Honda Accord (1990 - 2002) Includes 1997 - 1999 Acura CL

Started with bad radiator now blown head gasket

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Old Apr 23, 2017 | 12:51 PM
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Default Started with bad radiator now blown head gasket

Here's how it went down, I got this 92 Honda Accord. The guys already did a motor swap. New gaskets and such, but on the bottom radiator hose he had a pinky sized hole that he decided to button up with some rubber cement **** and about a mile of electric tape....... now before I found this I drove it and it overheated. I drove it about 5 miles till I was able to park it. Next day we replaced the radiator and the hose after we found the problem. Radiator it's self had a leak along the top as well. The over heating stopped, but now my coolant was coming out the top of my overflow res. And after it drove for about fifteen minutes it was hesitant to start back up. Had to let it sit for a bit. So I pulled into auto zone and decided to check underneath the oil cap and sure as **** it's milky as ****. So my question is, did I blow this new head gasket bc I was a dumbass and didn't try to see if the cooling system was working properly? I'm just trying to narrow it down and make sure I know what I did wrong here, so I don't do something like this again.
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Old Apr 24, 2017 | 08:01 AM
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Default Re: Started with bad radiator now blown head gasket

I believe you're correct. Driving overheated and you blew head gasket and possibly warped the head. (We did the same thing in my son's car, don't beat yourself up too bad.)
"The guys did the motor swap" probably should have seen the patched lower hose though, and flagged it. That's like a $12 part. If you paid for the engine swap, you can at least have that discussion to try and get some help with the fix.
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Old Apr 24, 2017 | 01:00 PM
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Default Re: Started with bad radiator now blown head gasket

Perhaps the motor was already messed up when you bought it.
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Old Apr 24, 2017 | 04:08 PM
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Default Re: Started with bad radiator now blown head gasket

Depends.
If the coolant was not properly purged(bleeder screw on the backside of the thermostat housing) then air would still have been in the system and it would cause an overheating/blown head gasket issue.
If the replacement engine was already junk it could have had a bad head/gasket/whatever. Some people think they can just replace a blown head gasket with no work needed to be done to the engine.
If the lower hose was leaking then it could have been the problem, but usually you would smell or see the steam from the leaking coolant along with the temp gauge going up.
I've walked away from (used)vehicle purchases if the seller gets nervous while letting the car warm up/idle for a few minutes. Sure fire way that something is amiss is a car that will not idle normally while hot without overheating.
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Old Apr 24, 2017 | 04:29 PM
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Default Re: Started with bad radiator now blown head gasket

Originally Posted by MAD_MIKE
Depends.
If the coolant was not properly purged(bleeder screw on the backside of the thermostat housing) then air would still have been in the system and it would cause an overheating/blown head gasket issue.
If the replacement engine was already junk it could have had a bad head/gasket/whatever. Some people think they can just replace a blown head gasket with no work needed to be done to the engine.
If the lower hose was leaking then it could have been the problem, but usually you would smell or see the steam from the leaking coolant along with the temp gauge going up.
I've walked away from (used)vehicle purchases if the seller gets nervous while letting the car warm up/idle for a few minutes. Sure fire way that something is amiss is a car that will not idle normally while hot without overheating.
Well I'm hoping that I just fried the head gasket. I failed to also mention that there was already a new head gasket put on. Whether or not he put it on bc of overheating issues im not exactly sure about that. I'm pretty much over heated it, found that they jerry rigged the bottom hose and we replaced the radiator along with the hose. And it also had a crack. So after that I drove around and it did not over heat at all after the radiator was fixed. Actually ran a little better. As of right now I'm down to unboltig the intake and drawing the coolant from the thermostat. Tomorrow I will be able to tell if this block is fucked or not. And if that's the case then I got a nice project car lol any ideas on motor swaps to make this thing rip?
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Old Apr 24, 2017 | 04:31 PM
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Default Re: Started with bad radiator now blown head gasket

Originally Posted by MAD_MIKE
Depends.
If the coolant was not properly purged(bleeder screw on the backside of the thermostat housing) then air would still have been in the system and it would cause an overheating/blown head gasket issue.
If the replacement engine was already junk it could have had a bad head/gasket/whatever. Some people think they can just replace a blown head gasket with no work needed to be done to the engine.
If the lower hose was leaking then it could have been the problem, but usually you would smell or see the steam from the leaking coolant along with the temp gauge going up.
I've walked away from (used)vehicle purchases if the seller gets nervous while letting the car warm up/idle for a few minutes. Sure fire way that something is amiss is a car that will not idle normally while hot without overheating.
And to be honest I don't think we adjust any screw by the thermostats when we did the radiator. I know we followed the steps in filling it but we did not adjust the bleeder screw.
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Old Apr 25, 2017 | 07:54 PM
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Default Re: Started with bad radiator now blown head gasket

Air needs to be purged, otherwise the engine will overheat and blow the head gasket. It's not the head gasket that fails, its the heat and pressure differential to the head that causes it to soften enough and warp. Head and block deck surfaces need to be parallel and square to each other, even with a new head gasket the head will most likely allow leakage and again another blown head gasket.
Always start an engine and let it warm up after major repairs, if the temp gauge keeps climbing there is an issue with the cooling system or the block/head. Never just repair and drive with engine work.
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Old Apr 25, 2017 | 10:57 PM
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Default Re: Started with bad radiator now blown head gasket

Originally Posted by 92accord1988
And to be honest I don't think we adjust any screw by the thermostats when we did the radiator. I know we followed the steps in filling it but we did not adjust the bleeder screw.
You don't adjust the screw, you crack it open about a half a turn before you fill the radiator while the temperature dial in the car is at full red. As the radiator fills, the rest of the system fills up and it pushes air up and out of that bleeder hole. As soon as coolant starts flowing out of that bleeder bolt you close it and continue filling up the radiator. It's best to have the front of the car jacked up as high as you can.
part 13 here
http://www.hondapartscheap.com/auto-...ater-pump-scat

Failure to bleed the system will allow an air pocket to rest next to the thermostat and the fan switch which will prevent the fans from running.

However, I think it's likely the head was already warped. You can not just slap a new head gasket on an overheated engine and expect it to seal. When the head warps it prevents a proper seal so you have to have the head resurfaced as well.

You need to compression test the engine to see if the head is sealing. It's likely with the overflow overflowing that the head isn't sealing and combustion gases are flowing through the system and out of that.
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Old Apr 26, 2017 | 05:01 AM
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Default Re: Started with bad radiator now blown head gasket

Originally Posted by MAD_MIKE
Air needs to be purged, otherwise the engine will overheat and blow the head gasket. It's not the head gasket that fails, its the heat and pressure differential to the head that causes it to soften enough and warp. Head and block deck surfaces need to be parallel and square to each other, even with a new head gasket the head will most likely allow leakage and again another blown head gasket.
Always start an engine and let it warm up after major repairs, if the temp gauge keeps climbing there is an issue with the cooling system or the block/head. Never just repair and drive with engine work.
Yeah once I found out about that radiator the head gasket went, I drove around for about an hour after we did all the radiator stuff. But once I put the new head gasket on I'm going to take every step possible in making sure it's correct
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Old Apr 26, 2017 | 08:35 AM
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Default Re: Started with bad radiator now blown head gasket

After you pull the head, lay it upside down and see if it's warped. Get a straight edge and lay it edge-wise on the surface (where the gasket would touch). Measure diagonally and along all four edges. See what the max space is between the straight edge and the head surface (almost always in the middle) and measure that distance with a feeler gauge. If the max gap everywhere is less than 0.05 mm/ 0.002 inch then you're OK on the head. If it is between 0.05mm and 0.2mm/ 0.008 inch anywhere (and assuming this head has never been resurfaced before), then you need to have it resurfaced. If the gap between head and straightedge is more than 0.2mm at any point, then you'll need to replace the whole head casting. Page 6-42 of the CD7-CD9 online shop manual refers.
You should also check the block (mating surface under the head gasket) the same way after you clean it off. Should be less than 0.07mm/0.003 inch max gap, with a limit of 0.10 mm/0.004 inch (p.7-17). Usually this is not the problem though.

To resurface a head, a machine shop essentially recuts (deck mill) the mating surface back to flat. As long as they don't have to cut too much (hence the max warpage value), it's not a big deal. There's probably one or more engine shops in your area that is set up to do this.

Now if the head is warped and you DON'T resurface, you're wasting time and money on doing the head gasket. The gasket is not thick enough/strong enough to hold in the cylinder pressure in that kind of gap.
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