I have increased the wheel size on my 1997 Accord to 215/45-17. I find that on acceleration out of a corner the centering torque it quite high, qiute uncomfortable as a matter of fact. The alignment has been set to stock steeings. I a couple of days I plan on installing a set of Eiback Pro-Kit springs which should lower the car 1.2" - 1.3" and KYB AGX shocks. any suggestions on the numbers I should have the alignment folk dialin ??

Thanks............ Mike

 

What do you mean by centering torque? I have a 4th gen with almost the same size tires. 215-40-17. Unless your autoxing, why would you want anything other than stock alignment? Dont recomend autoxing with 17's btw. At least thats what I heard. I lack that experience.

 

the operative physics term i think you're trying to use is moment of interia...

however, moment of inertia is dependent upon the shape and weight distribution of a rotating mass...

 

buy a large rear sway bar and put it on your car

 

I think by centering torque he means the propensity for the steering wheel to straiten itself out after a turn? Those 17's short, stiff sidewalls will improve your turn in and transient response, but their increased mass suck up every other dynamic of performance.

 

wouldn't that be understeer?

 

Nah I mean like if you're turning, the steering wheel doesn't want to stay turned, it wants to straiten itself out. Like after a turn you loosen your grip on the wheel and it centers itself. I think what he's saying is that it now takes more effort to keep the wheel turned. I dunno.
If he is talking about understeer, then you're right. Stiffen up the rear end with a sway bar and run a higher spring rate in the rear than the front. Before this though, to reduce understeer you might want to experiment with tire pressures. A lower pressure in the rear can result in more sidewall deflection, increased slip angles, and tendency for the rear to want to come around sooner. Some folks also run higher pressure in the rear using the logic that higher pressure equals less contact patch and less grip making the rear break loose sooner.

 

ah, he's referring to torque steer. on Accords, we have open differentials that are designed to drive the power to the wheel with the least grip. so, suppose you enter a hard right turn, you're going to have more pressure on the left wheel, and less pressure on the right wheel. as a result, the open differential will distribute more power to the right wheel; however, once enough power is delivered to the right wheel, the right tire will begin to catch more. as a result, the car will all of a sudden "catch" and pull a little to the right. torque steer is a common performance flaw in front wheel drive cars. Honda corrected it by incorporating ATTS (Active Torque Transfer System) on the 5G Prelude...


[Modified by DunReit, 10:04 AM 10/23/2001]

 

Torque steer is also a factor when you're going strait and flooring it, the wheel tries to turn in your hands due to uneven distribution of torque to the wheels. This problem is greatly alleviated with equal-length axels, which all but the cheapest Hondas have.

 

I may have used the incorrect terminology. From low speed in a turn if I punch it, the car holds the turn fine however, I need to truely hold the steering as the centering force is quite high. At least higher than what I am acustomed too. Thought that I should change the camber toward the negitive (top in ?).

Further, if I could reduce the effectivness of the power steering throughout the range ?????. It is quite tiring after a couple of "soldex" (dexterity) runs.

Or could I make the rear as stiff as possible, which I think would easy the pressure off the front wheels ?.

 

if I am correct in what you are saying try a front strut bar and rear sway bar
I am still knida confused as to what is meant by centering force
if you really want the *** end around lift off the throttle in the turn and tap the brakes, HEHE


[Modified by urbanlegend21, 5:49 PM 10/23/2001]

 

Okay I'm confused.
What do you mean by centering force? Has it got to do with steering wheel effort or the way your entire chassis behaves while cornering?

Up front, negative camber, toe out, and/or positive caster will reduce understeer, but you can't adjust camber or caster on Hondas.

 

Dave, I thought you could adjust both camber and castor on Hondas, just castor adjustment requires control arm modifications?

 

Okay, The steering wheel wants to return to neutral (center) which is very normal, only on my accord I have the sensation that if I let up I'll probably end up going 90 degrees to the left when I want to continue to the right, such is the "steering centering force". This is only during slow speed with hard corning with high power as would be the case in " SOLADEX " competition.

Sorry guys, I can't put it in any other words................ Mike

 

Oh yeah, anything's adjustable with modifications. I just meant the stock Honda suspension.

 

oh yes you are right about that Dave
I think the reason for your sensation of the car wanting to turn that far beyond straightenening out has to do with what Dunreit explained about torque steer. The outside tire has more grip and wants to drive the car that way.

 

too bad our Accords didn't come w/ LSD standard...