ITR.#1446

I am curious to know if b16 bottom ends are worth building up for boost or would i be better off using a b18 ls bottom end? My b16 needs to be rebuilt but i dont wanna start buying parts for it if i can benifit more from a built ls bottom end.

Redline130

There have been many successful builds using the B16 motor. My stock bottom B16 survived 390+whp @ 15~17psi for a while with no visible bearing damage. I have a friend whose B16 with rods and pistons has survived over 20psi (450+whp) on stock sleeves no problem.

I'd say, since you already have it, use the B16 bottom.

CRXdan

why not go for bigger displacment and buy a b18 block. they are next to nothing nowadays. The only downside I can see is less rpms, but youll benefit form more torque.

Then again, I own a d series *****, so ill shut up

hotrod99

if your looking to have it sleeved it wont matter because you could bore it out to 83-84mm and it would be pretty much the same thing as buying a b18...but if your not going to sleeve the block then yeah the b18 would be the wiser choice

Boostage

84mm b16 is still not like b18. the stroke of a b18 is still quite a bit more than a b16. U still wouldnt make the tq a b18 does.

RoadconeTuning

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Boostage &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">84mm b16 is still not like b18. the stroke of a b18 is still quite a bit more than a b16. U still wouldnt make the tq a b18 does.</TD></TR></TABLE>

but you'd make more hp.... short stroke big bore is the way to go if you want high rpm and hp.... unless all of those Silly F1 teams just have it all wrong.

boostedcivicsir

made 540 on an 84mm b16 it was a torqueless wonder. still ran 10.72. the guy i sold it to still has it, re ringed it and is letting it eat.

power can be made, just not a whole lota torque.

RoadconeTuning

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by boostedcivicsir &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">made 540 on an 84mm b16 it was a torqueless wonder. still ran 10.72. the guy i sold it to still has it, re ringed it and is letting it eat.

power can be made, just not a whole lota torque.</TD></TR></TABLE>

i think the way most people run, crappy suspension and almost decent tires, the lack of tq would actually help them, its like a ghetto traction control heh

ITR.#1446

i am not sleeving any motor i figured it would be better if i bought a ls motor and put rods and pistons in that instead of the b16.....so pretty much it would be an ls vtec i guess, do i need a special head gasket for and studs for this? and how would i run oil to the head?

Boostage

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RoadconeTuning &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

but you'd make more hp.... short stroke big bore is the way to go if you want high rpm and hp.... unless all of those Silly F1 teams just have it all wrong.</TD></TR></TABLE>

yeah its the way to go for going around the Indianapolis speedway. so is, a fully carbon composite chassis that's been wind tested in a 150 Million dollar tunnel. trying to apply Formula 1 dynamics to a street driven honda makes as much sense as Drunk Bush.

Mod for mod a real 1.8 will make more hp and tq than a bored out b16. and still feel noticeable quicker in the low end.

boosted92

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RoadconeTuning &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

but you'd make more hp.... short stroke big bore is the way to go if you want high rpm and hp.... unless all of those Silly F1 teams just have it all wrong.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Those silly F1 cars have to fit into a max displacement bracket and are also limited on their bore size, to 98mm. If they weren't limited on engine displacement, do you honestly still think they'd be running s 39.7mm stroke? Not a chance.

Going from a B16 to a B18 isn't going to effect how high you can rev in any measureable way. You'll run into cam/valvetrain/intake/turbo issues that limit your revs well before the shortblock will give you any problems.

Go with an LS/vtec, and thank me later

Civic89stdB16

i like the lack of torque or the b16 because it helps u launch at the track and youll have less traction issues. I like power that gets used not wasted. But u could do a b18 with the high boost kicking in when u shift into 3rd gear so the traction issue isn't to bad.

riceball777

a 1.8 block cost close to nothing and will only result in more hp and tq being made. there is no down side at all from going to a b18 block.

boosted92

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Civic89stdB16 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i like the lack of torque or the b16 because it helps u launch at the track and youll have less traction issues. I like power that gets used not wasted. But u could do a b18 with the high boost kicking in when u shift into 3rd gear so the traction issue isn't to bad.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Correlating lack of torque with traction is for people who don't know how to modulate the throttle

With the proper suspension and tires, it's easy to hook up a B18. Keep in mind we're talking about still a 1.8L motor, not an overwhelming amount of torque. I'm running a GT30R on my Integra right now, but I had a PT67 on it and even on 225 BFG's it was pretty easy to hook up with boost by gear and pedalling it.

blaze the chemi

i'm more fond of the b16's than b18's. I think for DD the b16 would be great. Yeah you have to rev it up to get great HP, but the bottom end will be good because of the R/S. I rebuilt mine with some crower rods/SRP pistons and was boosted for over 17K miles without any issues except the turbo itself. I'm on the same bottom end only NA and it's about to hit 30K miles.

I'll be going back to boost eventually. I'll rebuild the head (it's an 89) and probably sleeve the block too.

If I were racing the car then I'd go with the ls/v route. Good luck.

Boner_Ben

I personally like b16 turbo builds for the torqueless factor. My street car went 10.4@142 with a stock sleeve b16 on a single stage of boost and wouldnt spin a tire.

0BoostedJeff

I had a Stock bore, sleeved b16 block back in the day, made 476whp on pump gas. They are fine, and alot more fun on the street than a big stroke big bore torque monster. It really depends on what you want to use the car for honestly.


Modified by Jeff @ Tempest at 2:32 PM 7/24/2008

EASY101

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by boosted92 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">


Going from a B16 to a B18 isn't going to effect how high you can rev in any measureable way. You'll run into cam/valvetrain/intake/turbo issues that limit your revs well before the shortblock will give you any problems.

Go with an LS/vtec, and thank me later </TD></TR></TABLE>

this is true...I've seen stock LS and B20 blocks rev past 8k and they were able to do it because the heads were built.

da.nizzle

less torque = less wheel spin

b16bri

I have a fully build but stock sleeved b16a making 454whp and about 300lbs of torque It's a street car and it's fun as hell but ide rather have my b16 with more hp and less torque. On FWD car torque exctually hurts not helps unless your running slicks I have 205/50/15 bfgoodrich drag radials and it will spin 1,2 and the top of 3rd if i want it to. Thats just my opinion tho althos ls/vtec is the best of both worlds ide rather have my b16. Some people on here said you can find b18 blocks for almost nothing were have you guys found them ?

ITR.#1446

i just put this in another post i have but what do you guys think of this guys shortblock that he is selling? seem good ?
https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=2350772

RoadconeTuning

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by boosted92 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Those silly F1 cars have to fit into a max displacement bracket and are also limited on their bore size, to 98mm. If they weren't limited on engine displacement, do you honestly still think they'd be running s 39.7mm stroke? Not a chance.

Going from a B16 to a B18 isn't going to effect how high you can rev in any measureable way. You'll run into cam/valvetrain/intake/turbo issues that limit your revs well before the shortblock will give you any problems.

Go with an LS/vtec, and thank me later </TD></TR></TABLE>

you also forgot the 19k rpm rev cap they have now

HiProfile

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RoadconeTuning &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i think the way most people run, crappy suspension and almost decent tires, the lack of tq would actually help them, its like a ghetto traction control heh</TD></TR></TABLE>

Why would you spend money on internals, then settle for 'ghetto traction control', rather than proper boost control? Maybe "those Silly F1 teams just have it all wrong". BTW if you stuck to F1 standards, you'd never even get into turbocharging.

An 84mm b16 IMO is a bit of a waste. You have to spend virtually the same amount of money building it as you would a B18, but end up with less potential. However the 1.8L B18 can run 4-500whp with stock sleeves, but the 84mm B16 pretty much HAS to be resleeved. A resleeved 81-83mm B18 can also be 'fixed' if **** hits the fan, since you have more material left.

One thing that people aren't telling you is that certain new EMS's can give you controlled boost creep, slower ramp-up to full boost, etc. Basicly a "rich man's traction control", except w/o the pricetag. However with a torque-ier motor you can theoreticly run less boost and make the same torque/hp (since the turbo usually is more efficient).

As mentioned by Jeff@TR, it REALLY depends on the application. For a street car, I'd go with as much displacement as possible. For a race motor, I'd go with whatever gets me the most power. Built right, that ALSO means the bigger motor...