take pics of the old gasket? I'd like to see......

1fstevo

I tried today but digi cam was at a friend's house, I'll try to do so tomorrow before I change out the gasket again. Basically, the gasket was teared horizontally one inch distance between two bolts at two different sections in the front of the motor. Last last time was teared one inch behind the motor near the half shaft.


[Modified by [Evo]Hybrid, 7:59 AM 10/4/2002]