<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by salt &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Yeah, you can see right where its happening too. about 10psi and 5000 rpm it drops to 13 degrees. I know H series timing is a little different than Bseries, but I still run over 23 degrees at 10lbs, I have 8.5:1 CR.</TD></TR></TABLE>
this is a completely stock h22 motor so you think my total timing seems about right @10psi? I didn't want to raise it anymore without the use of a dyno.

 

bump. What do you guys think about his wastegate dump situation?

 

I think you should have at least 16.5 degrees in the area that turbogokart highlighted. that should still be conservative.

its kind of hard to read those A/F readouts so be careful on your A/F ratio.

Is there a pic of the wastegate dump ? is it dumping near the compress inlet ?

 

I'll go get a picture hold on

 

This is the best picture I could get

 

Kind of an obvious question, but are you sure VTEC is even engaging?

 

Yea it is

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by AzG35 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Kind of an obvious question, but are you sure VTEC is even engaging? </TD></TR></TABLE>
yea we were questioning that at first as well, but if you rev it out slowly you can definintly hear it engage.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by salt &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I think you should have at least 16.5 degrees in the area that turbogokart highlighted. that should still be conservative.

its kind of hard to read those A/F readouts so be careful on your A/F ratio.

Is there a pic of the wastegate dump ? is it dumping near the compress inlet ?</TD></TR></TABLE>
yea trust me the original timing maps I was using didn't have that dip there, but I had switched to this one when we were trying to diagnose the problem because supposedely this was a tuned h22 map and i wanted to see if the car would still run like **** on it. I didn't notice that the timing maps I switched to had that irregular dip there. His afr's basically stay right between 11 and 12 so he should be fine in that department.

His wastegate isn't open dump. Its dumping back into the downpipe with a closed loop setup. This is probably causing a ton of turbulence in the exhaust flow because instead of dumping far down the downpipe it dumps in the bend coming directly off the turbo which i know has to be killing some power. Meltman said that he did try taking the wastegate off and turning it around so it was dumping into the air rather than the downpipe and after that the car would buck all over the place when he tried to get on it. I'm guessing maybe he gained a ton of power after changing that around and was leaning out. What do you guys think?

 

This was taken from Spenser on homemadeturbo.com

[quote author=Spenser link=topic=40766.msg467973#msg467973 date=1116194079]
lol, no man, its not causing exhaust turbulance, and even if it is, its after the turbo. AS long as therss no back pressure, exhaust flow disruption after the turbo does didily squat.
[/quote]

 

This was taken from Spenser on homemadeturbo.com

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Spenser &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
lol, no man, its not causing exhaust turbulance, and even if it is, its after the turbo. AS long as therss no back pressure, exhaust flow disruption after the turbo does didily squat.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

Matt when can you tune next? Does Friday sound ok again? Wait, you're out of school now, so can you do it sometime this week?

 

well if you opened the wastegate up and the car ran drastically different like you said then i'm willing to bet it was causing some kind of powerloss.

There really isn't any point in doing anymore tuning until we can figure out what is causing you to lose this power. Its obvious the dip at 5k rpms is caused by those dips in the timing maps that i didn't notice. If you want you can stop by my house and I can add the timing back in for you and change any afr changes in that rpm range, but other than that retuning isn't going to change anything because we know the rest of the powerband is pretty damn low as well. The power picks back up after that dip in the timing, but it still is making terrible power. I'm willing to bet that if its not something with the dumptube then something in your ignition is messed up. When your dad regapped your plugs did you notice that it was trying to cut out on you again like it was doing to us before? That could also cause huge losses in power, but it looks like you were at least able to rev it out all the way on the dyno. Either way i can tell that your car is not making near the amount of power that it should be for some reason.

 

Well I regapped them last night and it ran smoother and with a little more power, it still had that dip. Yea I just wanna stop by and clean up the afr's and timing and see what that does.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by meltman1234 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Well I regapped them last night and it ran smoother and with a little more power, it still had that dip. Yea I just wanna stop by and clean up the afr's and timing and see what that does.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Alright thats fine. I'm telling you for sure even with them regapped right that thing isn't making the power it should be. So start looking into replacing all your older ignition stuff and maybe we can try running an open wastegate when i redo your tuning and see how it works out.

 

bump. Anybody else have an idea about what this could be?

 

Yea bump again.

 

looking at the plot it looks like ignition. my car did the same thing when the hondata registered a knock.

I dunno about uberdata but hondata will retard timing to the base timing when it knocks then as the knock goes away it gives it timing again.

Try adding fuel right where the power peaks. don't worry about how rich it says it is during that process. the idea is to see if it is a timing issue. in theory if you add fuel there even if the timing is causing knock the fuel will combat it so it should allow the power curve to rise or atleast smooth out.

if it does smooth it out. pull some timing out of it and get the AF on target and see what happens.

I am not a professional so I am sure someone who knows more will chime and tell you if I am right but I know it worked on my car

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by BoostR41 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">looking at the plot it looks like ignition. my car did the same thing when the hondata registered a knock.

I dunno about uberdata but hondata will retard timing to the base timing when it knocks then as the knock goes away it gives it timing again.

Try adding fuel right where the power peaks. don't worry about how rich it says it is during that process. the idea is to see if it is a timing issue. in theory if you add fuel there even if the timing is causing knock the fuel will combat it so it should allow the power curve to rise or atleast smooth out.

if it does smooth it out. pull some timing out of it and get the AF on target and see what happens.

I am not a professional so I am sure someone who knows more will chime and tell you if I am right but I know it worked on my car</TD></TR></TABLE>
Well he is using a p28 so there is no knock sensing equipment for it to sense any.

Also I had tried running it with much less timing and it just felt even worse. Something just isn't right

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SOHC_MShue &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Well he is using a p28 so there is no knock sensing equipment for it to sense any.

Also I had tried running it with much less timing and it just felt even worse. Something just isn't right </TD></TR></TABLE>


try running it with the same timing and more fuel and see if it smooths out. If I remember right mine was right around 17degrees timing when it knocked and sent timing back to 13. we added fuel and left it at 17 and it ran much smoother

 

Well actually when i switched over to some boosted h22 maps I found on honda-tech to use as a base it ran very rich on those and it was still running like poo. I think those maps were tuned for a much larger turbo so they were fairly conservative on his setup.

 

Matt, do you have a compression checker?

 

no, but I think yours is fine considering the car runs great out of boost. It even feels real strong up until a certain point.

 

Ok, just checking everything.

 

 

Anymore ideas?

 

http://uberdata.pgmfi.org/foru...d=154

use the basemap from there.. it's like the 6th post down from the top. Start with a fresh basemap.