HybridKOOP

Well, to make a long story short... I built a del Sol for my girlfriend who wanted a change from her lethargic 2000 2.0L VW Jetta. I installed a 1999 Civic Si B16A2 swap into the car w/ GS-R cams, GReddy 18G kit, RC 550's, MBC, Type 31 FMIC. The motor is stock internally aside from the cams, and we're running a *stock cat*, and Skunk2 catback exhaust.

As soon as I was done building the car, I drove it down to Boosted Hybrid for Uberdata tuning. At first, he had difficulties with the program, but then resolved it and tuning was underway. After a few hours on the dyno, running 9.5 psi, here's the plot:



Now I know Dynapacks read a tad lower than Dynojets, but these numbers seem low to me. Comparing it to other dynos at http://www.boosted-hybrid.com, against SOHC non-VTEC GReddy 15G dyno plots at 10psi making the same HP and more torque, on the same dyno, something is up. I know the stock cat has to be hurting, but how much affect could it be having on the power levels? The cat itself is god-knows how old, and could be totally deteriorating for all I know... but could this be robbing the setup of about 30whp?

Driving the car is very very fun. I had a Civic Coupe back in the day making 190whp N/A and this del Sol definitely has a stronger feeling pull to it... I am just concerned with the numbers it made. To be honest, I expected 220-225. My girlfriend is already ready for a bit more power (I think she's funny) and I want to figure out what I can do to extract more of it with the setup that we've already got. I know the GReddy downpipe sucks, so I am trying to motivate B18Flip to do me up a clean 2.5 - 3 inch DP with just a flex section right through where the cat would be.

What do you guys think? Thanks for the input!

- Louis


Modified by HybridKOOP at 4:07 AM 7/23/2004

fipracing_com

Yes you DEF, need to DISS the CAT you will uncork at least 15 to 20 HP with that guy gone. ALso when i had the setup my short fall was my exhaust and ESP the DP was the limiting factor. The greddy setup needs a bigger DP, and you need to go with at least a 2.5 in exhaust pref, a 3in. The power numbers look good, removing the cat will help. What A/F are you running also check to make sure that you are running the timing at the stock. The dnyapack will read lower than a dyno jet always and in my opinion is a more realistic reading but the true test is how that bad boy runs on the street and at the track. Drop me a line and i would like to see pics of the install.

Jay

MIKES

Get rid of the stock cat. I got my turbo kit complete and left. Only got 4 psi with a 12psi spring. The difference when I took off that cat was night and day. The shame about it all is you have already paid for tunning, now you have to get rid of the cat and get her tunned again.

99blusi

I've got one of b18flip's downpipes, and you can't go wrong with it. Mine is extended through the length of the cat also. Those #'s are pretty sad for almost 10psi. I hope my greddy performs better than that.

Pfieff

You guys should have tried an open DP run to see if that made a big difference. When I was on the dyno with Jeff we thought my cat might be an issue so we did a run open DP and it didn't do ****. Come to find out that we had a gasket **** out on us pre turbo.

Rod.

a cat can help you lose power. 9.5psi on a b16 the numbers are pretty low. You have a pretty reasonable setup. Ditch the cat if you dont care.

Patron

wow, my buddy with a b16a put down on 227 whp on dynojet. no tuning, didn't up the boost, ran it off the blue box. all dynos are different though.

Nihilation

Man if you can get b18flip to make a downpipe, I'll buy one too!

Rollo Lawson

https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=925589

it's a bit of a different set up,but, same kit, same b16.

FredoSP

Def the cat is holding you back, I thought that was a N/A dyno until I read the post. Go back to Jeff and try the setup with a bigger down pipe and test pipe.

FYI, When I had my 18G Kit on my 00 Si, RC 310's and Type 31 IC, STOCK EXHUAST AND STOCK CAT I made 176 whp and 139.5 TQ on a dyno Jet .. and this was with the shitty greddy blue box at 5.5 psi. I have the dyno if you would like to see it, also I posted these numbers on here 2 years ago, so if you want ill find the post.

Here it is, damm 2002 I looked ugly

https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=322137

4-banging

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Nihilation &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Man if you can get b18flip to make a downpipe, I'll buy one too!</TD></TR></TABLE>

As far as I know, he's not making them anymore. But as they say, money talks

psileepR

dynapacks should read a lil higher than dyno jets because they hook up to your hubs and dont account for your rims/tires. Jeff can setup the dyno to compensate for that though and its all in how he set it up.

that means your numbers are really low. did you do a compression check? is everything in order with the motor?

fipracing_com

Every dyno will register diff number, stock CAT is holding him back big time.. This motor and turbo kit is from my 99 SI. This setup was tuned at SS in tampa, by John. I made 239WHP on 10lbs of boost, this was with a conservative tune "reliability" and an A/F of 11 to 11.5, timing was also consertiave, NO cat, and an AEM exhaust. The DP and the small exhaust was holding me back. He will benefit from a larger DP, no cat, and a larger piping for the exhaust. Keep in mind to he is running with a stock B pipe as well.




Modified by fipracing_com at 6:32 PM 7/23/2004

HybridKOOP

Not stock B-Pipe.

Stock cat + Skunk2 catback exhaust. Going to do a compression test today hopefully, but I highly doubt the motor is unhealthy.

fipracing_com

what diameter is the exhaust piping.. The stock greddy elbow and DP are barely 1.75 inches in diameter. can we say restrictive..

HybridKOOP

The exhaust is 60mm...

I know the downpipe is restrictive, but I am just comparing our setup vs. similar setups that are making 30+ more whp... even SOHC non-VTEC's are making similar numbers and sometimes even higher.

integra-modder

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by fipracing_com &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">what diameter is the exhaust piping.. The stock greddy elbow and DP are barely 1.75 inches in diameter. can we say restrictive.. </TD></TR></TABLE>

wow, thats puny.....

60mm is ~2.4 inches, so a 2.5 inch downpipe will be good for you.

Maxime

I have pretty much the same setup on my car. Only I have a 2.5" DP and 3" exhaust (Cat. Resonator, muffler).

I dynoed at 238 whp at 7psi.

stick

i have a carsound cat OBD II 2.5in/out about 17" in long for sale.
very cheap.

u can gut to pass visual but it wont pass smog.

HybridKOOP

Thanks everyone for the input so far... I just wanted to give a brief update:

I pulled the car in and did a compression test. The test yielded results of 210psi in every cylinder.

At least that excludes an unhealthy motor. Another possibility is that the gentleman I bought the motor from (FIP_Racing) installed GS-R cams... and it could be a possibility that he didn't do a valve adjustment upon installation. I am going to have to check with him.

I think our plans are to definitely get at least a 2.5 inch downpipe made, ditch the cat, and retune it. It needs a retune anyway because the partial throttle on this car is almost unbearable on the highway

I will keep you all posted, and keep the opinions/suggestions coming!

fipracing_com

Yes i knew the compression in the motor would be PERFECT, 210 was was the compression was before i ever installed the greddy kit, I would not have sold the motor if i even thought that the compression was bad. Yes i did do a valve adjustment on the cams when i installed them... After my orginal tune i installed the gsr cams then i went back to a local dynojet facility in Thomasville, GA and did another run. The power was up slightly and the A/F was still dead on. I think you will be pleasantly supprised when you remove the cat and do the 2.5 dp.

Charlie Moua

iTrader: (3)

well all i know is that my buddie made 209whp and 165tq on a stock b16 with gsr cams, hondata, dsm 450cc, fmic greddy kit with a 15G @ 10psi !!!!

somthing is messed up yo