Guys,

Quick question on the first time I had the car to the track. Here is a quick run down on the setup:

Stock Sleeve B16A
Built Bottom End and Head, ITR Cams
V-Band Inlet 6266
ITR LSD Trans

Car made 467whp / 290ish tq on 93 octane on the 10th of this month. Took it to the track on the 17th, just a week later, on the same boost level and 93/112 octane mix and 24.5 m/t slicks. Best run of the evening (keep in mind this was the first time I raced the car or even a decently powerful car at the track, to begin with):

60' : 1.863
330' : 5.281
1/8: 7.975
MPH: 94.18
1000': 10.265
1/4: 12.167
MPH: 119.63

Had about 8lbs in the slicks. Preloaded the car w/ the e-brake out of the hole. Does the mph seem low? I would have thought the car would have trapped atleast 125-130 or so with the power the car is making. My tuner, John Kerr, said the mph seems low as well. Unfortunately, I do not have a log, although I should have taken one. The car seemed to be running great and strong, so I don't know what the issue would be. Drove the car to and from the track.

Thanks in advance,

Toby

 

ok so the 60fts could be a little lower but still in all the trap is a bit low.

if it was tuned on straight 93 octane and you dumped in some 112 then thats where your problem lies. 112 will need like 5 or whatever degrees more timing to make the power.

either go back to the dyno with the 112 or run at the track with just the 93 octane. mixing without being tuned for it doesnt really help. if you are concerned about reliability at the track then back the timing down a degree or 2

 

If it really makes 465+ you should near noverre at 130.

 

Thanks for your input. I had a quarter tank of 93 in the car and put three gallons of 112 in. So essentially 3 gallons to 3 gallons. The reason I did that was because my tuner recommended it to me (to make things safer). The tune was not adjusted. This was on a 93 octane tune.

Yeah, that's what I thought.

 

what does the car weigh?

 

correct i was trapping 136mph on 489whp

 

A few years ago my DD (a 2460lb integra) made 340whp on the same dyno (IMW's) and trapped 117mph on that power.

You have a graph?

I'd suggest taking it to the track on straight 93. if you want it on 112, have john retune it and run it on that tune.

 

I never weighed the car, but the car is pretty gutted, minus a steel cage. If I had to guess, I would say around 2,200? Not sure. It isn't very heavy.

Yeah, I will take it back on 93 only. Like I said, John recommended mixing it with 100 or 112 to make it a little safer. I went with that suggestion since he knows his ****. I don't think that he would tell me to do that if he knew the car would run slower, but maybe the fuel does has something to do with it. Who knows.

 

The trap is low. My d16 was trapping 124 mph at 386whp in my ej8.

 

Could mixing 112 with the 93 to create a 50/50 mix on a 93 octane tune really hinder the car's performance?

 

No way mixing the fuel caused that. Something is up. Are u sure the boost at the track was the same as the dyno. Your down about 100 hp. At 467whp should be trapping 130 pretty easily. Check all the basics, plug wires cap rotor and then check for boost leaks.

 

yeah its low, either you were granny shifting slower than a **** and falling out of boost badly each gear or your car is making nowhere near 467whp, lol

My car at 2400 lbs with me in it made 461whp and trapped 130-132 consistently,

But I know what happens when you granny shift and fall out of boost and waste a lot of acceleration time because when i took my car out with 650whp I would bog off the line, then spin, then bog because i would shift too soon and fall out of boost, then spin again, and did that each gear and only trapped 137 and trapped as low as 132 on one run.

So it depends on how much acceleration time you wasted during the run. Slow shifting and/or falling out of the powerband will do that.

But yes you should be trapping near 130. Your trap is way too low for that power.

 

Or it's just a dynapack reading high.

 

poor dynapack numbers

 

Could be a lot of things, but consider your average power in each gear.

If you shift at 8,800 (465whp) and rpm's fall to 6,300 (325whp) your average whp is closer to 395. Spin the tires, bog, shift slow or short shift (causing you to fall further out of the power) and your whp numbers would be lower yet. Knowing the tune was off because of the fuel put you lower than 395whp.

Peak numbers aren't nearly as important as the area under the curve!

 

Thats true, my 461whp numbers were dynapack numbers as well. But I also was on a 2.0L motor as well and was over 400whp by 5500rpm and peaked 461 at 7400 and held over 420whp to 8k. This was on a simple garrett 60 trim t3 .82 hotside at 24psi.

But like i said if you spun or granny shifted the car falling well out of your power range then that can cause really low trap numbers. I know first hand because on my t67 setup my trap speed should have been about 145 or so with 650whp, instead ended up with 137 as my highest.

 

Yep. As stated, either go retune on 112 or hit the track on just 93 octane. Id try the 93 octanne first and see what the results are. Again if you are worried about safety either takethe boost down a few psi or take the ignition timing down a degree or 2.

Also, keep in mind that for every person who posts up some crazy time they ran there are many others that run average #s. The internet can be misleading. Look in my sig, my numbers are similar to yours. That 11.7@126 was done on just 112 about 470hp with a 1.75 60 and sluggish 2-3 upshift weighing 2315 I think it was that day. You are missing 50 to 80ish hp id say. Check boost level, datalogs and again, run the fuel ur tuned on

 

adding the 112 oct fuel in th car will drop your HP levels. You need more timing in the motor with that mixture. Run it straight 93 octane and then come back with results.

 

I love how everyone on the internet is a race car driver.

There's too many factors in a situation like this to point a finger at one and say "There! That's the problem!" The specific gravity of the pump gas is usually lower than something like VP112/C16/etc, so you'll also get a slightly richer condition when that race fuel is being used, not to mention the ignition timing differences needed to make the most power with the different fuel.

So there's one finger.

This is the first car you've ever driven at the track?

There's another finger.

Understand what I'm saying?

 

Thanks for the input, guys. It is much appreciated. If you are interested, please read concerning the dyno numbers:

"We here at IMW hear a lot of talk about how the tuning tool we love, our DynaPack 3000, "reads high", or should be brushed off as "inaccurate."

The picture here depicts two plots from the same car, one from our resident DynaPack hub dyno, and the other from our friends at McNew's Automotive's DynoJet roller dynamometer.

As you can see, at cars of this power level, the difference is trivial. We ...would like to do some testing of a higher powered car (500+) in the future, just for a reference point!"



It's not a question of whether or not the car makes power, but maybe whether it was losing power throughout the runs due to the mixture (which some of you say that it probably was).

Concerning the falling out of boost and shifting slow, I can say that it isn't the easiest task getting the car to shift very fast at high rpm with the stiff *** pressure plate and single disc clutch @ high rpm. However, I wouldn't say that I was "granny shifting." I am at class right now, but when I get home, I will upload an in-car video of the 12.1 run.

Thanks again

 

Lol, yeah, I understand Derek, just wanted to see what others opinions were. I really should have taken a logs of the runs. I know without them it can be hard to discern if there is a problem or not in some instances. I can't see there being anything physically wrong with the car, though. I'll probably just take it back on straight 93, take some logs, and get some more seat time.

Btw, I thought you would like my last post, lol.

 

Doesn't sound right. The car should trap atleast 125 1/4 mile and 95-100 1/8 mile with
467whp. I think driving is one factor and maybe you had a mechanical issue like the Clutha slipping. I really don't know but you need to go over the car and check the logs.

 

Seems low considering it used to trap 117 with over 130 less HP.

More seat time and a better prepped track and im sure you will see some better results if the car is truly making 467hp.

 

Yeah, I do not believe there are any mechanical issues with the car. Not sure if it was just the fuel or what. Next time I will take logs and run it on straight 93.

I'll have the video up in a bit.

 

Check the boost during the run. You might have a leak that occurred after the dyno. Another possibility might be that your clutch is slipping.