Lean under load

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Old Feb 8, 2009 | 11:57 AM
  #1  
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Default Lean under load

I am having alot of trouble getting the car get to target a/f above columns 8, however i can tune for 14.7 for part throttle with no problems.

No matter how much fuel i add it wont richen up in columns 8 on into boost columns. I also added a inline pump and set base pressure at 70psi. Still wont get down to 11.8 in the boost columns. I got to the point where i went to an extreme and just added 100% fuel and still just spikes 14+ a/f under load, sometime even 17's.I have an intank pump feeding an inline and 1000cc injectors. Base pressure is around 70 psi.

I also tried cleared security, tried a friends k-pro, put new plugs, took apart my FPR, injectors, and fuel filter and still the problem consists.

Map sensor is AEM 3.5 bar

Could it be my PC or k manager being currupt b/c it just doesnt want to do anything when it goes into boost.l

Last edited by jdmdc529; Feb 10, 2009 at 01:10 PM.
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Old Feb 8, 2009 | 11:59 AM
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Default Re: Lean under load

can you log fuel pressure ?
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Old Feb 8, 2009 | 12:44 PM
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Default Re: Lean under load

you need to watch your fuel pressure as you go into boost. Sounds like you either have a pump issue, or your not getting good boost signal to your FPR. .
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Old Feb 8, 2009 | 04:26 PM
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Default Re: Lean under load

You're not using an OEM wideband for tuning, are you?

- Derek
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Old Feb 8, 2009 | 04:28 PM
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Default Re: Lean under load

Ahh, thats a good point I didn't think of that... Had a customer the other day with a JRSC'd K that was "tuning" his own car with the internal wideband.. ended up being about 15:1 everything above 6K under boost luckily we caught it while doing some general maintenance for him and convinced him to let us tune it lol..
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Old Feb 8, 2009 | 04:39 PM
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Default Re: Lean under load

Originally Posted by DaveF
can you log fuel pressure ?
No sir.

I am going to run a line inside the car so i can check it.

I been cought up in the fire academy so the little time i have off i work on my car

Originally Posted by D-Rob
You're not using an OEM wideband for tuning, are you?

- Derek
Yes i am using the factory wideband
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Old Feb 10, 2009 | 05:39 AM
  #7  
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Default Re: Lean under load

Put another wideband in it.

Trust me.

I had a customer two weeks ago that I myself made the mistake of trusting the OEM wideband. The sensor kept reading leaner and leaner, regardless of the stupid amount of fuel I was adding.

Slapped another wideband in it, and it was actually VERY rich.

- Derek
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Old Feb 10, 2009 | 08:07 AM
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Default Re: Lean under load

So...the car in question is the EG in your sig?

AFAIK, the only pre-01 Honda Civics that had a factory WIDEband were the VX/HX models. Everything else uses a narrowband. If you look at a narrowband voltage chart, its so UN-linear that its almost impossible to read anything besides 14.7, very rich, or very lean. It was only intended to target 14.7, never a wide range - hence the name.

Considering an LC-1 is all of $150 from most venders, and most tuning software works great with it, I don't see why the average turbo kit, which costs $2000, should go without one. That's just 7.5% more you're spending.
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Old Feb 10, 2009 | 01:07 PM
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Default Re: Lean under load

Originally Posted by D-Rob
Put another wideband in it.

Trust me.

I had a customer two weeks ago that I myself made the mistake of trusting the OEM wideband. The sensor kept reading leaner and leaner, regardless of the stupid amount of fuel I was adding.

Slapped another wideband in it, and it was actually VERY rich.

- Derek
Makes sense. I will try another wideband

Originally Posted by HiProfile
So...the car in question is the EG in your sig?

AFAIK, the only pre-01 Honda Civics that had a factory WIDEband were the VX/HX models. Everything else uses a narrowband. If you look at a narrowband voltage chart, its so UN-linear that its almost impossible to read anything besides 14.7, very rich, or very lean. It was only intended to target 14.7, never a wide range - hence the name.

Considering an LC-1 is all of $150 from most venders, and most tuning software works great with it, I don't see why the average turbo kit, which costs $2000, should go without one. That's just 7.5% more you're spending.
I have a k series, their factory primary o2 sensors are widebands
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Old Feb 12, 2009 | 07:12 AM
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Default Re: Lean under load

well i put in a buddys wideband and solved the problem, lol. I guess when i had ordered the wideband from acura i recieved the wrong one.

I did a couple datalogs and the battery voltage is real choppy and drops up top and starts to misfire.

I have an odyssey battery in it and i believe my alt. is good.

If any one wants to check out a datalog i would be happy to send it. thank you
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Old Feb 12, 2009 | 07:42 AM
  #11  
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Default Re: Lean under load

Originally Posted by jdmdc529
well i put in a buddys wideband and solved the problem, lol. I guess when i had ordered the wideband from acura i recieved the wrong one.

I did a couple datalogs and the battery voltage is real choppy and drops up top and starts to misfire.

I have an odyssey battery in it and i believe my alt. is good.

If any one wants to check out a datalog i would be happy to send it. thank you
If you got a reading at all on the primary O2 sensor, it's the correct sensor. They just *ahem* suck.

- Derek
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Old Feb 12, 2009 | 08:33 AM
  #12  
sander's Avatar
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Default Re: Lean under load

Still should check your fuel pressure as dave stated. High power cars always benifit from larger fuel pump wiring and a standalone relay if you indeed have an electrical issue.
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Old Feb 12, 2009 | 09:05 AM
  #13  
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Default Re: Lean under load

Originally Posted by jdmdc529
well i put in a buddys wideband and solved the problem, lol. I guess when i had ordered the wideband from acura i recieved the wrong one.

I did a couple datalogs and the battery voltage is real choppy and drops up top and starts to misfire.

I have an odyssey battery in it and i believe my alt. is good.

If any one wants to check out a datalog i would be happy to send it. thank you
above 3000rpms what is your voltage

most likely its your alternator
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Old Feb 12, 2009 | 10:55 AM
  #14  
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Default Re: Lean under load

Originally Posted by b20beast83
above 3000rpms what is your voltage

most likely its your alternator
In the beginning of my datalog at WOT battery voltage went from 13.4v@3k to 14.0v@3.5k, then throughout the rest of the pull it would vary from 13.5v to 12.1v
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Old Feb 12, 2009 | 11:01 AM
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Default Re: Lean under load

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Old Feb 12, 2009 | 11:38 AM
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Default Re: Lean under load

Originally Posted by jdmdc529
That voltage graph looks just like a car we have in the shop here.

Looks nothing like any of the RSX's or other K-Swapped cars we've ever had in here.

Said car also has a strange tip-in issue that seems impossible to resolve.

- Derek
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Old Feb 12, 2009 | 04:35 PM
  #17  
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Default Re: Lean under load

i have the exact same problem

im wondering if its the alternator
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Old Feb 12, 2009 | 04:35 PM
  #18  
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Default Re: Lean under load

i have the exact same problem

im wondering if its the alternator
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