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A preposition:

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Old Aug 2, 2005 | 06:38 AM
  #26  
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Default Re: (Knestis)

lol Kirk. Sounds about right.
my impression from talking to relatives is that unfortunately, the french schools are on a similar (yet different) downward spiral.
We have different problems, and differently bad solutions.
We once tried to orient kids from a fairly young age (7th or 8th grade at the latest) to go into trade schools and apprenticeship to learn a trade if they couldn't / wouldn't keep up in school.
Unfortunately, most trades are dying there as they are here. So they have shifted the specialization up to the 10th to 12th grade, where kids earn a "high school diploma" that is way more specialized in some subject or the other.
High school diploma over there is actually quite an accomplishment. there is a test you have to take at the end of the senior year that is about 3-4 hours in EACH subject (math, litt, history/geography/government, languages, physics, biology, economics, philisophy). Each subject is weighed differently depending on your spcialization, and they have now added a lot of technological specialties for people interested in nursing, agriculture, economics, etc.
Anyway, the point was (I think) that they are lowering the standards continuously and trying to find ways to get less and less educated students to go all the way through HS in order to keep them off the unemployed as long as possible since the trade schools graduates really have less and less of a future as time goes.
The unfortunate thing is the getting into a good school, be it engineering, economics, scientific, etc is very hard. There are typically hundreds of applicants at each school for only dozens of seat. A very rigorous/tough exam and interview is ususally needed to get in. Otherwise, there's university which may or may not lead to a job in the end.

I think the system there is still better up to high school, but degrading. The school system here in the US needs a lot of help. At least universities and colleges are easier to get in (if expensive - oh yeah, that's all free in France) in the states and give a better chance at a better education, if the students are motivated. having gone to high school in france sure helped though. The first two years of college were like a review session for me in all the math and sciences. Gave me time to work in my english writing, learn some Russian, etc.

I strongly believe that home schooling can be a mistake if not done VERY carefully. The socialization aspect of the school system is very important (including dealing with bullies and ***-clowns), even if it is WAY over-emphasized in the US, IMHO. It is staggering how many social events, dances, trips, football games, pep rallies, etc. there are here. I'm not saying it's all bad, but when it becomes so much more important than academics, it makes a travesty of the school.
What's better? A brilliant asocial misfit (home school), or a dumb-*** popular jock (puplic school byproduct)? I know I'm generalizing grossly and stereo typing, but get the jist, I hope.

And yes, it is ironic that an expatriate french waitress has a better grasp of US geography than many US high school students and adults.

Sebastien, who is terrified at the fact that his oldest daughter is leaving her private kindergarten to go to public first grade come september and will be bored out her mind, turning her into a juvenile delinquent, ending with her living a life of prostitution and drug addiction. Me, neurotic? Nahhh. Did I mention that my 3 year old was telling me that without gravity, you float? as we were watching the astronaut on the news....
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Old Aug 2, 2005 | 06:39 AM
  #27  
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Default Re: A preposition: (MMsportsRexSi)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by MMsportsRexSi &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i sware... </TD></TR></TABLE>

Heh.....
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Old Aug 2, 2005 | 06:52 AM
  #28  
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Default Re: A preposition: (MMsportsRexSi)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by MMsportsRexSi &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">if you have an IQ of 140+ you'll know that using that "test" is bullshit since its bascially an ammount of knowledge measured/age. put it away. its not a personal attack i sware... i just cant stand it when people whip out the IQ like it actually means something now. it did at the time the test was taken, any time later, pooh because it just goes down </TD></TR></TABLE>

I agree w/ you that the test is bullshit and of course it's age dependant. I didn't mean to come off cocky, because that's really not my style. It was the only quick thing I could think of to illustrate that smart kids are not necessarily A students and vice versa. I work with people who are undeniably geniuses and I find it sad that hardly any of them (that I've talked to about it) feel like they got anything out of their public education. I also work with people who came out of college with 3.9x GPAs and engineering degrees are are F'ing worthless in the work place. Perhaps what is missing there is the degree of the application of knowledge that is learned in school. Maybe what we need in schools is to have students spending less time listening and more time doing.
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Old Aug 2, 2005 | 06:53 AM
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Default Re: (SJR)

Courtney is extremely intelligent. At 12 she writes poetry (that is actually damned good) and enjoys playing a game called "Balderdash" with adults. Its where you make up definitions or explanations of people, places, things and everybody tries to figure out the real answer amongst the BS.
At 12, you can not figure out which answers are hers and which are the adults. Its fairly impressive.

But school is either not teaching her the basics or doing it in a way that disinterests her. She isn't learning about things like prepositions, geography, history, etc.
Who were the major players in World War II? She doesn't know.
What president was assasinated in the early 60s? "That was like forever ago!"
Where is the Mississippi River? "Uhhh... Mississippi?"

And I'll reiterate that this is a A student in advanced classes.
If she doesn't know this stuff, then WTF are the stupid C and D kids learning?
Now thats scarey right there.

Scott, who tries not to think about the fact that these kids will be running the world when he's an old man.
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Old Aug 2, 2005 | 07:02 AM
  #30  
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Grades don't tell the whole story. In high school I was a 2.0 GPA student at best, who got only 2 As in four years of class, both were in computer. Yet I still placed in the top 10 percent of high school students nationwide in all my standardized testing (PLAN, PSAT, ACT, etc.). All the honor students couldn't handle the pressure of trying to get good scores to get into their expensive private schools, I knew no matter what I got, I'd still end up in community college.
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Old Aug 2, 2005 | 07:06 AM
  #31  
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Default Re: (Catch 22)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Catch 22 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">.
Who were the major players in World War II? She doesn't know.
What president was assasinated in the early 60s? "That was like forever ago!"
Where is the Mississippi River? "Uhhh... Mississippi?"

Scott, who tries not to think about the fact that these kids will be running the world when he's an old man.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I loved history and math growing up. LOVED it enough to take all my electives in college on the two areas while getting a degree in forensic psych (which i dont use ).... but it wasnt until i was an adult (ok ok, just a graduate paying his own bills, living on his own, ignoring mom and dad)... that i decided i needed to concentrate more on my language skills. I was an ESL student (Turkish is my first spoken language). I struggled in high school with German and my English classes. It wasnt until college that i could do well in a English class... with spell check as a crutch.

hopefully i can rule the world, i mean country, when i am of age
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Old Aug 2, 2005 | 07:07 AM
  #32  
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Default Re: (SJR)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SJR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Sebastien, who is terrified at the fact that his oldest daughter is leaving her private kindergarten to go to public first grade come september and will be bored out her mind, turning her into a juvenile delinquent, ending with her living a life of prostitution and drug addiction. Me, neurotic? Nahhh. Did I mention that my 3 year old was telling me that without gravity, you float? as we were watching the astronaut on the news....</TD></TR></TABLE>

Are you in Loudoun or P.*****? Loudoun isn't too bad - by the time your kids are in high school, it'll be better than Fairfax for sure. P.***** isn't bad, but has a lot of work to do if it wants to compare favorably with it's northern neighbors.

I have the same worries about Chip. He's a rising 6th grader. A combination of a near-genius IQ and severe ADHD makes his education a challenge for all involved.

If anybody is at risk to get bored and disenchanted with school, it's him. But, hey, I had similar issues and managed to survive high school and college without going on a bullet spraying rampage.

We'd send him to private school, but they aren't any better than the publics, and probably not staffed for our needs. We looked into professional tutors, but he tested off the charts in their evaluation screening, so we nixxed that idea as well.

I'm glad VA is actively fighting NCLB - from what I've seen (as a parent and with a mother who teaches ESOL), compliance is a waste of time and money. NC claims to have a high school graduation rate of 97% - but they manage to exclude students who drop out of school by measuring the number of graduates that earned a diploma in four years or less (instead of measuring the number of students who enter school and finish in four years). If that's what Dubya wants, then I'm inclined to tell him to shove it and let Fairfax do it's own thing - the county has been successful for decades without federal intervention, so I see no need to start now.
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Old Aug 2, 2005 | 07:09 AM
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Default Re: (Catch 22)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I also work with people who came out of college with 3.9x GPAs and engineering degrees are are F'ing worthless in the work place. </TD></TR></TABLE>

One of the top students in my department (Materials Science & Engineering) couldn't work the phone system at his Co-op job. He wan't offered a position there after graduation.

If I had a kid, I'd probably lock out all the network stations on the TV and make History Channel, Discovery and the Weather Channel *required* viewing. Hey, at least they'd learn goegraphy from the weather map

Matt&lt;--- took an online IQ test once that told me I had a 186 IQ. I haven't laughed that hard in a long time.
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Old Aug 2, 2005 | 07:15 AM
  #34  
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Default Re: (Crack Monkey)

I'm a big fan of getting the federal gov out of the public schools and let it all fall on the states. Your county and city schools only get about 9% of their funds from the US Federal Gov anyway but with a ton of stipulations. Most of the stipulations are the reasons for some of the problems.

Then it will all be up t the states and therefore the people of those states. Then you'll see who really cares.
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Old Aug 2, 2005 | 07:28 AM
  #35  
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I like the idea of locking all network tv channels, I cancelled my cable service and internet because I suddenly realized I wasn't reading anymore. I grew up with no tv and no internet and spent hours reading... well time to do that again.

I got a 2.0 GPA in HS... college 3.34 average after I got done with undergrad... wasn't an easy major either. They really need to fix the K-12 education system here, or I'll do what my parents did and ship my future kids off to school abroad.
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Old Aug 2, 2005 | 07:50 AM
  #36  
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Default Re: (94accordsedan)

Maybe english isn't this guy's (alphajessie) first language? Jesus...

It's not rap or video games that ***** up kids. The ability to decipher between "right" and "wrong" has to be developed, and for many people, it isn't.
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Old Aug 2, 2005 | 07:57 AM
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Default Re: (94accordsedan)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 94accordsedan &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I got a 2.0 GPA in HS... college 3.34 average after I got done with undergrad... wasn't an easy major either. They really need to fix the K-12 education system here, or I'll do what my parents did and ship my future kids off to school abroad. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Holy ****, I had a 2.068 GPA in high school, a 3.33 GPA in college, my name is also Sean, and I also annoy the hell out of .RJ...are you my evil twin!?
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Old Aug 2, 2005 | 08:57 AM
  #38  
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Default Re: A preposition: (FlyZlow)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by FlyZlow &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Anyway - I think the original proposition? was supposed to be "The Jump on the main straight of the SJGP is a better track feature than the Corkscrew at Laguna." To this I would say, "Are you out of your freaking mind?" Clearly you've never driven through the Corkscrew or you would never think to say something so silly. The bumps on the SJGP circuit were a flaw in the course design. The Corkscrew is one of the most unique and exciting turns on any course in the world.

- Scott</TD></TR></TABLE>

Thanks for interpreting my sentence!
I'm not being serious, but the jumps made for some exciting views, and nice sounds. Those flat-bottomed cars smacking the pavement twice in quick succession was unreal.
I think the Corkscrew is still a better track feature, but I can't watch the Corkscrew after sneaking onto the roof of my hotel!
It was one hell of a flaw. All weekend they made changes, and the drivers I spoke to all felt the changes were making things worse on them and the cars.
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Old Aug 2, 2005 | 09:04 AM
  #39  
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<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Sean O’Gorman &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Holy ****, I had a 2.068 GPA in high school, a 3.33 GPA in college, my name is also Sean, and I also annoy the hell out of .RJ...are you my evil twin!?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Haha!!! RJ's got his handful now.
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Old Aug 2, 2005 | 09:05 AM
  #40  
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Default Re: (94accordsedan)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 94accordsedan &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Haha!!! RJ's got his handful now. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Not really, I can just ban both of you toolsheds
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Old Aug 2, 2005 | 09:08 AM
  #41  
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<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by .RJ &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Not really, I can just ban both of you toolsheds </TD></TR></TABLE>

Hey thats Mister Toolshed to you.
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Old Aug 2, 2005 | 09:12 AM
  #42  
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Default Re: (94accordsedan)

just to add to the thread.

"wheres the love at?"

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Old Aug 2, 2005 | 09:13 AM
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<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by .RJ &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Not really, I can just ban both of you toolsheds </TD></TR></TABLE>

Good, it'll give me more time to spend with your sister.
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Old Aug 2, 2005 | 09:15 AM
  #44  
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<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Sean O’Gorman &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Good, it'll give me more time to spend with your sister. </TD></TR></TABLE>

HAHAHAHA!!!

Is that red button I see lit up the Ban the two Seans button.
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Old Aug 2, 2005 | 09:15 AM
  #45  
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Default Re: (MMsportsRexSi)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by MMsportsRexSi &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">just to add to the thread.

"wheres the love at?"

</TD></TR></TABLE>

What is this the freaking 60s? No time for free love these days.
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Old Aug 2, 2005 | 09:19 AM
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<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Maybe english isn't this guy's (alphajessie) first language? Jesus...</TD></TR></TABLE>
One of the things I've noticed recently is a sentiment that the only thing that is actually wrong to do is to complain that something's been done wrong.

Sure, it's a difficult thing to balance positive and negative feedback, but I feel it's wrong to try to completely remove all negative feedback.

Have you ever tried learning a foreign language yourself? In my experience, it's far more helpful for people to correct the things I do wrong, even if they make fun of me for it-- you know why? Because I remember and correct my mistakes that way!

Picture this-- say you're trying to learn to communicate in Swahili. You've got a buddy who knows Swahili, and you chat with him all the time. You're having a cookout, so you want to ask him, "When do you think we should start cooking the chicken?", but what you really say is something more like, "We think chicken cook beginning time you?" He somehow figures out what you're trying to say, and replies "Around 5:30".

You go away thinking "We think chicken cook beginning time you?" was the right way to say that. But then you end up looking like an idiot sometime later when your buddy's not there and you're trying to talk to Swahili speaking people who don't know you. They can't understand a bit of your gibberish, and you are unable to communicate. Your buddy has done you a disservice by not laughing at your poor-*** attempt at intelligible conversation, or at the very least correcting you.

(Note: I know nothing of Swahili, take it as just a "fill in the blank" language for the purpose of the story)

I think everyone's too afraid someone will get hurt, and I think people are too easily hurt, and I think people assume that those correcting others are always doing so to be mean, or superior, or whatever.

Besides, most of this thread was about education in general, not about the original poster.

edit: grammar
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Old Aug 2, 2005 | 09:24 AM
  #47  
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Default Re: (94accordsedan)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 94accordsedan &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

What is this the freaking 60s? No time for free love these days. </TD></TR></TABLE>

well you missed the joke
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Old Aug 2, 2005 | 09:29 AM
  #48  
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Default Re: (MMsportsRexSi)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by MMsportsRexSi &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">well you missed the joke </TD></TR></TABLE>

And you missed the sarcasm...
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Old Aug 2, 2005 | 09:30 AM
  #49  
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Default Re: (94accordsedan)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 94accordsedan &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

And you missed the sarcasm... </TD></TR></TABLE>

its the interweb... sue me!
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Old Aug 2, 2005 | 09:47 AM
  #50  
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Default Re: (MMsportsRexSi)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by MMsportsRexSi &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">just to add to the thread.

"wheres the love at?"

</TD></TR></TABLE>

To quote my mother when I was growing up "Behind the preposition AT!"
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