Hi guys, after sometime saving and selling my Audi I've decided to join the JDM league and of course I decided to go with Honda. I'm familiar with engines but never built one completely myself.
I'm looking to put at D16Z6 in a -97 Civic Sedan and was wondering if you guys could help me with my parts list? I'm aiming at 300-350whp and using it daily. I'm looking for reliability and the fun-factor.

My Current Plans with the parts:
Ebay Turbo kit
750CC injectors
AEM 340l Fuel Pump
AEM Fuel Rail
P28 with S300 V3

Anymore parts I would need to achieve my goal? If you know better/cheaper alternatives let me know please! My main concern was the engine itself, I was thinking about leaving it stock since I've seen so many people achieve those numbers with same parts on stock engine. However I was thinking I could make it more reliable by changing some parts in the engine, but have no clue what parts. I've never toyed around with a D16, so the Honda Gurus come forth and help a brother out!

 

Make sure you get Bosch EV14 style injectors (ID, FID, FIC, Grams...)

Get a Go-Autoworks turbo kit, not an eBay kit.

Stock fuel rail is fine.

D16 with forged rods/pistons and upgraded valve springs/refreshed head will be fine at 300WHP. Alternatively you could look into swapping something like a B18 or B16 and run it stock at 300WHP.

 

Would you recommend B series over D series? So if I were to go with a B16/B18 or B20 I can leave the engine stock?

 

I would consider about 300, 350WHP max to be the limit of a stock B series.

Hard to say if you should keep the D or do a B swap. The D may be worth keeping, just do Eagle rods (or whatever forged H beam) and Vitara/Nippon/YCP pistons.

If you're trying to do this on a budget, that is.

 

I see, would the D engine still be reliable tho if i get rods amd pistons and get it tuned at 300-350 whp?

 

So many factors play into reliability besides just parts. Pay for a dyno tuning session from a reputable tuner. Assemble the bottom end with proper bearing clearances. Don't run 95+% duty cycle on your injectors.

Go read some of the build threads in the Forced Induction section to see what others have already done and are currently doing. I agree with Chance - don't buy eBay crap...go buy from Go-Autoworks - it keeps your money in the USA and gets you a kit assembled by a fellow Honda enthusiast.

Set realistic goals for your build and stick to them.

 

The research I’ve done hints at that If I were to go with a B series engine I could hit 400hp easily on stock engine with quality parts, not ebay ****. Thoughts?

 

Possible assuming you have good 91/93 octane tune and proper fuel system. I'd keep it closer to 300WHP though on stock rods/pistons.

Like DaX said, there's a lot of factors that can impact the overall "safe" power limit of your build. Once you get a better idea of what parts you intend to use, you can post a comprehensive list and we can give a better estimation of what your limiting factors will be.

 

Based on the kind of questions youre asking, you shouldnt be doing this yet. You have a lot of learning to do.

 

B series stock or built is best way to go. You'll make 300-350 easily, then probably want more and you'll have room to turn it up from there. With a D series you won't, and you'll blow it up.



And dax I run my my injectors at 95%+ all the time. But I also tune my car every time I drive it.

A good tuner can safely "max" out your injectors with the proper protections in place, but ideally you don't want your injectors to be your limiting factor.

 

We can't all be heroes!

 

Yeah I'm one of those who believes "It's all in the tuning" as well

 

Also a good thing to mention would be that I live in Europe.

 

Balor_Gr also lives in Europe and has had a lot of success with turbo Honda builds (I think he uses a B16). He posts often in the Forced Induction section.

bb no pls

I never like going over 80-85% lol, just not something I want to risk.

 

I have moved this to the FI forum as it looks to be an FI build you are after.

This thread isn't specific to engine machine shop specifications or the kind of assembly orientated with machine shop work.
As such it doesn't really fit there and should either be in the FI section or as a car specific build thread.

 

If your going to be doing a swap, the b platform is a stronger starting point and has way more room to grow.

 

ditch the EBAY turbo kit. Yes, there's countless cars that make power off of them. We are talking about longevity here. Go with something reputable like Borg Warner, Garrett, Turbonetics, Precision, etc...

 

My first turbo project I learned as I built it. My first turbo was done on a 2.3L Accord. All I did was install the $100 T3/4 to the $80 log intake. Piped straight to intake. No intercooler. I used a free version of Crome to control the fuel and timing. Burned it straight to an old ECM, later I socketed it for $11 and got some SST chips. swapped in 550cc ebay injectors with bogus lag data. That was fun to baseline them at a control voltage. For not much more than $350, it was a 1 bar system. 15 psi makes a quick Honda.

The $400 headers and $200 CAI's , no?

 

Exactly! Someone that thinks like me, I'm more of a learn while doing it person as well. I will probably learn from my mistakes but It would be nice to keep the mistakes to a minimal hence why I am asking the experienced people here for some input

 

My F23 project was started by hanging that turbo on the front with a log. Downpipe it to the cat. Using engine management.

The stock fuel pump worked fine at stock line pressure. I went up to 1 bar boost. The injectors were increased to 550cc. I never pulled any quarter miles in it or held it at WOT longer than 10-15 seconds. It didnt lean though. Beware.

Man, it was that simple. Went from a 10 second 0-60 to a 5 .

I would say if you are able to install a header, air intake, do an oil change (sandwich adapter), and replace 4 injectors, you are ready. Chip burning is not some huge process. However tuning is an art form.

 

Unfortunately many of those mistakes will lead to a blown motor.

So which method makes more sense...

1.) Learn as much as you can first, build it right the first time with quality parts and enjoy the car for years to come.

or 2.) Try to learn by doing, wasting money on the wrong parts, having to buy new parts, having a car that never runs that great, if at all, and spending much more money and time in the long run having to replace the things you blew up.

I'm not saying either way is right or wrong, just know what you're getting into. I did method 2 my first time, and I wouldn't do it again, even though I got VERY lucky that I never blew that engine.

 

Yeah of course, you have to be cautious unless you have some money to waste. Luckily I will have a experienced mechanic next to me IF i were to ask for help. The only part I needed some advice for was the "parts" part. But what I've understood is that despite all the ebay youtubers saying the turbo kit is good and reliable I should go for a quality kit?

 

Yup. Dont skimp on the internals.. Do NOT skimp on tuning.. Dont go with just a chipped ecu; get Hondata or Neptune and do it right... You **CAN** get a "cheap" turbo kit to learn with, but you'll want more than it will provide.. Upgrade the fuel pump to a walbro high pressure 255 and injectors to 750cc minimum for up to 350whp on 93 pump gas.. Reliable is a touchy subject with me. I dont think reliability JUST depends on part selection but also relies HEAVILY on installation. If you **** up or cut corners, a Garrett can be just as useless as a Chinese knockoff, and if you do it by the letter, a Chinese knockoff can be just as **reliable** as a Garrett (longevity may be another story though).. There are decent no-name items out there, I've had a couple, but still went with quality in the end. I've earned it.. I deserve it.. Do the same.. Patience and research are your friends. I've been collecting parts and rebuilding since October. It's worth the wait..

 

I appreciate the input, that was actually pretty useful. How has your experience been in overall with cheap *noname* turbo kits? Any you could recommend to toy around with?

 

The thing that sucks about D series turbo builds...the transmission.

It can't handle higher HP builds. It seems 350-400hp is the limit. 300 might be safe, but 400 it's a ticking time bomb.

B series swaps are the better way to go, you don't have to build the engine for 300hp, depending on the condition of the engine.

You end up with better gear ratios in stock transmissions, and they hold up better when you start increasing the boost. (don't lie to us, you're gonna start increasing the boost)

The potential when you decide to up the boost and build the engine is much greater than in a D series.

You can have a very safe and reliable DD with a good tune and conservative numbers. 200hp is doubling the output of the engine and will feel like a rocket. Safe for the engine and transmission, and room to grow.