To Kill an H23 (bone yard boost dsm style ... ) advice needed.
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From: Calgary, AB, Canada
To Kill an H23 (bone yard boost dsm style ... ) advice needed.
Ok ... so ..
My h23 is on its last legs... I figure I might as well get some boost experience and try to give her with a DSM manifold and either 14b or t25 .. I've been searching around and my dsm terminology is well.. non existent.
As far as plumbing.. Im not going to run it intercooled.. I *Might* get a v-afc since I plan on going to an all motor H23A vtec, then I guess I could tune it .. but do I really need to since I expect such a short timeline on this engine? (yes I have AMA for towing.) so theres the v-afc hack ..
I'll be running low boost since I'd rather not tow it.. or deal with the inconvenience of breakin down somewhere other than home when the engine goes (and theres a good chance it will)..
so what do I need? .. so far ::
Wastegate -- mystery, will the internal on a T25 or 14B be OK ? if so wicked..
BOV ?? Where should I get a bov...?..
DSM 450CC injectors (am I right on this?)
So .. with my H23 ecu, 450cc injectors.. and dsm turbo..
What else would I need? is engine management really requird?
Do I need some sort of boost controller?
Because theres so little information on this, I'd like to dabble on this a bit and see if we can get some more H23's lighting it up and laughing at n/a H22's
Should be good ..
My h23 is on its last legs... I figure I might as well get some boost experience and try to give her with a DSM manifold and either 14b or t25 .. I've been searching around and my dsm terminology is well.. non existent.
As far as plumbing.. Im not going to run it intercooled.. I *Might* get a v-afc since I plan on going to an all motor H23A vtec, then I guess I could tune it .. but do I really need to since I expect such a short timeline on this engine? (yes I have AMA for towing.) so theres the v-afc hack ..
I'll be running low boost since I'd rather not tow it.. or deal with the inconvenience of breakin down somewhere other than home when the engine goes (and theres a good chance it will)..
so what do I need? .. so far ::
Wastegate -- mystery, will the internal on a T25 or 14B be OK ? if so wicked..
BOV ?? Where should I get a bov...?..
DSM 450CC injectors (am I right on this?)
So .. with my H23 ecu, 450cc injectors.. and dsm turbo..
What else would I need? is engine management really requird?
Do I need some sort of boost controller?
Because theres so little information on this, I'd like to dabble on this a bit and see if we can get some more H23's lighting it up and laughing at n/a H22's
Should be good ..
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Re: To Kill an H23 (bone yard boost dsm style ... ) advice needed. (yohan)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by yohan »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Because theres so little information on this</TD></TR></TABLE>
There is so little information on what parts are needed for a turbo kit? Maybe you havent ever seen that little forum called Forced Induction...
There is so little information on what parts are needed for a turbo kit? Maybe you havent ever seen that little forum called Forced Induction...
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From: northern DRUNKit, ma
Re: To Kill an H23 (bone yard boost dsm style ... ) advice needed. (yohan)
reguardless your going to need some way to add more fuel,
if you use the t25 or 14b they have and internal wastegate, and as for a blow of valve forget it, they arn't really nessisary espeicaly seeing as how you don't think this will last, they are only for compressor life.
if you could hook ip up to a dsm side mount that would work great, but probably the afc hack using some dsm 450s will work fine..
also you need the dsm mani then place your h23 head gasket on the mani and trace the bolt holes that need to be drilled out,
and if you get the stock elbo that comes off of the t25/or14b then you can just cutome a regular exhaust back on not much work.
if you use the t25 or 14b they have and internal wastegate, and as for a blow of valve forget it, they arn't really nessisary espeicaly seeing as how you don't think this will last, they are only for compressor life.
if you could hook ip up to a dsm side mount that would work great, but probably the afc hack using some dsm 450s will work fine..
also you need the dsm mani then place your h23 head gasket on the mani and trace the bolt holes that need to be drilled out,
and if you get the stock elbo that comes off of the t25/or14b then you can just cutome a regular exhaust back on not much work.
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From: Calgary, AB, Canada
Re: To Kill an H23 (prelittlelude)
If the BOV isn't needed.. awesome .. how about pressure ... I know its a small turbo but what can I expect for boost? even like 30-40 HP will make me happy on this dying engine (i'll take a movie clip and post it so you can hear this beast start up ... its enough to make any luder cry - or laugh .. or groan)
Sam1am26: dont be a dick, I searched all over h-t and po.com forced induction forums before posting this and theres really no concrete information on doing the dsm turbo on an H23 .. if you can provide links for this specific application, please do .. I'm up to doing all the reading I can. ...geeze guy gets an h23vtec going and gets all cocky on us
SO:
I will be using a DSM mani as preludelittle described and will modify the bolt pattern (saw that pic loooong ago of the H23 gasket mated up to the DSM mani)
For fuel, will the injectors be enough with aFC hack or will I need to upgrade my fuel pump ? (Also, if I revert back to n/a will I need to change these parts ?)
I'm looking at the cheapest route possible .. and if it works for some time and I can make changes here and there to make it last.. I might try out the F22b2/h23 head combo and put on an I/C and better parts...
Any other foreseeable problems or things I left out ? I'll get an exhaust shop to do the intake and exhaust piping ... I am aware I'll need to tap into an oil source so I guess i'd also need to get an oil pressure gauge because I burn oil like mad ... (up to 4qts per 3000miles !*#%!)
All I want is some boost experience..
(sorry for being a n00b and mods can move this to FI if they see fit .. but this is the best place to get technical information from very knowledgeable people)
Sam1am26: dont be a dick, I searched all over h-t and po.com forced induction forums before posting this and theres really no concrete information on doing the dsm turbo on an H23 .. if you can provide links for this specific application, please do .. I'm up to doing all the reading I can. ...geeze guy gets an h23vtec going and gets all cocky on us
SO:
I will be using a DSM mani as preludelittle described and will modify the bolt pattern (saw that pic loooong ago of the H23 gasket mated up to the DSM mani)
For fuel, will the injectors be enough with aFC hack or will I need to upgrade my fuel pump ? (Also, if I revert back to n/a will I need to change these parts ?)
I'm looking at the cheapest route possible .. and if it works for some time and I can make changes here and there to make it last.. I might try out the F22b2/h23 head combo and put on an I/C and better parts...
Any other foreseeable problems or things I left out ? I'll get an exhaust shop to do the intake and exhaust piping ... I am aware I'll need to tap into an oil source so I guess i'd also need to get an oil pressure gauge because I burn oil like mad ... (up to 4qts per 3000miles !*#%!)
All I want is some boost experience..
(sorry for being a n00b and mods can move this to FI if they see fit .. but this is the best place to get technical information from very knowledgeable people)
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 3,969
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From: northern DRUNKit, ma
Re: To Kill an H23 (yohan)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by yohan »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I will be using a DSM mani as preludelittle described and will modify the bolt pattern (saw that pic loooong ago of the H23 gasket mated up to the DSM mani)
For fuel, will the injectors be enough with aFC hack or will I need to upgrade my fuel pump ? (Also, if I revert back to n/a will I need to change these parts ?)
I'm looking at the cheapest route possible .. and if it works for some time and I can make changes here and there to make it last.. I might try out the F22b2/h23 head combo and put on an I/C and better parts...
Any other foreseeable problems or things I left out ? I'll get an exhaust shop to do the intake and exhaust piping ... I am aware I'll need to tap into an oil source so I guess i'd also need to get an oil pressure gauge because I burn oil like mad ... (up to 4qts per 3000miles !*#%!)
All I want is some boost experience..
(sorry for being a n00b and mods can move this to FI if they see fit .. but this is the best place to get technical information from very knowledgeable people)</TD></TR></TABLE>
well you will need an oil feed and return, if you could get the oil return from the dsm at the junk yard that would work, but you will need a feed line,
and im not sure how much boost the stock dsm's put out, but the aftc hack works well if done right,
your fuel pump should be ok i think, look inot the forced induction forum there is a whole thread about the afc hack, im sure some prelude guys have posted in there, or ask anthony our mod in here,
but then if you ever go back to n/a you can keep the 450s and just tune with the afc.
I will be using a DSM mani as preludelittle described and will modify the bolt pattern (saw that pic loooong ago of the H23 gasket mated up to the DSM mani)
For fuel, will the injectors be enough with aFC hack or will I need to upgrade my fuel pump ? (Also, if I revert back to n/a will I need to change these parts ?)
I'm looking at the cheapest route possible .. and if it works for some time and I can make changes here and there to make it last.. I might try out the F22b2/h23 head combo and put on an I/C and better parts...
Any other foreseeable problems or things I left out ? I'll get an exhaust shop to do the intake and exhaust piping ... I am aware I'll need to tap into an oil source so I guess i'd also need to get an oil pressure gauge because I burn oil like mad ... (up to 4qts per 3000miles !*#%!)
All I want is some boost experience..
(sorry for being a n00b and mods can move this to FI if they see fit .. but this is the best place to get technical information from very knowledgeable people)</TD></TR></TABLE>
well you will need an oil feed and return, if you could get the oil return from the dsm at the junk yard that would work, but you will need a feed line,
and im not sure how much boost the stock dsm's put out, but the aftc hack works well if done right,
your fuel pump should be ok i think, look inot the forced induction forum there is a whole thread about the afc hack, im sure some prelude guys have posted in there, or ask anthony our mod in here,
but then if you ever go back to n/a you can keep the 450s and just tune with the afc.
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From: On the Prowl, Mo
Re: To Kill an H23 (prelittlelude)
i would just run nitrous on that h23 instead of wasting money
on a dsm setup. If you're gonna put an upgraded turbo on your
new engine anyway, why bother with a dsm setup?
then sell the n20 kit when you get the turbo.
you'd probably get faster times w/a 65 shot than you would
putting that small *** turbo on. just my .02
on a dsm setup. If you're gonna put an upgraded turbo on your
new engine anyway, why bother with a dsm setup?
then sell the n20 kit when you get the turbo.
you'd probably get faster times w/a 65 shot than you would
putting that small *** turbo on. just my .02
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Re: To Kill an H23 (SKDRCR)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SKDRCR »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i would just run nitrous on that h23 instead of wasting money
on a dsm setup. If you're gonna put an upgraded turbo on your
new engine anyway, why bother with a dsm setup?
then sell the n20 kit when you get the turbo.
you'd probably get faster times w/a 65 shot than you would
putting that small *** turbo on. just my .02 </TD></TR></TABLE>
very true
it will e less of a hassle. you wont have to make a dp or **** withe manifol etc...
NAWz! is the way to go. give that baby a 75 shot and call it day
on a dsm setup. If you're gonna put an upgraded turbo on your
new engine anyway, why bother with a dsm setup?
then sell the n20 kit when you get the turbo.
you'd probably get faster times w/a 65 shot than you would
putting that small *** turbo on. just my .02
</TD></TR></TABLE>very true
it will e less of a hassle. you wont have to make a dp or **** withe manifol etc...NAWz! is the way to go. give that baby a 75 shot and call it day
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From: Calgary, AB, Canada
The nos statements may be true, but im not going for quarter mile or track times, this is my daily ride ... and I plan on putting an n/a H23A Vtec when this thing is said and done.. then I can sell the turbo parts to somebody else ...
I want solid power and an intro to boost ..
another newb question .. isn't nos just somethin you press a button on thats very temporary ? .. if it only lasts a few seconds then ... whats the point? if i wanted temproary fast I'd go test drive a 350z or something .. it'd be cheaper....
Now if I like the boost .. I can always keep it that way on a new block/head combo and put in the parts to make it last longer..
Anybody have any l inks to some DSM sites I can check out that'll explain their turbo application and show me good close ups of the oil return etc? ..
I want solid power and an intro to boost ..
another newb question .. isn't nos just somethin you press a button on thats very temporary ? .. if it only lasts a few seconds then ... whats the point? if i wanted temproary fast I'd go test drive a 350z or something .. it'd be cheaper....
Now if I like the boost .. I can always keep it that way on a new block/head combo and put in the parts to make it last longer..
Anybody have any l inks to some DSM sites I can check out that'll explain their turbo application and show me good close ups of the oil return etc? ..
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,357
Likes: 1
Re: To Kill an H23 (yohan)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by yohan »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Sam1am26: dont be a dick, I searched all over h-t and po.com forced induction forums before posting this and theres really no concrete information on doing the dsm turbo on an H23 .. if you can provide links for this specific application, please do .. I'm up to doing all the reading I can. ...geeze guy gets an h23vtec going and gets all cocky on us
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Here are some pics of a dsm manifold installed on an h23 in case you wanted to see what it looks like...
Here are some links from my favorites folder...
https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=519053
https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=424045
http://216.127.84.125/~admin1/...f2b9d
http://216.127.84.125/~admin1/...5dfc4
And these I found in 5 seconds by simply searching...
https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=882722
https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=252356
https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=202633
A dick I am not...
Modified by Sam1am26 at 11:22 AM 8/6/2004
Sam1am26: dont be a dick, I searched all over h-t and po.com forced induction forums before posting this and theres really no concrete information on doing the dsm turbo on an H23 .. if you can provide links for this specific application, please do .. I'm up to doing all the reading I can. ...geeze guy gets an h23vtec going and gets all cocky on us
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Here are some pics of a dsm manifold installed on an h23 in case you wanted to see what it looks like...
Here are some links from my favorites folder...
https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=519053
https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=424045
http://216.127.84.125/~admin1/...f2b9d
http://216.127.84.125/~admin1/...5dfc4
And these I found in 5 seconds by simply searching...
https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=882722
https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=252356
https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=202633
A dick I am not...
Modified by Sam1am26 at 11:22 AM 8/6/2004
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 341
Likes: 0
From: Portland, OR
Re: To Kill an H23 (bone yard boost dsm style ... ) advice needed. (yohan)
I'm in the same boat as you 
My brother is going all out on his DSM so I'm getting all of his parts for free!
If you want a BOV I'd suggest the DSM one. It can be had for pretty cheap and is decently reliable.
Not to jack your thread but I have a few questions too. I got a decent amount of knowledge on how the turbos work and everything that I will need for it. The thing that gets me are the vacuum and feed lines.
Since the 14b's are Oil and Water cooled, where should I tap the coolent lines? Also where should I tap the oil feed line?
My brother is going all out on his DSM so I'm getting all of his parts for free!
If you want a BOV I'd suggest the DSM one. It can be had for pretty cheap and is decently reliable.
Not to jack your thread but I have a few questions too. I got a decent amount of knowledge on how the turbos work and everything that I will need for it. The thing that gets me are the vacuum and feed lines.
Since the 14b's are Oil and Water cooled, where should I tap the coolent lines? Also where should I tap the oil feed line?
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