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Idle Surge Tests my patience with 97 coupe.

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Old 03-08-2011, 08:02 AM
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Default Idle Surge Tests my patience with 97 coupe.

Ok I am officially stumped on this problem that has been haunting me since I've changed my intake manifold. The main reason I changed the manifold was the IACV was old and cracked and they did not sell the old style IACV brand new. The engine I have in my 97 Ej6 is a B16a2 from an EM1. The entire engine harness had been swapped a few years back but had an Old obd0 intake manifold that was from an 88 JDM CRX . The original swap was an OBD0 CRX b16a then due to problems with the motor it was taken out and a 2000 civic SI motor was put in after being completely rebuild. This time the motor was done by a local shop instead of myself due to time restrictions in finishing up college. Continuing from where i changed the intake manifold. i replaced the intake manifold gasket before putting the new one on. The new one is an OEM manifold from another b16a2. It came with an aftermarket BBK throttle body that did not line up with the vacuum galleries and cause the motor to idle very hight. This was fixed by buying a used OEM throttle body also from an EM1. I replaced the throttle body gasket before placing the new throttle body on. The IACV was also replaced with BRAND new one because i did not want to risk any further problems. I have checked all the vacuum lines and plug suspect ones that made me think they were the culprit however still the problem persists. I have checked for the tightness on the intake manifold bolts but they are tight as well. The throttle body came with the TPS sensor and Map sensor and both test to be good. One change that the previous TPS sensors did not have a gasket on them however this one came with one and it looked like it had not been touched since new. i checked for leaks on all of these by spraying brake cleaner in suspect areas however idle did not rise as though it would if an additional fuel would be introduced. I've checked the codes and its reads consistently.that EVAP Pressure valve malfunction. And there are 2 different IACV codes it is reading. I've since rewired both using solder, Shrink tubing, and wrapped both with electrical tape. The problem still persists. I cant really mod the car until i fix the problems and it has been testing my patience. I have had the car since I graduated HS in 2003 So it sort of has a sentimental value to me and i would not like to get rid of it however it has given me nothing but problems over the years. Eventually once i can get a Daily driver after i get a job (IF) i would like to tear the motor out and replace it with a K series , because i cannot use any of my original wiring and will make certain that none of these problems will live on.
Old 03-08-2011, 08:59 AM
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Default Re: Idle Surge Tests my patience with 97 coupe.

What ECU and engine wire harnesses are installed?

What specific OBD2 codes are currently thrown? Do they repeat after resetting the ECU?

How many wires does your IACV have?

Did you calibrate the output voltage of the TPS? Have you resistance tested the ECT sensor?

Has the EVAP system been removed?
Old 03-08-2011, 09:22 AM
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Default Re: Idle Surge Tests my patience with 97 coupe.

Originally Posted by RonJ@HT
What ECU and engine wire harnesses are installed?
What specific OBD2 codes are currently thrown? Do they repeat after resetting the ECU?

How many wires does your IACV have?

Did you calibrate the output voltage of the TPS?
Have you resistance tested the ECT sensor?

Has the EVAP system been removed?
Engine is Obd2 b16a2 from Em1 ECU is p2t as is the wireing harness
P0505
p0452
p0450 (pd)
p0133 (pd)
p0505 (pd) this one shows up twice ones with out the letters "pd" and one with
and yes they re occur after reset and clearing codes.

It is a 2 wires system

No calibration has been done to the output Voltage
And i have not tested resistance in the ECT sensor
EVAP system is still installed and hooked up
Old 03-08-2011, 09:23 AM
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Default Re: Idle Surge Tests my patience with 97 coupe.

Problem also seems to be aplified when the AC is turned on but that may be due the increase load on the engine
Idle surge also is not immediate depending on if my AC is on or not it will start after 15 min or so. There was a time the other day when i drove it around for about 20 min with no codes or surge at all. but it began again later that night
EDIT
After last read EVAP code does not return after rewire
Old 03-08-2011, 09:33 AM
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Default Re: Idle Surge Tests my patience with 97 coupe.

Originally Posted by 97ej6dx
Engine is Obd2 b16a2 from Em1 ECU is p2t as is the wireing harness
P0505
p0452
p0450 (pd)
p0133 (pd)
p0505 (pd) this one shows up twice ones with out the letters "pd" and one with
and yes they re occur after reset and clearing codes.

It is a 2 wires system

No calibration has been done to the output Voltage
And i have not tested resistance in the ECT sensor
EVAP system is still installed and hooked up
P0452 - your ECU is looking for a fuel tank pressure sensor but you car doesn't have one.

P0505 - this is the cause of your idle surge. Start by calibrating your TPS and resistance testing the ECT sensor. When you unplug the IACV, does the idle speed drop and does the surging stop?
Old 03-08-2011, 11:04 AM
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Default Re: Idle Surge Tests my patience with 97 coupe.

Originally Posted by RonJ@HT
P0452 - your ECU is looking for a fuel tank pressure sensor but you car doesn't have one.

P0505 - this is the cause of your idle surge. Start by calibrating your TPS and resistance testing the ECT sensor. When you unplug the IACV, does the idle speed drop and does the surging stop?
When i unplug the IACV the Idle surge speeds up in frequency i would say twice as fast

How do i go about calibrating my TPS?
Old 03-08-2011, 11:10 AM
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Default Re: Idle Surge Tests my patience with 97 coupe.

Would these problems also cause the cars acceleration to feel sluggish. I remember a time when it would get up and go pretty quick. but that soon went away. then i figured the car would be quicker with the larger pistons however only slighlty quicker but not as quick as it once was.
Old 03-08-2011, 11:54 AM
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Default Re: Idle Surge Tests my patience with 97 coupe.

TPS:
Loosen the two screws holding the TPS in place. With the key in ON(II) and the throttle plate fully closed, turn the TPS until the output voltage is 0.5V.

If the problem persists after TPS calibration, check carefully for a vacuum or intake air leak.
Old 03-08-2011, 01:01 PM
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Default Re: Idle Surge Tests my patience with 97 coupe.

alright i shall try that. I have double checked mutiple times for vaccume and intake leaks and i have found none so i will give this a try and see what happens
Old 03-08-2011, 01:17 PM
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Default Re: Idle Surge Tests my patience with 97 coupe.

come to think of it It would make sense if my ECT sensor is bad because i haven't noticed the Radiator fan comming on in quite a long time. ill check that first
Old 03-08-2011, 01:34 PM
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Default Re: Idle Surge Tests my patience with 97 coupe.

OK tested both The TPS reads around.5 it was hard to put the node in the back of the plug. But i did find that i have a bad plug on the ECT. It read about .04 of a volt. When i went behind the plug i also found an open spot possibly due to the tag that the harness came with had rubbed thru and was probably responsable for shredding some of the wire filiments. Because i get full voltage from behind the wire but when it comes to the end of the plug it reads very low. IS there any trick to testing the resistance on the TPS or do you just have to try to press the nodes in to the rubber grommit in the back.
Old 03-08-2011, 05:13 PM
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Default Re: Idle Surge Tests my patience with 97 coupe.

Originally Posted by 97ej6dx
come to think of it It would make sense if my ECT sensor is bad because i haven't noticed the Radiator fan comming on in quite a long time. ill check that first
The ECT sensor has NOTHING to do with the radiator fan. You are thinking of the ECT switch on the thermostat housing.
Old 03-08-2011, 05:16 PM
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Default Re: Idle Surge Tests my patience with 97 coupe.

Originally Posted by 97ej6dx
IS there any trick to testing the resistance on the TPS or do you just have to try to press the nodes in to the rubber grommit in the back.
Do you mean ECT sensor? If so, warm the engine up and then turn it off and unplug the ECT sensor. Measure resistance across the two sensor terminals.
Old 03-09-2011, 01:27 PM
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Default Re: Idle Surge Tests my patience with 97 coupe.

ahh alrighty gotchya thanks ! I will give that a try when ever it stops raining
Old 03-09-2011, 02:24 PM
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Default Re: Idle Surge Tests my patience with 97 coupe.

Originally Posted by RonJ@HT
Do you mean ECT sensor? If so, warm the engine up and then turn it off and unplug the ECT sensor. Measure resistance across the two sensor terminals.
Well you told me to check the Throttle position sensor also so i tryed both the Throttle position sensor and the Engine Coolent Tempurature sensor
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