I assume the bedding process is the same for a pad that is going to be removed and put back on the disc periodically? I'd love to have two sets of rotors, but that's not gonna happen anytime soon, so I want to make sure i don't need to bed each time i put the pads on (I understand that my first track session should be a "take it easy" one to get the brakes to mate well, but I do that anyway). Thanks!

 

what pads are you using? I'm using the Carbotech Panther Plus and I'd like to know the answer to this too.

 

Where's Andie Lin from Carbotech when you need him?
-Adam-

 

I have R4S on now, but got some Panther+ from andy when i decided on VIR

 

When I was street driving my RX-7 (Hawk Blues on track), I would just swap the pads, bleed the system, and take a few easy laps. No problems.

 

I think the bedding process burns off all the excess binding material or something. When you put on new pads and do a few hard stops and they really stink, start smoking and don't stop the car for crap? That's green fade and that's why you bed them in, so they don't do that on your 2nd lap going into turn 1 at 125 mph (remember that Adam?). They should only do that once. After that you're good to go every time you put them on.

 

I know this was just discussed recently, but I can't find the thread for the life of me...

 

The initial fade after installing brand new pads is green fade and getting the pad material binder "cooked" should not be a problem after the first use. The thing to keep in mind is that the rotor picks up some pad material as the pad is used which does help the car stop. When you swap from the racing pads to the street pads on the same rotors, you will have to give the setup some time before max braking performance is seen. I would suggest getting a second set of rotors and swapping with the pads.

 

If I understand the question, it is essentially whether or not you can swap different pad compounds back and forth while keeping the same rotor, without "re-bedding" the pads every time you swap?

Answer: Yes, and kinda-of.

After you have initially bedded in each set of pads, you do not need to rebed them, even if you take them out and re-install them later. The issue which comes up from doing this is that each pad will impart its own wear pattern on the rotor, as well as leave friction material film transfers on the rotor. If you switch from A-pad to B-pad without turning your rotors, you may experience a shudder sensation from the brakes for the first couple hundred street miles (or more), because the newly installed pad is gripping-and-releasing on the friction film transfers left by the previous set of pads. The degree to which this occurs varies widely.

Bottom line is, if you are going to swap pads, you should turn your rotors between each swap. Ultimately, you will spend more on rotors and turning if you do this, than if you went ahead and invested in two sets of rotors to begin with.

Andie

 

What about my situation with the hub over rotor design, (hopefully soon to be fixed), but I do not have the luxury of easy rotor install/remove

 

You might as well just get an extra set of track rotors. Will only cost you ~$80 for a pair of Brembos and an extra 5 min per side to swap.

 

Which is why I just got a my first set of "track only" rotors from Carbotech (thanks Andie!) and they were even nice enough to drop them by Roebling Road this weekend (thanks Larry! and btw, good talking to you and hope you enjoyed the ride). Now if you are poor (like me) and are just using one set of rotors for street and track duty you can always bust out the 40 grit sandpaper to take off the pad that has transferred to the rotor... not as nice as seperate rotors but better than having them turned each time, imo

 

What I've done over the past several seasons, and I learned this from some Hawk Engineers back in my FSAE team/College days is whenever changing pads if you can't turn them (it's often not easy to turn them or swap them when you have one day at the track to do all your testing) is to sand them down with sand paper. You have to use something higher then 300 grit otherwise all you do is polish the rotor. I typically use 240 grit with great results. When I sand the rotors, I move the paper up and down while slowly turning the rotor. This gives a nice cross hatch pattern that's kind of similar to honing a cylinder.

Like I said, it's nice to switch rotors and/or turn them every pad change, but often times it's either not time effective or not even possible (go to a track and test 4 pads in one day, are you going to have 4 sets of rotors?). On my Honda I change my pads 3 to 4 times a month and I'm not about to turn them every time or swap rotors. A quick sanding helps tremendously with quick and cheap turn arounds.

 

ON my 4000lb truck I run panther plus pads and exchange them for carbotech ss pads after every event with no problems except eating up alot of pads

 

It helps to mark the pads for same positioning next install - L inner, L outer, etc. so they match up to the rotor wear patterns better and have less of refamiliarization period.

Gary

 

I just bought front and rear Panther Plus' for my speed boat today (thanks Andie). I use OE pads for the street and swap them out for events only. As I did with my last set of P+s, I am going to install them one week before the event. I installed them in the evening, bedded them in at night, and then let them cool over night with the parking brake off. Then 5 days of regular street driving, plus driving to the event has the P+s bedded nicely for the track.
I use only one set of rotors (Brembo blanks, of course), but always keep an extra pair of new front rotors. Accord rotors are so time-consuming to change, not like the easy pop-off rotors of other Hondas.

 

I usually use 60 grit sandpaper like previously stated when I switch pads. I use stock rotors only with my P+ for the track. I forgot my sandpaper this past weekend at Roebling so I didnt get the chance to sand the rotors down. I expereirenced alot! of shudder. It felt like warped rotors, but from Andies description, maybe not. I feel no shudder now on the street with my street pads but that was after I sanded the rotors down after the event.