so after this thread came up, https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1242683 , it reminded me of something i thoguht of a while ago.

in the SCCA IT ranks you can't have ABS, so would the ITA 92-95 civic SI/EX have to switch to the non ABS caliper, or would they be able to keep the ABS caliper since it isn't a part of the ABS system?

maybe the rules state something i messed, but the way i see it, is the ABS cars still have the advantage over the non ABS cars, in this case.

 

I'd be curious to know too. I'm thinking about starting a 95 coupe ITA project someday. Either way I'd be better off with a non-ABS car, but I'd still like to know which calipers I can use.

 

You can re-read the rules online. It is also possible to get an answer from Tech in Topeka. Keep in mind that the "spec line" for your car governs a numbr of things. It is also well understood that-if it does NOT say you can you CAN'T. With that in mind see what the rule regarding calipers and rotors says for your specific car.

 

just disable the ABS and keep your calipers and all the stuff on.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ITAcelica &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">just disable the ABS and keep your calipers and all the stuff on. </TD></TR></TABLE>

What he said. All you have to do is remove/disable the wheel sensors per the rule, or somehow else render the ABS system inoperable (pull a fuse?) I'm not sure, cuz my 95 Civic is the non-ABS type, so I didn't have to worry about it.

 

pull the fuse and you will pass tech.

 

I guess my question was alittle vauge, but according to you guy the ABS car has an advantage over the non abs car. right?

 

On that specific Civic, the cars that came with ABS had larger front calipers and rotors, basically the same brakes as the 3rd gen Integras. The non-ABS versions had standard Civic brakes. If you are really building the car for IT, you want to remove all the ABS stuff for the weight reduction. The controller and stuff is heavy and up front where you REALLY want to take weight off.

 

After consulting Das Book, you can see front brakes for a 94-95 EX coupe are listed as 262mm, or 10.3". So it seems that you can run this size rotor and the larger caliper on any EX, even the non-abs cars with smaller brakes.

 

Careful here - we are dealing with the classic ITCS convergence of seemingly conflicting rules...

** You MUST disable ABS if your car came with it.

** If your car ONLY came with ABS, you can't remove all of that ABS junk under the hood - allowed only if you are invoking the up- and back-date rule.

** If you do update/backdate, it must of course be (a) full assemblies, (b) from another car on the same spec line. The operative interpretation is that a "brake system" is an assembly - MC, lines, calipers, rotors, and all associated parts.

** You can of course legally change some of that stuff - lines, prop valves.

** You can't simply swap master cylinders, for example

** What I think I hear proposed here is either...

(a) Updating a non-ABS car with an entire ABS system, then removing the ABS junk you don't want - not legal.

(b) Just swapping calipers/rotors from one car on the spec line to another, without taking the entire brake system assembly - not legal.

If you want to run the bigger rotors/calipers, you get to carry the ABS stuff around. If you want to ditch that crap, you get the smaller rotors/calipers. Now, I'm NOT saying it makes sense but that's the way the rules come together.

Kirk (who REALLY wants to see one of those EX's out there)

EDIT - If there are two different rotor sizes available on the car, it's actually MY fault that they both aren't listed in the ITCS. When I did the research to list the car, I didn't find any indication that this was the case. The presence of the larger (I assume) dimension there is NOT sufficient to allow IT rules to be ignored. If you want to run a non-ABS car, tell Jeremy T. in Topeka that I'm a dork when you submit a request to have the spec line amended under Errors and Omissions, to include both rotor sizes: The ironic thing is that you COULD be found technically out of compliance if you ran the smaller ones that aren't listed.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Knestis &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Kirk (who REALLY wants to see one of those EX's out there)
</TD></TR></TABLE>

How's this, Kirk?

In "prep" trim:


In race trim:


With Pops truckin' along beside the car.

 

you don't have to update/backdate to an ABS car to get the 10.2" front brakes, the non-ABS coupes came with those brakes already.

are the coupes and hatches on the same line? if so, you can get the rear discs from the hatch without ABS. or, you can start with an Si hatch and put the 10" front brakes on off of the non-ABS coupes and pay a bit more for pads.

has anybody else figured out the tranny's? there is an oddball out there that is undetectable until you tear it apart. i've got one, and i can build another that is even better and still undetectable beyond i'll be faster then anyone else in a straight line.

kirk, get me the money to build a car and you can see another one. i've got a choice of chassis to start from and enough spares and ud/bd parts to build a killer machine. that $$$ stuff is a little scarce for me though.

nate

 

The hatch and coupe are on separate lines:



Are you sure the non-abs coupes came with 10.3" brakes? I know they have rear drums, but I thought they also had the smaller front brakes as well. I'll have to pull a wheel off the prospective coupe I'm looking at the next time it's around.

 

What's the difference between a 94 Civic Si (2nd listing) and a 94 Civic Si VTEC (7th listing)? Was there a mid-year change?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Crack Monkey &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">What's the difference between a 94 Civic Si (2nd listing) and a 94 Civic Si VTEC (7th listing)? Was there a mid-year change?</TD></TR></TABLE>

I've been trying to figure out the same thing. It list the wheelbase, front rotors and intake valves as different. Other than the rotor size given with/out ABS, it's my understanding that there is no difference for any 92-95 Civic SI. Oh yeah, the weight is different too but again, I don't know why.

 

It's possible that the comp committee received two separate requests for the same car, but there were enough differences (errors) in the specs, even down to how the models were listed on the request forms, that they thought they were two different cars, and listed them as such. Has been known to happen in the past.

I believe in the '04 GCR, there were two separate listings for the 92-94 Civic EX Coupe, and the 94-96 Civic EX Coupe VTEC. Obviously the the 96 is a different generation, and the 92-94 are the same car as the 94-95.

 

We've been around and around the ITCS Civic inconsistencies here but nobody has bothered to file the paperwork to get them fixed. That's a result of different people asking for different cars to be listed, at different times. If someone would file a nice summary of the mish-mash under E&O, it could be fixed.

K

EDIT - white race cars RULE, Darren but my heart is one with the next generation Coupe.