Nathan Reed

I bought the wrong kit from someone. And i know b parts can interchange some times. Trying to see if there is anyway i could still use the set. Arp number 208-5402
i am wondering if i could use a different windage tray. Or something. Has anyone done this before?

tony_2018

b20 does not have a vtec head.

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

They are different lengths. No, you cannot use mains for a b16 on any other block.

That's it.

JRCivic1

Shodan, I think you are referring to a head stud kit... they are in fact shorter on a B16 application when compared to the rest of the B18 VTEC engines or even a frankenstein B18 or B20VTEC combination.

OP, the main stud kit you referenced works on the B16A, B18A/B and B20B/Z as long as you do not use a modified GSR/ITR or aftermarket main girdle. In that case, you would need to use the GSR main stud kit (part number 208-5403).

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

No. I know exactly what I'm talking about MAIN stud kit, not Head stud kit. But I appreciate it. two different part numbers are used, and aren't swappable. for the B18A/B & B20Z they are part number 208-5404. For the B16A, they use 208-5402. That is a different length for the girdle. GSR/ITR uses 208-5403.

Aftermarket girdles are few and far-between used, if ever. Especially for this person's application

JRCivic1

I meant no disrespect Shodan... I am confident in your level of knowledge. I only suggested the possible confusion of head and main stud kit fitment because of my own personal experiences with respect to "B" series main stud kits.

Now, your response does cause some head scratching on my end. Hmmm... I didn't know the part number that you referenced even existed. I wonder what the actual differences are between the ARP 208-5402 and 208-5404 kits. What is your experience as to why they are not interchangeable ??? I only ask because the factory Honda/Acura bolt part numbers are in fact the same between the B16A2/3, the B18A/B and the B20B/Z. (2) 90006-P75-003 and (8) 90007-P75-003 for each block.

I use a main girdle on EVERY LS/Vtec or CRVtec engine I build... I do not consider it optional. I do agree with you that the short stroke of the B16A really doesn't need a main girdle.

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

None taken, JRCivic1. I know how its easily confusing when it comes to reading the difference between MAIN stud, and HEAD stud. I just tend to reflect heavily on the content of my statements before I type. This is why I rarely use Smartphones or tablets when typing statements.

My experience with these parts and their corresponding numbers revolves around my visit to ARP's main factory on a tour about 10 years ago. Since I've always been a Honda /Toyota/Mitsu buff, I was able to look at the differing lengths of the threads on the corresponding part numbers. The differences seem small to the naked eye, but according to ARP, (whose opinion and expertise I trust more than my own) the small difference make up for additional tensile strength of each main stud; which is essence the "core" of the reason why we use these parts in the 1st place. This is different than what just physically "fits" when it comes to interchangability of OEM parts.

In many cases that interchangability works quite well without consequence. However, when it comes to aftermarket equipment, and the fact that they are geared for improved utility, there is a reason why there are different part number associated with it, even if we may not always understand it.

jdblock

You don't think ARP pinches pennies and uses different lengths to save on raw material? Just seems like the business thing to do.

Can you quote a publicity where ARP said this? Edit; find me any publication that says length plays a role in tensile strength.

From what I understand about tensile strength, length doesn't matter, cross sectional area does.

Crashmaster91

For my knowledge (and maybe others on here), what would be the stronger main studs? Common knowledge would think the b20 studs (more mass in the rotating assembly), but I could be wrong.

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

This isn't an investigation where all statements made are legally deposed and published as though they are part of the FTC. If you doubt the validity of my statement, that's fine. I'm only giving my testimony as to their reasoning in person from a visit I made to the factory. Whether or not they are "pinching pennies" or other manufacturing logic isn't relevant. The relevancy of my statement was supplementary information as to why there are 3 different part numbers, and not two, which may be why they are not interchangeable.

I went to the factory. I use their products successfully. That's all I know, and honestly all I cared to know at the time. I've followed their logic, subsequently, and have never had a problem as a result. You're more than welcome to conduct your own investigation for your purposes of peace of mind, but 1) I'm not getting paid to do others' research for them on a product when I'm perfectly satisfied with their practices & products, and 2) not everything in the world is published online or made as a press release or marketing advertisement. If you want to know more, either go to the factory as I did, or, make your own calls to them and determine for yourself.

The point of the discussion was whether or not ARP main studs are interchangeable. JRCivic1 said yes based upon his experience and theory of use compared to his experience with OEM main studs, I disagreed based upon my experience and use of ARP products, visit to the factory, and the fact that there are 3 different part numbers. ( I don't interchange between OEMs bolts). We both agreed from this that there are different approaches, and JRCivic1 learned that there are 3 part numbers for these girdles. Boom. Done.

Now, if you want to create conspiracy hyperbole, assume ARP uses bad business practices ('cuz all businesses are cheap, ya know ), and create open-ended questions, what you do with your time, is your business, my friend, and you have every right to investigate for yourself.

But from this, I think JRCvic1 and I are satisfied, and the OP now has additional knowledge to add to his repertoire. :-)

Relax. Life is good.

jdblock

Saving money has never been a bad business practice. That's something you came up with, not me. Using as much raw material as possible is common practice in manufacturing. From building houses, paving roads, or designing shipping boxes, they all try and save money. Fact.

ARP is not cheap, I've bought my fare share and have NO reason to talk bad about them. Please stop putting words in my mouth.

Am I upset to you? I wrote three short paragraphs, that's all. I'm confused about your statement and asked for clarification. I've never heard what you wrote.

Thanks for being defensive. Very enlightening. Appreciate it, friend.

jdblock

The mains don't rotate. They clamp the crank to the block.

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

You do seem rather jaded to come up with that as a standard business practice, as though you believe that "cheapening out" is a standard practice for most manufacturing organizations. I'm not agreeing nor disagreeing with you. It's just, well... I'm not putting words in your mouth, only interpreting what you're typing. If you want to clarify your statement, that's best, but one can only go by written interpretation. Nothing coerced or insinuated, here.

It's....whatever it is, to you. In the end, whether you believe what we're saying or not, is not that relevant to the OP. So, no, there's no reason to be defensive. I was simply stating the course of the conversation, that's all. .
But, really.. You're welcome. Glad you appreciate the enlightenment I've brought to you.