ok guys i got the car all running , finally got time to work on it. double and tripple checked the tps wiring and its correct , green wire to 1, red wire to 2 , and yellow wire to 3. map is connected and there are no vac leaks that i can find. car runs like absolute crap . the car is on a crome map from redzones race car . we both have very similar setups. it sounds like it has a horrible vacuum leak . it sits at like 1500 and fluctuates horrible . any part throttle and the car dies its completly undrivabe. what do i need to check????

 

I told you it would run like ****. Just to make ABSOLUTELY SURE (it never hurts to check), check the TPS voltage at the ECU to make SURE youve done everything correctly. Map switching is not as easy with individual throttl'ed cars as it is with manifold setups due to extreme sensitivity of MAP and TPS readings.

 

Is your map sensor hooked up to a separate plenum, or a vacuum manifold? Does each throttle body pull the same vacuum? I've seen ITB cars do good with this as well as a dyno tune with hondata S300.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Combustion Contraption &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I told you it would run like ****. Just to make ABSOLUTELY SURE (it never hurts to check), check the TPS voltage at the ECU to make SURE youve done everything correctly. Map switching is not as easy with individual throttl'ed cars as it is with manifold setups due to extreme sensitivity of MAP and TPS readings. </TD></TR></TABLE>

ill have to check to make sure it gets 5 volts im not sure on that one . but i still have my vafc hooked up and it shows tps and its lookin good , it only opens to 84% but i can fix that later.

its very wierd , i reversed the yellow and the green wire on the tps , it ran better but misfired bad. unplugging the injectors one at a time , showed little difference . only when i unpluged the 3rd runner injector did it stutter and run like crap. 2 and 1 showed no difference and when i unplugged 4 the rpm's raised...... just to clarify the tps wiring . green goes to 1, red goes to 2 and yellow goes 2 3 right? these are the 2000 series , the map is installed on the #1 runner , and the cars map i have was tuned with tps anyway......

 

If you are running the twm's that have a map mounting point on one side of the t bodies it will not run right. I don't know what twm was thinking but to remedy the problem we had to drill and tap each individual runner about 2 inches from the head and run a line from each runner to an acumulator on the firewall and mount the map sensor on this accumulator. This is the only way that the map sensor will not get a pulsing vacc. Signal.
Chris Whitfield

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by HOOKUPS &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">If you are running the twm's that have a map mounting point on one side of the t bodies it will not run right. I don't know what twm was thinking but to remedy the problem we had to drill and tap each individual runner about 2 inches from the head and run a line from each runner to an acumulator on the firewall and mount the map sensor on this accumulator. This is the only way that the map sensor will not get a pulsing vacc. Signal.
Chris Whitfield</TD></TR></TABLE>

even though the map i have was tuned tps?

 

Just because the other map was 'tuned' via TPS, youre ECU is still reading its own MAP signal and throwing your engine into its own column in the fuel and ignition table. Unless your engine pulls exactly the same vacuum as the other engine, its going to run a bit different.

 

The way crome works it reads your map sensor untill you reach 20% throttle then goes to only tps readings thus keeping good partial throttles

 

ahhh i see what u mean. but would that render the car completly undrivable?

 

Pretty much because when we tried to tune on tps with (crome before we figured out that for partial throttle and idle it still uses map sensor) crome the spot that we were tuning was not even close to where the car was running at.. Basically the ecu would jump into a lot higher part of the map than we were tuning. Fix the map problem with the accumulator and you should be good to go .

 

with mine, it turned out to be the IM gasket sucked, and was causing vac problems...something to check

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Nick M &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">with mine, it turned out to be the IM gasket sucked, and was causing vac problems...something to check</TD></TR></TABLE>

ya i might get a stock gasket from honda and try that.

 

If you run the MAP sensor off of the ITB location, it will not run. This has been said before in this thread, and is the absolute truth. Do not even bother trying to get the car to run while using that location.

We are testing TWM 50mm on my motor and tried getting it to run with the MAP located on the ITB's and it would sputter and run like sh*t. We put on my Golden Eagle vacuum manifold and tapped the runners as HOOKUPS mentioned and ran the MAP directly off of the GE manifold and it is a night and day difference.

I also highly recommend that you add a third helper spring to help prevent the throttles from sticking.

 

imma work on a vac accumulator definatly.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Hella_JDM &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
ya i might get a stock gasket from honda and try that.</TD></TR></TABLE>

What are you using now? I was using a Hondata IM gasket and the vac leak was horrible.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Nick M &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">What are you using now? I was using a Hondata IM gasket and the vac leak was horrible.</TD></TR></TABLE>

thats exactly what i have i think im gonna ditch it.

 

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Nick M &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> </TD></TR></TABLE>

i have to take the itb's off anyway . when i was torquing the bolts down to the head , the bolt closest to the dizzy, i was tightning and the gasket shifted and cracked the itb's at the base . so i have to ******* weld that **** . good for nothing ******* gasket.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Hella_JDM &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

i have to take the itb's off anyway . when i was torquing the bolts down to the head , the bolt closest to the dizzy, i was tightning and the gasket shifted and cracked the itb's at the base . so i have to ******* weld that **** . good for nothing ******* gasket.</TD></TR></TABLE>

damn waht dou mean the gasket shifted? taht sucks

 

yeah I made a post a while ago regarding these problems with the 2000 series TWMs on sheepey's car:

https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1548326

as Chris (HOOKUPS) said the problem is that even when tuned on TPS, crome still uses MAP at partial throttle opening.

SO the car can run okay at full throttle but when you actually try to drive it around, it's almost undriveable. you mentioned that the map you have is from a race car so they probably didn't notice, you don't have to worry about partial throttle driveability too much on a race-only setup...

 

very very true . ill have to get the ball rolling with the accumulator . thanks for all the help guys.

 

Not a prob