I'd like to boost..
I recently purchased a 90 crx si (d16), and the purpose of buying this car was to boost it, i dont plan on pushing much more thant 6-7 lbs of boost through it as i treasure reliability over everything. Ive been told that piecing together a kit is the most cost effective manner to do this, but i have no idea where to look, what specs i need to follow (I dont want to buy the parts then start putting it togetther then have something not fit or be the wrong part) I know this is a noob post, but this is something i really wanna do, i'm in the process of making the car stable to hold boost (reg maintenance, belts seals ect) but in May i want to startputting it on and getting it tuned, I was wondering if someone can point me in the direction if a d16 turbo DIY if one exists. But I guess I'm asking for the parts id need (i know the basics eg: turbo, manifold, lines, ect) but I want to make a complete "laundry" list. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Ok, I know you are new to this, but I really suggest you start reading - A LOT - about how to build your own. Even if you get a kit, it's GREAT knowledge to know what's going on.
First, 6-7lbs means nothing. If you use a tiny turbo then you will feed a lot less air than a large turbo at the same psi. Figure blowing into a straw versus blowing into a water pipe - a lot more volume at the same pressure.
Even with similar sized turbo's psi is still not 100%. If one turbo is dramatically more efficient or if your intercooler setup is different than you may see a difference in power.
So - you need to figure out how much horsepower you want to put down. It's rule of thumb to stay under 220hp on a good stock block. However, it's not impossible to push a stock block to 300hp and still have it reliable, BUT it gets very expensive as your tuning has to be incredible. If you have an older/worn block then I would suggest you shoot for something in the 180~200hp range.
First thing I would suggest you do is deal with your tuning system first before adding the turbo. It's very difficult to find anyone that tunes the old PM6 ECU that your car came with. I suggest you convert your electronics from OBD0 to OBD1. There are many companies that sell wiring harnesses to help you through this. Again, search and read. The FAQ sticky at the top of this forum is also great help. Not only will OBD1 be easier to tune, but it will give you more options for your motor choices in the future.
First, 6-7lbs means nothing. If you use a tiny turbo then you will feed a lot less air than a large turbo at the same psi. Figure blowing into a straw versus blowing into a water pipe - a lot more volume at the same pressure.
Even with similar sized turbo's psi is still not 100%. If one turbo is dramatically more efficient or if your intercooler setup is different than you may see a difference in power.
So - you need to figure out how much horsepower you want to put down. It's rule of thumb to stay under 220hp on a good stock block. However, it's not impossible to push a stock block to 300hp and still have it reliable, BUT it gets very expensive as your tuning has to be incredible. If you have an older/worn block then I would suggest you shoot for something in the 180~200hp range.
First thing I would suggest you do is deal with your tuning system first before adding the turbo. It's very difficult to find anyone that tunes the old PM6 ECU that your car came with. I suggest you convert your electronics from OBD0 to OBD1. There are many companies that sell wiring harnesses to help you through this. Again, search and read. The FAQ sticky at the top of this forum is also great help. Not only will OBD1 be easier to tune, but it will give you more options for your motor choices in the future.
Manifold
Turbo
Wastegate (if your turbo doesn't have an internal one)
Dump tube/down pipe (configuration depends on your turbo)
Charge piping
Intercooler
Blow off valve
Lots of couplers and clamps
Boost controller (highly suggested, but not necessary - will allow you to tune for a high number, but turn down the boost for daily driving AND turn it back up when you want a more spirited experience)
Gauges
Upgrade map sensor (depends on boost level and tuning solution)
Sandwich adapter for oil filter
Oil feed line
Oil return line
Oil return nipple for oil pan
Water line and fittings (if your turbo has water option)
Fuel pump
Injectors (650cc for 300hp and 440cc for 200hp)
TUNING TUNING TUNING TUNING TUNING TUNING TUNING TUNING TUNING TUNING TUNING
EDIT - forgot about fuel!
Turbo
Wastegate (if your turbo doesn't have an internal one)
Dump tube/down pipe (configuration depends on your turbo)
Charge piping
Intercooler
Blow off valve
Lots of couplers and clamps
Boost controller (highly suggested, but not necessary - will allow you to tune for a high number, but turn down the boost for daily driving AND turn it back up when you want a more spirited experience)
Gauges
Upgrade map sensor (depends on boost level and tuning solution)
Sandwich adapter for oil filter
Oil feed line
Oil return line
Oil return nipple for oil pan
Water line and fittings (if your turbo has water option)
Fuel pump
Injectors (650cc for 300hp and 440cc for 200hp)
TUNING TUNING TUNING TUNING TUNING TUNING TUNING TUNING TUNING TUNING TUNING
EDIT - forgot about fuel!
Last edited by 4drEF; Feb 4, 2010 at 12:50 PM.
It's a rebuilt block, but I still understand constraints. I'm attending an out of town college ( Indiana university) and am buying parts now to put together when I'm out of school in may. I purchased the book on turbocharging that was mentioned on a previous thread earlier today and plan to read it cover to cover. I was thinking Garrett t3/t4 or turbonetics ( not sure what brand to get) id almost rather get a kit just for ease but I'm still not sure
T3/T4s with the right trims work well on these engines.
With the T3+ you will typically see a bit more lag as your boost is found higher in the RPM range than if you were to use a smaller turbo like a TD04.
Something to consider if you want the boost off-the-line or more towards the mid-range of your RPM. A turbo that generates full boost lower in the RPM ranges will max out in the high RPM and not offer the same results as you find with the larger turbo. The smaller turbo is what you typically find in the kits for the D-series engines (TD04 and T25s). These can take you up to a safe and streetable power for your stock engine. Not saying the T3 can't as well, but you just get some lag to deal with.
With the T3+ you will typically see a bit more lag as your boost is found higher in the RPM range than if you were to use a smaller turbo like a TD04.
Something to consider if you want the boost off-the-line or more towards the mid-range of your RPM. A turbo that generates full boost lower in the RPM ranges will max out in the high RPM and not offer the same results as you find with the larger turbo. The smaller turbo is what you typically find in the kits for the D-series engines (TD04 and T25s). These can take you up to a safe and streetable power for your stock engine. Not saying the T3 can't as well, but you just get some lag to deal with.
I think id like more towards the low-mid range, as I4's typically lack in low end power, and as i said im not lookin to push too much through it, ive just always wanted to boost a honda, and now i have the funds to do so. As I said, I would like to push 6-7 lbs, then after that ill go to engine mods and go from there as far as bumping up the boost goes. Does brand name intercooler piping matter very much? I know the brand of turbo does as far as quality and reliability goes, but not sure on the i/c, piping, BOV, wastegate ect.
ic piping is not a big deal with most kits you buy the piping will have to be cut and modified anyways. The "name brand" might just need less cutting and a better fitment. you want to make sure your intercooler is good and your running a good turbo
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http://www.kcsr.org/showthread.php?t=43061
this guy has some legit stuff for pretty decent prices for a d series
this guy has some legit stuff for pretty decent prices for a d series
Break the habit of trying to determine your goals by '6-7 lbs'.
PSI is the wrong term for setting up your system.
I know you already mentioned your idea of using the T3/T4, but until you are 100% sure what turbo, trims, intercooler, etc. you are going with for your application and goals then stick to figuring out what horsepower you want to put down at the wheels.
should be very attainable with a t3/t4 setup and a good tune....if you got the right parts to support that goal, you should be able to reach it no probs...but with boost, ur always gonna have problems.....
If you have the money and honestly think you will mod the engine for boost to really see that 250~300 then don't go with the smaller turbo.
Smaller turbo will save you some money, but it won't make it anywhere near 300 hp.
I've seen them tuned to the low 200's and that seemed like it was a lot to ask from the small turbo.
Besides the turbo and intercooler that gsnickets stated before, also don't cheap out on the exhaust manifold.
Smaller turbo will save you some money, but it won't make it anywhere near 300 hp.
I've seen them tuned to the low 200's and that seemed like it was a lot to ask from the small turbo.
Besides the turbo and intercooler that gsnickets stated before, also don't cheap out on the exhaust manifold.
so I was looking online at some kits, and I am sceptical of the price, but if the turbo is junk, i can jus get the size/brand turbo i want for still cheaper than the other kits ive seen. Any Opinions on the quality of this kit, like i said i can get a different turbo/manifold to bolt on, but it'll have all of the other parts ill need : http://www.ssautochrome.com/level.itml/icOid/1629
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