Hey guys, just got my Honda running tonight. First fire up. Some specs to help my post
98 civic D16Y8 stock motor
Precision turbo
ID 1000 injectors
4 bar MAP sensor

My issue is the car is running pig *** rich. So rich the garage stunk of unburnt fuel really bad (all three doors open, two in front and one in back) and my wideband is pegged at max rich. When I blip the throttle some the wide band swings up to 14 or so as the rpms drop and then idles at 10 + rich AF again.

I think I'm missing something in the settings for the injectors, just not sure what.

Here's how the injector area looked stock



I had to change the dead times to get the car to start and idle. Anywhere from 1.6 ~ 1.8 area idled fine... well at 1600 rpms and pig rich.

You'll also see I have 895 cc in there. I found that while searching these forums but I did not find the reason behind it. The persons posting just said "it's in depth, just trust us". Well I tried it and 1000 cc in the box.



Here's how my fuel tables looked. I had the car running on the Hondata while it was stock and n/a. It wasn't a perfect tune but it worked pretty good.



Here's how low I got the fuel tonight and the car was still running pig *** rich. Much lower than this and the car would just die and not start up. Clearly I'm missing something.



And yes I did change the Hondata MAP to the 4 bar unit.

Thanks
Malcolm

 

Any ideas? I know there's plenty of people on the board using the S300. Someone must know how to calibrate for larger injectors?

 

You should really contact the dealer you bought the system from for some direct insight.

A remote guess is that it sounds like your cam timing maybe off. Check to make sure everything is at top dead center.

 

I purchased it used from a member on the board. I've tried contacting Hondata directly but they don't offer support to end users.

How can timing make the car run so rich? I did see in the Hondata I need to have timing set at exactly 16 degrees per the Hondata manuals and online documentation. I tried checking it with a timing light but no luck yet. The markings are almost non existent and I wasn't getting anywhere. I may go purchase another timing light and see if it works better.

 

your dead times are way off. use the chart that came with the injectors.

 

Don't have a chart. I emailed support that I found on injectordynamics.com (might be the wrong site) a week ago or so and got no response. Do you have the chart for the ID 1000s that I could use?

I did tinker up and down with the dead times and the 1.6 ~ 1.8 area is where it idled best. Any lower and the car wouldn't even start, when I got up around the 2.0 area it was sounding like it was missing.

 

 

Oh shoot I saw that chart last night while googling around. Those times are in usec (micro seconds) though right not milliseconds right? So where it says for 14 volts at 45 PSI 1000 usec that's 1.0 milliseconds I'd enter into the Hondata right?

 

OK been playing in the garage and I figured it out. It's in the MISC tab. There's an option that says "Invert purge solenoid" it also says "this must be checked for ODB2 and newer, 98 and up to prevent stalling when warm".

Well I had that checked. If I uncheck it my A/F gets corrected immediately. I have the car idling at 14.7 A/F now except it's idling around 1400 rpms. If I check that box idle drops to like 500 rpms but pegs the wideband at max rich and you can just smell the nasty exhaust smell immediately.

Not sure how to get my idle down now or why the car suddenly goes pig rich when I check that box. I had that box checked when the car was stock and it cured my idle issues without messing up the AF ratio. Something's obviously changed under the hood causing that. I'm not even sure where the purge solenoid is under the hood. I need to figure that out and trace it and see if I can fix this problem.

Making progress

 

OK seems the extra hole drilled in the valve cover to vent blow by when in boost is allowing to much air to get sucked through the block and into the valve cover via the original PCV setup. I actually replaced the PCV with an industrial valve that can handle boost.

So I had to remove it and just cap the intake. Here's what was there.



Now the car idles low (although stalls once in a while) and a/f is normal. Well as normal as I'm capable of tuning right now.

 

I noticed your tuning a Y8, I hope your aware of the 12* vs 16* base timing difference.

 

I was just discussing that with some other folks in a different thread. I was thinking my Haynes manual said 13 degrees timing is on my motor? I may have to go back and check. Anyhow is it valid to go into Hondata and just change the software to say 13 or 12 in there (which ever matches my distributor?).
OR
do I have to find a way to get my distributor to 16 degrees somehow?

 

All the basemaps in S300 are based off the Z6 which uses a 16* base timing like the B series. You should be using a Z6 cam pulley and set the timing to 16*BTDC. Then all of the timing maps in S300 will be correct. Note, the center of the 3 white lines on the Y8 crank pulley is 12* not 16*.

 

Is this the only way to do it? If I change inside of SManger "Online" "Set Timing..." and put 12 in there does it not make an adjustment in the software (like 16 - 4) so all the basemaps in the software are still correct?

 

You can do that if you don't have a timing light with advance and use the 12* mark on the pulley, but all of the timing maps are still for a Z6.

 

I contacted Phearable.net where I got some of my Hondata stuff from and they told me on a Y8 motor just set motor to stock 12 degrees and set Hondata to 12 degrees and they're now in sync.

 

Read this:
http://www.d-series.org/forums/engin...d2-timing.html

 

OK I'm understanding now. So even though you can put 12 in the SManager to match my ignition timing my motor will physically be timed different. With a z6 cam gear the valves and pistons will be at a slightly different timing and that's what the odb1 timing maps are written for. Got it.

Humm so time to find a cam gear. Are those super expensive? I guess I need to do some reading up and see what all I need to tear apart to get to it.

 

pm'ed

 

OK after reading a ton of threads on this forum about interchanging Z6 cam and Y8 cam I have come to the conclusion that I will not intermix the two parts.
The cams have the key off set between them 4.5 degrees as do the cam gears which will keep the intake valves in sync with the pistons but off set the distributor. So the Z6 and Y8 will have different base timing. 12* for Y8 and 16* for Z6.

By putting a Z6 cam gear on my Y8 cam I now retard my valves by 4.5* in relation to the pistons at TDC. Yes I've changed my base ignition timing but I've also off set my valves to pistons and that's a mechanical change that cannot be overcome by tune.

The correct thing to do is match a Z6 cam with a Z6 cam sprocket and a Y8 cam with a Y8 cam sprocket and set base timing in your tune.

So in my case I will set base timing of 12* on my distributor and set the S300's base timing to 12 degrees.

 

i dont follow singles but that's some good info

 

Yes, you are correct, Y8 cam Y8 gear, I was going by some information I read a while back.