Hello,

I'm about to build in my JRSC with a 11 psi alternator pulley and don't know how to start the whole process in order not to mess something up. I've never done this before so I would be glad to get help from anyone having experience in this.

I have a NTK UEGO, with no wideband gauge, only the controller. The WB is already built in, right after the original narrowband sensor. I want to take the WB out after tuning so I think that was sensible.

My motor is a B16A2, I will run a P1H ECU (english OBD1 from a dohc vtec del sol) with uberdata. The motor is still stock. I had the idea of monitoring the engine before the modifications, so I know how the figures look like when it's stock. With the stock OBD2 ECU. Does that make any sense to you experienced guys? I also want to test my WBO2, since I bought a used one and I'm not sure if it reads properly or not.

Now the actual questions:
Is it possible to monitor the Wideband before converting to OBD1 ECU? If yes, how would I do it? How would I get the data to my laptop without connecting it to the ECU? Would that pay off, anyway? I mean is the data of the stock measurements worth the hassle? Or should I put in my OBD1 right away?
Can I put in the OBD1 ECU without changing the ROM?
I saw a possibility of using both narrowband and wideband O2 sensors at the same time by connecting the WB to a unstuffed input in the ECU called the "C42". Has anyone done this?

That's all I can think of now, but I'm sure more questions will come up during the process.

Thanks a lot for helping!

 

“Hello, I'm about to build in my JRSC with a 11 psi alternator pulley and don't know how to start the whole process in order not to mess something up. I've never done this before so I would be glad to get help from anyone having experience in this?”
Not with JRSC, but I turbo’d my Si this past winter, I’ll try to help as much as I can
“I have a NTK UEGO, with no wideband gauge, only the controller. The WB is already built in, right after the original narrowband sensor. I want to take the WB out after tuning so I think that was sensible. “
So If I’m reading this right, you have an extra bung welded in the pipe and the wideband is behind the stock narrowband?
“My motor is a B16A2, I will run a P1H ECU (english OBD1 from a dohc vtec del sol) with uberdata. The motor is still stock. I had the idea of monitoring the engine before the modifications, so I know how the figures look like when it's stock. With the stock OBD2 ECU. Does that make any sense to you experienced guys? I also want to test my WBO2, since I bought a used one and I'm not sure if it reads properly or not.”
That’s actually a good idea. I wanted to get a wideband and run it in the stock car before I turbo’d just to see where the A/F ratios were. I never got to do it though.
“Now the actual questions:
Is it possible to monitor the Wideband before converting to OBD1 ECU?”
Yes.
“If yes, how would I do it?”
Since your WB controller does not have a display, you need to find a WB display of some sort. Places that sell WB’s have separate gauges for sale.
“How would I get the data to my laptop without connecting it to the ECU? Would that pay off, anyway? I mean is the data of the stock measurements worth the hassle? Or should I put in my OBD1 right away?”
The WB will not go to the ECU since you are still using the stock NB gauge. Besides, the A/F ratio is the only thing you can monitor anyway. You cannot get any measurements off the stock ECU so there’s no hooking the laptop to it.
“Can I put in the OBD1 ECU without changing the ROM?”
No, you must burn the program specific to your engine.
I saw a possibility of using both narrowband and wideband O2 sensors at the same time by connecting the WB to a unstuffed input in the ECU called the "C42". Has anyone done this? “
I have not heard of this. Most people who run both sensors just have the wideband completely separate from the ECU. To tune and monitor the WB from the ECU connected to a laptop requires the WB signal going into the stock O2 input.
With my car, I removed the stock narrowband sensor and replaced it with the wideband. This saved me from having to weld an extra bung on the car. My wideband has a display so I can keep an eye on it all of the time. The controller has two outputs. One output is a WB signal that goes to the ECU when I want to datalog. The second output is a simulated NB signal that goes to the ECU the rest of the time. Only one or the other can go to the ECU at any given time. Both cannot go to the ECU at the same time. When the WB signal is going to the ECU, the ROM must have Closed Loop disabled so the ECU will not reference the o2 sensor. Otherwise this will throw a CEL.
Read and research as much as possible before you do anything. Research sparkplugs, crankcase venting, relocating the MAP sensor so it can see boost, larger fuel injectors, intake, exhaust and header options, etc etc..

 

Hey, thanks!

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Buzzbomb &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
So If I’m reading this right, you have an extra bung welded in the pipe and the wideband is behind the stock narrowband?
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yes, that's right. The extra bung was already on my cat-replacement pipe so I made use of it.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Buzzbomb &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
“Can I put in the OBD1 ECU without changing the ROM?”
No, you must burn the program specific to your engine.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
What if the engines are almost the same? Will a B16A1 ROM work on a B16A2?

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Buzzbomb &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
My wideband has a display so I can keep an eye on it all of the time. The controller has two outputs. One output is a WB signal that goes to the ECU when I want to datalog. The second output is a simulated NB signal that goes to the ECU the rest of the time.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
My controller has both outputs, too. What I don't understand yet: Did you have to disconnect the NB signal and then connect the WB signal by hand when you wanted datalogging?

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Buzzbomb &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Only one or the other can go to the ECU at any given time. Both cannot go to the ECU at the same time.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
As I said, I think there is a possibility with the "C42" input. I found an article about it at pgmfi.org: "You could use this input as a 0-5V input for a wideband O2 data, leaving the stock O2 sensor input for the narrow band O2 data."
link: http://www.pgmfi.org/twiki/bin...ensor

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Buzzbomb &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Read and research as much as possible before you do anything. Research sparkplugs, crankcase venting, relocating the MAP sensor so it can see boost, larger fuel injectors, intake, exhaust and header options, etc etc..</TD></TR></TABLE>
Thanks! I think i already figured out the most of it. I read that with every 100 HP added you should go with one a step colder spark plugs. Since I'm aiming at 250 HP, the BKR7E-N-11 should be fine. I also have a set of 440cc Precision injectors ready to be built in. The intake will be a short ram, as far as I researched it is the best choice for a JRSC setup. Regarding the exhaust I'll have 2.5" piping and a Kamikaze or DC Header with a 2.5" collector. If I'll use a cat, it will be a steel-core converter. Not sure about the MAP sensor and the crankcase venting though... Is it necessary to change the MAP sensor if I'll only make 11 psi? Doesn't it read boost up to 1.2 bar or so by default? What should I consider regarding the venting of the crankcase?

 

here is a good article: http://www.importbuilders.com/tuningacar.htm

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Roky &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">What if the engines are almost the same? Will a B16A1 ROM work on a B16A2??</TD></TR></TABLE>

Yes, it should work.


<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Roky &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">My controller has both outputs, too. What I don't understand yet: Did you have to disconnect the NB signal and then connect the WB signal by hand when you wanted datalogging??</TD></TR></TABLE>

Right, when I want to datalog I unhook the NB input, plug in the WB, and put in the chip with closed loop disabled and then do my datalogging. When I'm done I switch back.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Roky &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">As I said, I think there is a possibility with the "C42" input. I found an article about it at pgmfi.org: "You could use this input as a 0-5V input for a wideband O2 data, leaving the stock O2 sensor input for the narrow band O2 data."
link: http://www.pgmfi.org/twiki/bin...ensor</TD></TR></TABLE>


I have not heard of this so I can't comment on it.


<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Roky &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Not sure about the MAP sensor and the crankcase venting though... Is it necessary to change the MAP sensor if I'll only make 11 psi? Doesn't it read boost up to 1.2 bar or so by default? What should I consider regarding the venting of the crankcase?</TD></TR></TABLE>

The sock map sensor is good for up to 11psi then it maxes out and throw's a CEL. You'll probably be OK with the stock one.

There is alot of extra blowby from FI and the stock system is no longer adequate. Search for threads by "dasher" under both the recent and archived files and you'll find 2 good threads about crackcase venting.

You sound like you have a solid idea what you need to do. Your project should go well.

 

OK, thanks a lot.

And thanks to you, too BoostedEG6, great info on tuning there...

 

One more thing, could I use the NB-simulated-out on the controller to connect it with an ordinary A/F gauge? I have a Defi gauge, which shows absolute figures but it is not a wideband gauge... Would the shown numbers be correct and the same as on a wideband gauge connected to the WB-out?

 

No problem