boostin a b18b and have ???
06-29-2005, 07:54 PM
#1
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 42
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
boostin a b18b and have ???
will be running a rev hard turbo kit and a build buttom b18b obd2. looking to be running 15-20psi.
i've searched and didn't get the answer i was looking for.
my funds for a piggy or standalone is tight, here are my questions:
what is the best affordable streetable piggy or standalone?
what are the pros and cons?
how much will it cost?
i've heard alot about hondata and ems but they seem to be costly. (1500-2000) i don't have that kind of pennyto dump on something that extreme. what are other management systems out there that will work for my setup. this will be my daily driver.
what is everyone's thought....
please input
i've searched and didn't get the answer i was looking for.
my funds for a piggy or standalone is tight, here are my questions:
what is the best affordable streetable piggy or standalone?
what are the pros and cons?
how much will it cost?
i've heard alot about hondata and ems but they seem to be costly. (1500-2000) i don't have that kind of pennyto dump on something that extreme. what are other management systems out there that will work for my setup. this will be my daily driver.
what is everyone's thought....
please input
06-30-2005, 05:57 AM
#6
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 42
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
crome and uberdata are obd1 compatable right??
after all the cost of change over and stuff, would it be cheaper to go aem???
btw is this the same as reflashing???
Modified by stokeless at 10:20 AM 6/30/2005
after all the cost of change over and stuff, would it be cheaper to go aem???
btw is this the same as reflashing???
Modified by stokeless at 10:20 AM 6/30/2005
06-30-2005, 06:55 AM
#7
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: schooling kids in ny, usa
Posts: 9,813
Likes: 0
Received 9 Likes
on
9 Posts
Re: (stokeless)
you can reflash chips, but your ecu has to be soldered up to accept chips, as obd1 honda ecu's dont come with chips that can be reflashed.
right now im running uberdata, but i might go toward neptune in the near future
right now im running uberdata, but i might go toward neptune in the near future
Trending Topics
06-30-2005, 06:10 PM
#9
Honda-Tech Member
Re: (beerbongskickass)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by beerbongskickass »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Convert to obd1... obd2 blows ***.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Agreed. Contact Blown90hatch http://www.jkobd.com he'll hook you up w/ the harness for a great price and I would suggest going w/ Uberdata or Crome as well. I haven't had to much experience w/ crome but, I can say that I love Uberdata
Stay away from hacks!!!!!!!
Phil
Agreed. Contact Blown90hatch http://www.jkobd.com he'll hook you up w/ the harness for a great price and I would suggest going w/ Uberdata or Crome as well. I haven't had to much experience w/ crome but, I can say that I love Uberdata
Stay away from hacks!!!!!!!Phil
06-30-2005, 08:38 PM
#11
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Somewhere in California
Posts: 4,408
Likes: 0
Received 3 Likes
on
3 Posts
Re: (stokeless)
Since you have to do and OBD 2 -> OBD 1 conversion dont forget to factor that cost in too. I figure $90-$120 for a OBD ECU conversion harness, and $100-$150 for an OBD 1 ECU.
CROME ENGINE MANAGEMENT
quote from http://www.pgmfi.org
Crome (Cui's ROM Editor) is ROMEditor that John Cui wrote. Its main feature that differentiates itself from other ROMEditors is that it supports the use of Java Script to control it and implement new features. The Crome Script API allows you to extend the capabilites of the editor with relative ease. People have already written many scripts for Crome, most of which can be found on the PGMFI Source Forge page.
Crome is available in 3 levels...CromeFREE which is free, CromePRO which is $149 and has several added features, and CromeDEALER which can be used commercially to make money and has several features available only to CromeDEALER. Some of the features that CromePRO has which are worth mentioning are as follows: integrated datalogging with replay feature, knock logging, and auto-tune (few bugs reported). A few other notable features are in the making such as live auto tuning. Crome is also very user friendly, and setting it up for real time tuning with Ostrich and datalogging is very easy.
For more information on Crome's features click the link http://forum.pgmfi.org/viewtopic.php?t=4383
GENERAL ECU CHIPPING INFO
Here is a list that I have posted several times which covers the basic pieces of equipment you'll need for DIY ECU chipping and tuning. You'll want to have a laptop to use in the car or at least be able to borrow one from a friend. The prices below do not include shipping and handling.
BARE ESSENTIALS
$$$ - laptop
$15 - ECU chipping/socketing supplies: moates.net "UBER 1" kit
$25-$75 - ECU socketing: moates.net does installation services as well as others on the net
$55-$85 - EPROM burner: ebay.com "Willem Enhanced" or moates.net "BURN 1"
$10-$45 - datalogging cable: Nokia or most cell phone cables, superdroids cable, moates.net Hulog
That covers the basics...all you need are some larger injectors and a fuel pump that can support your power goals. You can download CromeFREE or Uberdata and use those to change fuel, timing, and other options like VTEC x-over, disable O2 sensor and much more. You ECU can be made datalog-capable with the addition of a cable to your ECU's CN2 port. You can use a Nokia cell phone cable, any datalog proven cell phone cable, a superdroids cable, or the moates.net hulog. Before getting your ECU chipped find out what datalogging cable setup you want to go with. Have the person socketing your ECU solder in the wiring or pin header into CN2 at the same time the ECU is being socketed. Just make sure you tell them what wires go to which CN2 pin location.
OPTIONAL ITEMS
$300-$330 - wideband setup: either a Innovate LM1 or PLX300 (DO NOT get a Zeitronix Zt-2).
$175 - Ostrich emulator: allows for real time tuning
$149 - Crome users upgrade from CromeFREE to CromePRO. CromePRO has integrated datalogging as well as a bunch of extra features..
The wideband is a good thing to have if you plan on tuning your own car. You can either buy one or borrow one from a friend, or just use the one that your tuner has atthe dyno shop. You'll want to stay away from the Zeitronix due to the nature of it's O2 sensor voltage which is parabolic as opposed to other wideband types which are linear. This difference makes the Zeitronix hard to setup for use with Crome and Uberdata, which is why they are still not supported by either one. The Innovate LM1 has it's own datalogging software. This is good if you want to use CromeFREE which does not have integrated datalogging (CromePRO does though). You may still have to buy a few pieces of hardware to be able to use the LM1's datalogging software. The PLX 300 does not come with any datalogging software so you must use it from within your EMS. AFAIK you wont be able to use the PLX300 with CromeFREE since that level of Crome doesn't have datalogging. IMO the $149 I spent to get CromePRO was well worth it to be able to datalog and auto-tune with Crome.
CROME ENGINE MANAGEMENT
quote from http://www.pgmfi.org
Crome (Cui's ROM Editor) is ROMEditor that John Cui wrote. Its main feature that differentiates itself from other ROMEditors is that it supports the use of Java Script to control it and implement new features. The Crome Script API allows you to extend the capabilites of the editor with relative ease. People have already written many scripts for Crome, most of which can be found on the PGMFI Source Forge page.
Crome is available in 3 levels...CromeFREE which is free, CromePRO which is $149 and has several added features, and CromeDEALER which can be used commercially to make money and has several features available only to CromeDEALER. Some of the features that CromePRO has which are worth mentioning are as follows: integrated datalogging with replay feature, knock logging, and auto-tune (few bugs reported). A few other notable features are in the making such as live auto tuning. Crome is also very user friendly, and setting it up for real time tuning with Ostrich and datalogging is very easy.
For more information on Crome's features click the link http://forum.pgmfi.org/viewtopic.php?t=4383
GENERAL ECU CHIPPING INFO
Here is a list that I have posted several times which covers the basic pieces of equipment you'll need for DIY ECU chipping and tuning. You'll want to have a laptop to use in the car or at least be able to borrow one from a friend. The prices below do not include shipping and handling.
BARE ESSENTIALS
$$$ - laptop
$15 - ECU chipping/socketing supplies: moates.net "UBER 1" kit
$25-$75 - ECU socketing: moates.net does installation services as well as others on the net
$55-$85 - EPROM burner: ebay.com "Willem Enhanced" or moates.net "BURN 1"
$10-$45 - datalogging cable: Nokia or most cell phone cables, superdroids cable, moates.net Hulog
That covers the basics...all you need are some larger injectors and a fuel pump that can support your power goals. You can download CromeFREE or Uberdata and use those to change fuel, timing, and other options like VTEC x-over, disable O2 sensor and much more. You ECU can be made datalog-capable with the addition of a cable to your ECU's CN2 port. You can use a Nokia cell phone cable, any datalog proven cell phone cable, a superdroids cable, or the moates.net hulog. Before getting your ECU chipped find out what datalogging cable setup you want to go with. Have the person socketing your ECU solder in the wiring or pin header into CN2 at the same time the ECU is being socketed. Just make sure you tell them what wires go to which CN2 pin location.
OPTIONAL ITEMS
$300-$330 - wideband setup: either a Innovate LM1 or PLX300 (DO NOT get a Zeitronix Zt-2).
$175 - Ostrich emulator: allows for real time tuning
$149 - Crome users upgrade from CromeFREE to CromePRO. CromePRO has integrated datalogging as well as a bunch of extra features..
The wideband is a good thing to have if you plan on tuning your own car. You can either buy one or borrow one from a friend, or just use the one that your tuner has atthe dyno shop. You'll want to stay away from the Zeitronix due to the nature of it's O2 sensor voltage which is parabolic as opposed to other wideband types which are linear. This difference makes the Zeitronix hard to setup for use with Crome and Uberdata, which is why they are still not supported by either one. The Innovate LM1 has it's own datalogging software. This is good if you want to use CromeFREE which does not have integrated datalogging (CromePRO does though). You may still have to buy a few pieces of hardware to be able to use the LM1's datalogging software. The PLX 300 does not come with any datalogging software so you must use it from within your EMS. AFAIK you wont be able to use the PLX300 with CromeFREE since that level of Crome doesn't have datalogging. IMO the $149 I spent to get CromePRO was well worth it to be able to datalog and auto-tune with Crome.
07-01-2005, 04:17 AM
#12
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 42
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: (BlueShadow)
wow great info, thanks
so basicly what i would have to do is get a burner, chips, covert over to obd1,dl crome, set my settings and tuned it. is this fairly correct???
where can i dl crome?
so basicly what i would have to do is get a burner, chips, covert over to obd1,dl crome, set my settings and tuned it. is this fairly correct???
where can i dl crome?
07-01-2005, 05:26 AM
#13
Re: (stokeless)
Hondata Pros:
-Proven track record
-Tons of tuners nationwide (worldwide even)
-Solid, comprehensive tools
-Excellent availability of base tunes
-Commercial support and upgrades
Hondata Cons:
-No gear adjustment. This may sound like nothing, but it plays havoc with larger injectors. Horrible with 1000cc on the street.
-Improper / poor control over IAT adjustment
-Support for MAP sensors focused on stock + GM3bar - moto2.5 / GM 2 / AEM-Motec 5bar mediocrely supported
-Mediocre support for rejection of erroneous datalogging values
-Price
Uberdata Pros:
-Free
-Works better than a FMU
-Decent community for support
Uberdata Cons:
-No manual (although many help guides)
-Improper / poor control over IAT adjustment
-Poor support for non-OEM MAP sensors
-Poor availability of TRUSTWORTHY base maps
-Poor datalogging averaging, statistical rejection
-Many important features (TPS tip in, close start, main fuel adjustments for example) do not work as they should.
-Uncertain maintenance / upgrades
-Newer software without long term proven track record
Crome Pros:
-Excellent support for wide range of MAP sensors (stock, 2bar, 2.5bar, 3bar, roll-your-own)
-Most major features necessary for tuning work well and bug free including fuel adjustments and gear correction.
-All editing features available in free version
-Most advanced datalogging and statistical rejection algorithms make for most effective street tuning program
-Consistent and clean user interface
-No "per-car" licensing fees
-Actively being developed
Crome Cons:
-No manual (although many help guides
-Improper / poor control over IAT adjustment
-Full version with datalogging $150 user / $450 tuner.
-Newer software without long term proven track record
Uberdata is a solid package, and is great for "simple" setups (stock MAP sensor, 10psi or less boost, 450cc or smaller injectors). It falls down with non-OEM MAP sensors and really big injectors.
I've used Hondata a good deal. The amount of information availble with the datalogger is great. The smooth running bug free nature of the userspace tools is great. The availability of tuners nationwide is great.
-Must give credit where credit is due: Originally posted by Blundar.
-Proven track record
-Tons of tuners nationwide (worldwide even)
-Solid, comprehensive tools
-Excellent availability of base tunes
-Commercial support and upgrades
Hondata Cons:
-No gear adjustment. This may sound like nothing, but it plays havoc with larger injectors. Horrible with 1000cc on the street.
-Improper / poor control over IAT adjustment
-Support for MAP sensors focused on stock + GM3bar - moto2.5 / GM 2 / AEM-Motec 5bar mediocrely supported
-Mediocre support for rejection of erroneous datalogging values
-Price
Uberdata Pros:
-Free
-Works better than a FMU
-Decent community for support
Uberdata Cons:
-No manual (although many help guides)
-Improper / poor control over IAT adjustment
-Poor support for non-OEM MAP sensors
-Poor availability of TRUSTWORTHY base maps
-Poor datalogging averaging, statistical rejection
-Many important features (TPS tip in, close start, main fuel adjustments for example) do not work as they should.
-Uncertain maintenance / upgrades
-Newer software without long term proven track record
Crome Pros:
-Excellent support for wide range of MAP sensors (stock, 2bar, 2.5bar, 3bar, roll-your-own)
-Most major features necessary for tuning work well and bug free including fuel adjustments and gear correction.
-All editing features available in free version
-Most advanced datalogging and statistical rejection algorithms make for most effective street tuning program
-Consistent and clean user interface
-No "per-car" licensing fees
-Actively being developed
Crome Cons:
-No manual (although many help guides
-Improper / poor control over IAT adjustment
-Full version with datalogging $150 user / $450 tuner.
-Newer software without long term proven track record
Uberdata is a solid package, and is great for "simple" setups (stock MAP sensor, 10psi or less boost, 450cc or smaller injectors). It falls down with non-OEM MAP sensors and really big injectors.
I've used Hondata a good deal. The amount of information availble with the datalogger is great. The smooth running bug free nature of the userspace tools is great. The availability of tuners nationwide is great.
-Must give credit where credit is due: Originally posted by Blundar.
07-01-2005, 05:41 AM
#14
Member
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Nashville, TN, U.S.A
Posts: 2,992
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: (Dunc)
^^ nice little right up. I have to disagree with Uberdata not being able to support 3 bar sensors and not able to control 1000cc injectors. Although I agree Uberdata isn't the easiest to use people have had enormous success with 3 bar (me) and 1000cc injectors.
IMO just to add a little:
If you are a DIY fan and want to spend the least amount of money go Uberdata. It's not so much buggy as it is finiky about everything. Once you figure it out it's an amazing tools for any horsepower you want.
IF you are DIY and don't mind spending a little cash to make things easier ($150 to be exact) then look into Crome. It's easier to use then Uberdata and only have a few bugs, but nothing major.
IF you don't want to DIY and just want someone to tune it go Hondata all the way. It's proven, lots of tuners available, and it simply works.
GL with your choice, but seriously stay with these choices. DL Uberdata and Crome and just take a look at what they are and how to use them. Read all the forums, hell spend hours, and if you still feel weird about it just go hondata. Making a safe tune isn't that hard if you have a wideband though
IMO just to add a little:
If you are a DIY fan and want to spend the least amount of money go Uberdata. It's not so much buggy as it is finiky about everything. Once you figure it out it's an amazing tools for any horsepower you want.
IF you are DIY and don't mind spending a little cash to make things easier ($150 to be exact) then look into Crome. It's easier to use then Uberdata and only have a few bugs, but nothing major.
IF you don't want to DIY and just want someone to tune it go Hondata all the way. It's proven, lots of tuners available, and it simply works.
GL with your choice, but seriously stay with these choices. DL Uberdata and Crome and just take a look at what they are and how to use them. Read all the forums, hell spend hours, and if you still feel weird about it just go hondata. Making a safe tune isn't that hard if you have a wideband though
07-01-2005, 07:47 AM
#15
Re: (adseguy)
I agreed 150%....I don't think I could stress enough that you SHOULD DEFINITELY get a wideband as well to wire it into your ECU and have a gauge read out. It helps 10 fold when trying to street tune and it gives you peace of mind knowing exactly what your A/F is all the time.
07-01-2005, 07:39 PM
#18
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Somewhere in California
Posts: 4,408
Likes: 0
Received 3 Likes
on
3 Posts
Re: (stokeless)
Dave Blundell or blundar on pgmfi.org is in Cincinnati, Ohio.
http://forum.pgmfi.org/viewtopic.php?p=23183#23183
EDIT: since you have a B18B, you could try tuning it yourself. If you were a beginner a VTEC motor might be a little harder, but since you have a non-VTEC it will be a little easier.
http://forum.pgmfi.org/viewtopic.php?p=23183#23183
EDIT: since you have a B18B, you could try tuning it yourself. If you were a beginner a VTEC motor might be a little harder, but since you have a non-VTEC it will be a little easier.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
