Short shifter myth?
05-08-2004, 08:34 PM
#1
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Inland Empire, CA, USA
Posts: 325
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Short shifter myth?
Ive searched and havent found anything specific but, is it true that short shifters can damage your transmission? Something about the throw of a honda is measured and the transmission reacts to THAT measurement, expecting that much time before changing gears? Might sound really dumb forgive me, but i was planning on puttin one in. Enlighten me. thanks for any feedback (even if you say that was the dumbest thing youve ever heard 
) 
)
05-08-2004, 08:38 PM
#4
Bloody Beaver
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 16,621
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Short shifter myth? (JDCiv)
About a month after installing a short throw on my car, it started grinding, then I lost 3rd, then 4th, then finally 5th. So yeah not saying the short throw was the only factor, but definately a major one.
05-08-2004, 08:38 PM
#5
Honda-Tech Member
Re: Short shifter myth? (Arkiteckt)
Its both yes and no on the myth. If you abuse your tranny everyday then yes it will have a shorter life. If you shift like normal for daily driving then no and it would have a longer life.
Its not really up to the short shifter because you could shorten the life of your tranny with a normal shifter.
Its not really up to the short shifter because you could shorten the life of your tranny with a normal shifter.
05-08-2004, 08:43 PM
#6
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Raleigh, NC
Posts: 15,334
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Short shifter myth? (Luserkid)
Here is my opinion on the subject.
A short shifter does just that, shortens the throws between the gears. It does so by changing the lenght of the level, thus changing the amount the shifter moves the shift rod for each movement from inside the car. If you shifter at 5cm/s from inside the car before, it would move 5 cm/s on the shift rod.. Now if you shift at 2.5cm/s from inside the car it moves the shift rod 5cm/s. If you tear through the gears, yes, you are going to hurt them. If you don't drive like a maniac, then a short shifter isn't going to hurt your transmission.
Bottom line, short shifters don't kill transmissions, drivers do.
A short shifter does just that, shortens the throws between the gears. It does so by changing the lenght of the level, thus changing the amount the shifter moves the shift rod for each movement from inside the car. If you shifter at 5cm/s from inside the car before, it would move 5 cm/s on the shift rod.. Now if you shift at 2.5cm/s from inside the car it moves the shift rod 5cm/s. If you tear through the gears, yes, you are going to hurt them. If you don't drive like a maniac, then a short shifter isn't going to hurt your transmission.
Bottom line, short shifters don't kill transmissions, drivers do.
05-08-2004, 08:44 PM
#7
Honda-Tech Member
Re: Short shifter myth? (Luserkid)
i had a short shifter in a few of my cars, and NEVER had a problem.
maybe someone isn't installing it correctly, or not tightening everything down.
maybe someone isn't installing it correctly, or not tightening everything down.
Trending Topics
05-08-2004, 08:45 PM
#8
Member
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: CHEESE BALL, USA
Posts: 2,236
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Short shifter myth? (JDCiv)
im not saying that its true or its not, but im sure the people damaging their trannies because of short shifters are not used to how fast it is actually getting out of the gears....like by the time ur in second you havent even pushed the clutch down all the way..so your timing is off..causing you to force the car into gear...
05-08-2004, 08:48 PM
#9
Honda-Tech Member
Re: Short shifter myth? (STREETWERKZ)
This is NOT a myth. Shortening the length of the throw = faster shifting. No matter how you want to look at it. shifting faster makes the synchros work harder. If you understand how a manual transmission works then you will agree that a synchro already has a pretty difficult job. Its amazing they last as long as they do! Adding additional stress on them WILL cause them to fail. This is no an opinion, its a fact. I have had three different cars with short shifters and they ALL had trouble with grinding. Remove the shifter, problem solved.
05-08-2004, 08:49 PM
#10
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Charlottesville, va, usa
Posts: 5,550
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Short shifter myth? (degooser)
had a skunk 2 short shifter for a year now..no problems....but short shifter or not if you **** crazy and hard a mlot of the time them you're gonna cause problems ...simple as that...
05-08-2004, 08:50 PM
#11
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: My Avatar Sucks
Posts: 870
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Short shifter myth? (Ricey McRicerton)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Ricey McRicerton »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Here is my opinion on the subject.
A short shifter does just that, shortens the throws between the gears. It does so by changing the lenght of the level, thus changing the amount the shifter moves the shift rod for each movement from inside the car. If you shifter at 5cm/s from inside the car before, it would move 5 cm/s on the shift rod.. Now if you shift at 2.5cm/s from inside the car it moves the shift rod 5cm/s. If you tear through the gears, yes, you are going to hurt them. If you don't drive like a maniac, then a short shifter isn't going to hurt your transmission.
Bottom line, short shifters don't kill transmissions, drivers do. </TD></TR></TABLE>
A short shifter does just that, shortens the throws between the gears. It does so by changing the lenght of the level, thus changing the amount the shifter moves the shift rod for each movement from inside the car. If you shifter at 5cm/s from inside the car before, it would move 5 cm/s on the shift rod.. Now if you shift at 2.5cm/s from inside the car it moves the shift rod 5cm/s. If you tear through the gears, yes, you are going to hurt them. If you don't drive like a maniac, then a short shifter isn't going to hurt your transmission.
Bottom line, short shifters don't kill transmissions, drivers do. </TD></TR></TABLE>
05-08-2004, 08:50 PM
#13
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 11
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Short shifter myth? (degooser)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by degooser »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">im not saying that its true or its not, but im sure the people damaging their trannies because of short shifters are not used to how fast it is actually getting out of the gears..</TD></TR></TABLE>
as the old saying goes...if u can't find it...grind it!
as the old saying goes...if u can't find it...grind it!
05-08-2004, 08:56 PM
#14
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: SF, CA, USA
Posts: 833
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Short shifter myth? (Arkiteckt)
Had a short shifter installed for 1 year now and have no problems what so ever. Poeple that mention that their tranny is going wacko need to input how they drive their cars.
me: I do NOT shift hard, nor misshift when I redline.
results: tranny is still perfect.
me: I do NOT shift hard, nor misshift when I redline.
results: tranny is still perfect.
05-08-2004, 08:59 PM
#15
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: My Avatar Sucks
Posts: 870
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Short shifter myth? (JamesQ)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JamesQ »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Had a short shifter installed for 1 year now and have no problems what so ever. Poeple that mention that their tranny is going wacko need to input how they drive their cars.
me: I do NOT shift hard, nor misshift when I redline.
results: tranny is still perfect.</TD></TR></TABLE>
OT: Your car looks good bro. I like it alot
me: I do NOT shift hard, nor misshift when I redline.
results: tranny is still perfect.</TD></TR></TABLE>
OT: Your car looks good bro. I like it alot
05-08-2004, 09:02 PM
#16
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Columbus, Ohio, United States of America
Posts: 788
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Short shifter myth? (degooser)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by degooser »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">im not saying that its true or its not, but im sure the people damaging their trannies because of short shifters are not used to how fast it is actually getting out of the gears....like by the time ur in second you havent even pushed the clutch down all the way..so your timing is off..causing you to force the car into gear...</TD></TR></TABLE>
I agree, i have one and sometimes i still cant get 1st to 2nd down perfect without a lil grind in there. 2nd to 3rd is my baby though, it's so smooth and nice with a short shifter.
I agree, i have one and sometimes i still cant get 1st to 2nd down perfect without a lil grind in there. 2nd to 3rd is my baby though, it's so smooth and nice with a short shifter.
05-08-2004, 09:30 PM
#17
Honda-Tech Member
Re: Short shifter myth? (VtecAddict96)
it's because you're granny shifting, and not double clutching like you should 
But to be honest, changing the length of your shift has no affect whatsoever on your transmission, all that's happening when you shorten throw is just that, shortening throw, your linkage is still putting you into gear. the myth about short shifters damaging trannies is caused by people who's arms are faster than their left leg. As Ricey previously stated, short shifters don't damage trannies, drivers do. I have personally had my b &m for about a year no with no problems whatsoever except when i don't clutch in all the way.
But to be honest, changing the length of your shift has no affect whatsoever on your transmission, all that's happening when you shorten throw is just that, shortening throw, your linkage is still putting you into gear. the myth about short shifters damaging trannies is caused by people who's arms are faster than their left leg. As Ricey previously stated, short shifters don't damage trannies, drivers do. I have personally had my b &m for about a year no with no problems whatsoever except when i don't clutch in all the way.
05-08-2004, 09:43 PM
#18
Honda-Tech Member
Re: Short shifter myth? (soundbomber)
I fail to see how everyone can post countless comments about how it DOESN'T cause any problems.
Look, you admit over and over that it decreases the amount of travel needed to move from point a to point b... I mean, that IS the purpose of the thing to begin with, right? Ok.. Now, even though you can sit here and make the comment that the linkage still travels the same distance you are forgetting to most important part... IT DOES SO IN LESS TIME. You are still moving the linkage the same distance in order to engage gears, thats a given.. But you are doing it at an accelerated rate. Its not a matter of your foot being faster then your arm.. Its point that the synchro already has a tremendous job of meshing together two shafts that are spinning at completely different speeds. Not to mention that both shafts have tremendous forces imposed on them from the torque. You are still speeding up the time at which these parts must accomplish thier task. It is this speed that adds increased stress on the parts and causes them to fail at an accelerated rate. The harder you drive, the more stress you are putting on the parts. Hence why some people have trouble and others dont. I don't doubt that driving like a granny and taking 10 hours between shifts will not produce any grinds... But keep in mind that just because its not grinding doesn't mean its not increasing the load and stress placed on the internal parts of your transmission.
Look, you admit over and over that it decreases the amount of travel needed to move from point a to point b... I mean, that IS the purpose of the thing to begin with, right? Ok.. Now, even though you can sit here and make the comment that the linkage still travels the same distance you are forgetting to most important part... IT DOES SO IN LESS TIME. You are still moving the linkage the same distance in order to engage gears, thats a given.. But you are doing it at an accelerated rate. Its not a matter of your foot being faster then your arm.. Its point that the synchro already has a tremendous job of meshing together two shafts that are spinning at completely different speeds. Not to mention that both shafts have tremendous forces imposed on them from the torque. You are still speeding up the time at which these parts must accomplish thier task. It is this speed that adds increased stress on the parts and causes them to fail at an accelerated rate. The harder you drive, the more stress you are putting on the parts. Hence why some people have trouble and others dont. I don't doubt that driving like a granny and taking 10 hours between shifts will not produce any grinds... But keep in mind that just because its not grinding doesn't mean its not increasing the load and stress placed on the internal parts of your transmission.
05-08-2004, 09:50 PM
#19
Member
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: CHEESE BALL, USA
Posts: 2,236
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Short shifter myth? (Hybrid93Eg)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Hybrid93Eg »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I fail to see how everyone can post countless comments about how it DOESN'T cause any problems.
Look, you admit over and over that it decreases the amount of travel needed to move from point a to point b... I mean, that IS the purpose of the thing to begin with, right? Ok.. Now, even though you can sit here and make the comment that the linkage still travels the same distance you are forgetting to most important part... IT DOES SO IN LESS TIME. You are still moving the linkage the same distance in order to engage gears, thats a given.. But you are doing it at an accelerated rate. Its not a matter of your foot being faster then your arm.. Its point that the synchro already has a tremendous job of meshing together two shafts that are spinning at completely different speeds. Not to mention that both shafts have tremendous forces imposed on them from the torque. You are still speeding up the time at which these parts must accomplish thier task. It is this speed that adds increased stress on the parts and causes them to fail at an accelerated rate. The harder you drive, the more stress you are putting on the parts. Hence why some people have trouble and others dont. I don't doubt that driving like a granny and taking 10 hours between shifts will not produce any grinds... But keep in mind that just because its not grinding doesn't mean its not increasing the load and stress placed on the internal parts of your transmission.</TD></TR></TABLE>
so whats worse a person with a stock shifter shifting faster than u can blink or a person with a short shifter....
i see that as essentially the same thing...after reading ur reply...
Look, you admit over and over that it decreases the amount of travel needed to move from point a to point b... I mean, that IS the purpose of the thing to begin with, right? Ok.. Now, even though you can sit here and make the comment that the linkage still travels the same distance you are forgetting to most important part... IT DOES SO IN LESS TIME. You are still moving the linkage the same distance in order to engage gears, thats a given.. But you are doing it at an accelerated rate. Its not a matter of your foot being faster then your arm.. Its point that the synchro already has a tremendous job of meshing together two shafts that are spinning at completely different speeds. Not to mention that both shafts have tremendous forces imposed on them from the torque. You are still speeding up the time at which these parts must accomplish thier task. It is this speed that adds increased stress on the parts and causes them to fail at an accelerated rate. The harder you drive, the more stress you are putting on the parts. Hence why some people have trouble and others dont. I don't doubt that driving like a granny and taking 10 hours between shifts will not produce any grinds... But keep in mind that just because its not grinding doesn't mean its not increasing the load and stress placed on the internal parts of your transmission.</TD></TR></TABLE>
so whats worse a person with a stock shifter shifting faster than u can blink or a person with a short shifter....
i see that as essentially the same thing...after reading ur reply...
05-08-2004, 10:00 PM
#20
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 605
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Short shifter myth? (Ricey McRicerton)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Ricey McRicerton »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">=
Bottom line, short shifters don't kill transmissions, drivers do. </TD></TR></TABLE>
Agreed
Bottom line, short shifters don't kill transmissions, drivers do. </TD></TR></TABLE>
Agreed
05-08-2004, 10:00 PM
#21
Honda-Tech Member
Re: Short shifter myth? (degooser)
what i can't understand is why people fail to see that a short shifter is based upon driving preference and feel, not on performance. Degooser hit it square on the head when he says that someone who shifts faster with a stock shifter does more damage than someone shifting normally with a short shifter. In the end, all a short shifter does is improve your shifter feel, and i really doubt that it will improve quarter times
05-08-2004, 10:01 PM
#22
Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Mission Viejo, CA, USA
Posts: 1,290
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Yeah..its usually the driver, unless you buy a P.O.S short shifter. Don't buy a no-name brand and such cuz a short shifter may looks simple but recquires a lot of engineering such as the bends and stuff.
05-08-2004, 10:06 PM
#23
Junior Member
Join Date: May 2004
Location: spartanburg, sc, us
Posts: 192
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Short shifter myth? (JDCiv)
ive had an adjustable b&m for about 5 years, set on its shortest throw, and have not had any issues with my tranny. none. now, i dont shift like a madman 24/7 but i dont baby it either. the only thing ive really heard about the subject is you can damage your syncros IF your clutch is not fully pressed when you shift into the next gear. 5 years, no problems.....(until now probably...)
05-08-2004, 11:56 PM
#24
Honda-Tech Member
Re: Short shifter myth? (degooser)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by degooser »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
so whats worse a person with a stock shifter shifting faster than u can blink or a person with a short shifter....
i see that as essentially the same thing...after reading ur reply...</TD></TR></TABLE>
It would be basically the same thing... Someone with a short shifter shifting "normally" would be putting as much stress on thier synchros as someone with a normal shifter shifting as fast as they could. That is my point.
so whats worse a person with a stock shifter shifting faster than u can blink or a person with a short shifter....
i see that as essentially the same thing...after reading ur reply...</TD></TR></TABLE>
It would be basically the same thing... Someone with a short shifter shifting "normally" would be putting as much stress on thier synchros as someone with a normal shifter shifting as fast as they could. That is my point.
05-09-2004, 12:04 AM
#25
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Charlottesville, va, usa
Posts: 5,550
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Short shifter myth? (Hybrid93Eg)
this is going about as crazy as the ctr n1 crank pulley debate.....its heading in that direction.......oh and its the nut loose behind the wheel that hurts the tranny in my opinion...not the shifter.