Ultimate B-series Turbo Touring
10-23-2007, 04:21 PM
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Ultimate B-series Turbo Touring
In my quest to design the ULTIMATE B-series turbo motor that would share the following
380WHP - 450WHP
9000 rpm redline
smooth torque curve
quick and linear boost/throttle response
high reliability/maintaince intervals
withstand abuse found on a road-course type of racetrack
WILL NOT BLOW UP!!
according to various engine building theorists and internet forums, having a poor Rod/Stroke ratio can degrade the reliability of an engine, increasingly so under boost. at a road race you are WOT at high RPM's for very long periods of time.
A B16 has a perfect 1.75:1 Rod/Stroke ratio. 77mm stroke, 203.37 mm Deck
A GSR has a less than perferct 1.58:1 R/S Ratio 87.2mm stroke, 212.39 mm Deck
B16 would be ideal, but unfortunately the short stroke makes this engine slightly less than competitive with other engines especially in the 4K-6K rpm range. While a monster up top, a good road course engine needs more torque and linearity through the midrange to be competitive.
My propositions:::::
Option#1
Use a GSR block bored to 83mm, Darton Cast Iron Sleeves (retaining water jacket)
as well as 12-point block posting, Using an Eagle B16 84mm Forged Stroker crankshaft (84mm stroke) and 139.5mm custom eagle rods, Arias B16 Pistons with ~ 29 - 30.89mm wrist pin location (to achieve 9.4:1 compression) Gives a displacement of 1817cc, but much more importantly, a Rod/Stroke ratio of 1.66:1. This will improve dwell at TDC, giving a wider and more conservative envelope for tuning and spark timing, stable piston velocities, and much less sidewall loading than a stock GSR. All in all to make an engine with a thick midrange and insane top end that is as reliable and bulletproof as ever.
Esintally a B16 Stroker kit with longer rods stuffed into a GSR block.
whadda think? am i barkin up the right school of thought or would i be just as better off building a GSR with factory dimensions? How do all you guys out there with 92 or 95mm stroker cranks feel about your turbo charged performance in terms of power linearity and driveability?
appreciate all feedback
380WHP - 450WHP
9000 rpm redline
smooth torque curve
quick and linear boost/throttle response
high reliability/maintaince intervals
withstand abuse found on a road-course type of racetrack
WILL NOT BLOW UP!!
according to various engine building theorists and internet forums, having a poor Rod/Stroke ratio can degrade the reliability of an engine, increasingly so under boost. at a road race you are WOT at high RPM's for very long periods of time.
A B16 has a perfect 1.75:1 Rod/Stroke ratio. 77mm stroke, 203.37 mm Deck
A GSR has a less than perferct 1.58:1 R/S Ratio 87.2mm stroke, 212.39 mm Deck
B16 would be ideal, but unfortunately the short stroke makes this engine slightly less than competitive with other engines especially in the 4K-6K rpm range. While a monster up top, a good road course engine needs more torque and linearity through the midrange to be competitive.
My propositions:::::
Option#1
Use a GSR block bored to 83mm, Darton Cast Iron Sleeves (retaining water jacket)
as well as 12-point block posting, Using an Eagle B16 84mm Forged Stroker crankshaft (84mm stroke) and 139.5mm custom eagle rods, Arias B16 Pistons with ~ 29 - 30.89mm wrist pin location (to achieve 9.4:1 compression) Gives a displacement of 1817cc, but much more importantly, a Rod/Stroke ratio of 1.66:1. This will improve dwell at TDC, giving a wider and more conservative envelope for tuning and spark timing, stable piston velocities, and much less sidewall loading than a stock GSR. All in all to make an engine with a thick midrange and insane top end that is as reliable and bulletproof as ever.
Esintally a B16 Stroker kit with longer rods stuffed into a GSR block.
whadda think? am i barkin up the right school of thought or would i be just as better off building a GSR with factory dimensions? How do all you guys out there with 92 or 95mm stroker cranks feel about your turbo charged performance in terms of power linearity and driveability?
appreciate all feedback
10-23-2007, 07:00 PM
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Re: Ultimate B-series Turbo Touring (bignewtCA)
sounds like you've thought it out wonderfully.
while most of HT isnt an eagle stroker crank fan, a buddy of mine hasnt had a problem with his..
given no problems with the crank, and perfect assembly, and a safe/conservative tune, it should be very reliable. with a properly sized turbo, it would be a really really fun road course setup also.
speaking from experience, 350/400 front WHP in a 2000 lbs car (with LSd and sticky tires) is a FRICKEN HANDFUL. (f22, t3/t4 built to spool well on the enigne, and about 400 whp, mated to a D series trans w/ quaife)
my engine has a mean powerband (boatloads of torque/lots of peak), and it's really fun. it's really really hard to drive to the max...and i look forward to more tracktime with it.. and wider meats.
you'd want a BIG intercooler, and a very adequate radiator/oil cooler setup also.
personally, i'd do a really well sized turbo on a b16 (gt2871R, or even a gt28RS). stock crank....cheap block, etc.
might not make the 400 whp, but it'd make 300, and still have a great powerband, while being a much simpler setup, and very basic (relatively speaking). with a great head and great cams, it'd make some great power
fun topic!
while most of HT isnt an eagle stroker crank fan, a buddy of mine hasnt had a problem with his..
given no problems with the crank, and perfect assembly, and a safe/conservative tune, it should be very reliable. with a properly sized turbo, it would be a really really fun road course setup also.
speaking from experience, 350/400 front WHP in a 2000 lbs car (with LSd and sticky tires) is a FRICKEN HANDFUL. (f22, t3/t4 built to spool well on the enigne, and about 400 whp, mated to a D series trans w/ quaife)
my engine has a mean powerband (boatloads of torque/lots of peak), and it's really fun. it's really really hard to drive to the max...and i look forward to more tracktime with it.. and wider meats.
you'd want a BIG intercooler, and a very adequate radiator/oil cooler setup also.
personally, i'd do a really well sized turbo on a b16 (gt2871R, or even a gt28RS). stock crank....cheap block, etc.
might not make the 400 whp, but it'd make 300, and still have a great powerband, while being a much simpler setup, and very basic (relatively speaking). with a great head and great cams, it'd make some great power
fun topic!
10-24-2007, 12:23 AM
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Re: Ultimate B-series Turbo Touring (redzcstandardhatch)
I know what youre saying about boosted cars being a handful!!! Right now i have a turbo B16 that is stock except for a blockguard, extra thick headgasket and ARP head studs. The turbo is a Garrett T3/T4 .60A/R and .48 hot side. It spools very quickly as low as 3700rpm and makes decent power all the way up, but there is a big diffrence betwen my B16 and a few turbo'd GSR's that ive ridden in and driven. Apart from being very simaliar engines, they are way different!! I like the thicker midrange of a GSR, and the perky top end of a B16. with the 84x83mm Geometry I hope to capture the best of both worlds.
Also, I custom designed a Water-Air intercooling system using the unit off of GMC Cyclone/Typhoon and custom pluming to a very large (36"X22"X1.5") radiator in front. This keeps the charge pipe volume very low (less than 4' of pipe; less than 6 liters total intake volume) so the spool is alas more progressive and much faster. Also water/air is more effective than air/air and i never have to worry about heat soak. BTW my IAT after the N-Ter Cooler is usually around 87degrees F at 9PSI with ambient at 70.
Also, I custom designed a Water-Air intercooling system using the unit off of GMC Cyclone/Typhoon and custom pluming to a very large (36"X22"X1.5") radiator in front. This keeps the charge pipe volume very low (less than 4' of pipe; less than 6 liters total intake volume) so the spool is alas more progressive and much faster. Also water/air is more effective than air/air and i never have to worry about heat soak. BTW my IAT after the N-Ter Cooler is usually around 87degrees F at 9PSI with ambient at 70.
10-24-2007, 09:39 AM
#5
Re: Ultimate B-series Turbo Touring (all_motorsi)
Air-to-water is fine, but for street use, we've found that there was no additional advantage that a good air-to-air could do on the same platform.
As for the block, the "rod stroke" ratio is fine for a boosted car. In the all-motor world, it is a bit more important due to the piston speeds that you would normally be at over 9000 + rpm situations. Here, the idea is torque with boost, something the "torqueless wonder" B16 has had. One scenario you may consider is keep the bore simple to about 84mm (headgaskets and supplemental parts are easier to replace if needed, as opposed to weird bore sizes like 83mm... you can also bore out to 84.5mm on the sleeved block if needed.), and use the LS 89mm stroke crank, and keep it from being too much out of your wallet. You can still easily rev to 8200rpms, and have a great power and torque curve.
As for turbo, you don't necessarily have to go ball-bearing, especially with the torque you'll be able to make. The silver surfer, and GT3257bs can do a world of difference while still keeping your reliability, and spend under $900 for the turbo, as opposed to over 1200 for the turbo and 200 or so for the water lines. With only 12psi, over 250ft/lbs can easily be made, good both for street and track.
There are lots of alternatives, of course,but I've found over the years that this combination and do a world of wonders.
As for the block, the "rod stroke" ratio is fine for a boosted car. In the all-motor world, it is a bit more important due to the piston speeds that you would normally be at over 9000 + rpm situations. Here, the idea is torque with boost, something the "torqueless wonder" B16 has had. One scenario you may consider is keep the bore simple to about 84mm (headgaskets and supplemental parts are easier to replace if needed, as opposed to weird bore sizes like 83mm... you can also bore out to 84.5mm on the sleeved block if needed.), and use the LS 89mm stroke crank, and keep it from being too much out of your wallet. You can still easily rev to 8200rpms, and have a great power and torque curve.
As for turbo, you don't necessarily have to go ball-bearing, especially with the torque you'll be able to make. The silver surfer, and GT3257bs can do a world of difference while still keeping your reliability, and spend under $900 for the turbo, as opposed to over 1200 for the turbo and 200 or so for the water lines. With only 12psi, over 250ft/lbs can easily be made, good both for street and track.
There are lots of alternatives, of course,but I've found over the years that this combination and do a world of wonders.
10-24-2007, 11:45 AM
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Re: Ultimate B-series Turbo Touring (all_motorsi)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by all_motorsi »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">In my quest to design the ULTIMATE B-series turbo motor that would share the following
380WHP - 450WHP
9000 rpm redline
smooth torque curve
quick and linear boost/throttle response
high reliability/maintaince intervals
withstand abuse found on a road-course type of racetrack
WILL NOT BLOW UP!!
according to various engine building theorists and internet forums, having a poor Rod/Stroke ratio can degrade the reliability of an engine, increasingly so under boost. at a road race you are WOT at high RPM's for very long periods of time.
A B16 has a perfect 1.75:1 Rod/Stroke ratio. 77mm stroke, 203.37 mm Deck
A GSR has a less than perferct 1.58:1 R/S Ratio 87.2mm stroke, 212.39 mm Deck
B16 would be ideal, but unfortunately the short stroke makes this engine slightly less than competitive with other engines especially in the 4K-6K rpm range. While a monster up top, a good road course engine needs more torque and linearity through the midrange to be competitive.
My propositions:::::
Option#1
Use a GSR block bored to 83mm, Darton Cast Iron Sleeves (retaining water jacket)
as well as 12-point block posting, Using an Eagle B16 84mm Forged Stroker crankshaft (84mm stroke) and 139.5mm custom eagle rods, Arias B16 Pistons with ~ 29 - 30.89mm wrist pin location (to achieve 9.4:1 compression) Gives a displacement of 1817cc, but much more importantly, a Rod/Stroke ratio of 1.66:1. This will improve dwell at TDC, giving a wider and more conservative envelope for tuning and spark timing, stable piston velocities, and much less sidewall loading than a stock GSR. All in all to make an engine with a thick midrange and insane top end that is as reliable and bulletproof as ever.
Esintally a B16 Stroker kit with longer rods stuffed into a GSR block.
whadda think? am i barkin up the right school of thought or would i be just as better off building a GSR with factory dimensions? How do all you guys out there with 92 or 95mm stroker cranks feel about your turbo charged performance in terms of power linearity and driveability?
appreciate all feedback</TD></TR></TABLE>
i personally think you are over complicating things. you have a couple options. you can upgrade to an OEM Honda 84mm crank, the b17 motors came with them stock. second, people have had great success with the stock crank and dimensions on the LS and GSR b18 bottom ends.
i think you should be more focused on your oil and cooling system. this is where the hondas lack on the road course. a proper manifold that will allow you to use a full core radiator would be ideal.
and i would check out benson sleeves. they are a complete open deck a plus for cooling.
380WHP - 450WHP
9000 rpm redline
smooth torque curve
quick and linear boost/throttle response
high reliability/maintaince intervals
withstand abuse found on a road-course type of racetrack
WILL NOT BLOW UP!!
according to various engine building theorists and internet forums, having a poor Rod/Stroke ratio can degrade the reliability of an engine, increasingly so under boost. at a road race you are WOT at high RPM's for very long periods of time.
A B16 has a perfect 1.75:1 Rod/Stroke ratio. 77mm stroke, 203.37 mm Deck
A GSR has a less than perferct 1.58:1 R/S Ratio 87.2mm stroke, 212.39 mm Deck
B16 would be ideal, but unfortunately the short stroke makes this engine slightly less than competitive with other engines especially in the 4K-6K rpm range. While a monster up top, a good road course engine needs more torque and linearity through the midrange to be competitive.
My propositions:::::
Option#1
Use a GSR block bored to 83mm, Darton Cast Iron Sleeves (retaining water jacket)
as well as 12-point block posting, Using an Eagle B16 84mm Forged Stroker crankshaft (84mm stroke) and 139.5mm custom eagle rods, Arias B16 Pistons with ~ 29 - 30.89mm wrist pin location (to achieve 9.4:1 compression) Gives a displacement of 1817cc, but much more importantly, a Rod/Stroke ratio of 1.66:1. This will improve dwell at TDC, giving a wider and more conservative envelope for tuning and spark timing, stable piston velocities, and much less sidewall loading than a stock GSR. All in all to make an engine with a thick midrange and insane top end that is as reliable and bulletproof as ever.
Esintally a B16 Stroker kit with longer rods stuffed into a GSR block.
whadda think? am i barkin up the right school of thought or would i be just as better off building a GSR with factory dimensions? How do all you guys out there with 92 or 95mm stroker cranks feel about your turbo charged performance in terms of power linearity and driveability?
appreciate all feedback</TD></TR></TABLE>
i personally think you are over complicating things. you have a couple options. you can upgrade to an OEM Honda 84mm crank, the b17 motors came with them stock. second, people have had great success with the stock crank and dimensions on the LS and GSR b18 bottom ends.
i think you should be more focused on your oil and cooling system. this is where the hondas lack on the road course. a proper manifold that will allow you to use a full core radiator would be ideal.
and i would check out benson sleeves. they are a complete open deck a plus for cooling.
10-24-2007, 12:07 PM
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i remember the b16 rod/stroke ratio being 1:74
and i could have swore the GSR R/S was higher then your stated 1:58 That sounds more in the area of the LS block.... Just wondering. People don't talk about that stuff as often as they should. You mentioned you liked the way a GSR feels. With the right cams, you would have no problem in mid to top range. I personally would do a full GSR with ITR cams and a mean oil/air cooling system. You would have no problem making 300hp+ and revs higher then Karate kick. good luck!
and i could have swore the GSR R/S was higher then your stated 1:58 That sounds more in the area of the LS block.... Just wondering. People don't talk about that stuff as often as they should. You mentioned you liked the way a GSR feels. With the right cams, you would have no problem in mid to top range. I personally would do a full GSR with ITR cams and a mean oil/air cooling system. You would have no problem making 300hp+ and revs higher then Karate kick. good luck!
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10-24-2007, 12:57 PM
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Re: Ultimate B-series Turbo Touring (all_motorsi)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by all_motorsi »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">In my quest to design the ULTIMATE B-series turbo motor that would share the following
380WHP - 450WHP
9000 rpm redline
smooth torque curve
quick and linear boost/throttle response
high reliability/maintaince intervals
withstand abuse found on a road-course type of racetrack
WILL NOT BLOW UP!!
according to various engine building theorists and internet forums, having a poor Rod/Stroke ratio can degrade the reliability of an engine, increasingly so under boost. at a road race you are WOT at high RPM's for very long periods of time.
A B16 has a perfect 1.75:1 Rod/Stroke ratio. 77mm stroke, 203.37 mm Deck
A GSR has a less than perferct 1.58:1 R/S Ratio 87.2mm stroke, 212.39 mm Deck
B16 would be ideal, but unfortunately the short stroke makes this engine slightly less than competitive with other engines especially in the 4K-6K rpm range. While a monster up top, a good road course engine needs more torque and linearity through the midrange to be competitive.
My propositions:::::
Option#1
Use a GSR block bored to 83mm, Darton Cast Iron Sleeves (retaining water jacket)
as well as 12-point block posting, Using an Eagle B16 84mm Forged Stroker crankshaft (84mm stroke) and 139.5mm custom eagle rods, Arias B16 Pistons with ~ 29 - 30.89mm wrist pin location (to achieve 9.4:1 compression) Gives a displacement of 1817cc, but much more importantly, a Rod/Stroke ratio of 1.66:1. This will improve dwell at TDC, giving a wider and more conservative envelope for tuning and spark timing, stable piston velocities, and much less sidewall loading than a stock GSR. All in all to make an engine with a thick midrange and insane top end that is as reliable and bulletproof as ever.
Esintally a B16 Stroker kit with longer rods stuffed into a GSR block.
whadda think? am i barkin up the right school of thought or would i be just as better off building a GSR with factory dimensions? How do all you guys out there with 92 or 95mm stroker cranks feel about your turbo charged performance in terms of power linearity and driveability?
appreciate all feedback</TD></TR></TABLE>
sounds good i've seen a few drag guys use 86mm pistons and around 90mm cranks with a turbo and the car worked fined although i dont know what their RPM range was. just something for you to look into tho. goodluck with your build and remember keeping the oil and water cool are gonna keep your engine happier in road racing tracks
380WHP - 450WHP
9000 rpm redline
smooth torque curve
quick and linear boost/throttle response
high reliability/maintaince intervals
withstand abuse found on a road-course type of racetrack
WILL NOT BLOW UP!!
according to various engine building theorists and internet forums, having a poor Rod/Stroke ratio can degrade the reliability of an engine, increasingly so under boost. at a road race you are WOT at high RPM's for very long periods of time.
A B16 has a perfect 1.75:1 Rod/Stroke ratio. 77mm stroke, 203.37 mm Deck
A GSR has a less than perferct 1.58:1 R/S Ratio 87.2mm stroke, 212.39 mm Deck
B16 would be ideal, but unfortunately the short stroke makes this engine slightly less than competitive with other engines especially in the 4K-6K rpm range. While a monster up top, a good road course engine needs more torque and linearity through the midrange to be competitive.
My propositions:::::
Option#1
Use a GSR block bored to 83mm, Darton Cast Iron Sleeves (retaining water jacket)
as well as 12-point block posting, Using an Eagle B16 84mm Forged Stroker crankshaft (84mm stroke) and 139.5mm custom eagle rods, Arias B16 Pistons with ~ 29 - 30.89mm wrist pin location (to achieve 9.4:1 compression) Gives a displacement of 1817cc, but much more importantly, a Rod/Stroke ratio of 1.66:1. This will improve dwell at TDC, giving a wider and more conservative envelope for tuning and spark timing, stable piston velocities, and much less sidewall loading than a stock GSR. All in all to make an engine with a thick midrange and insane top end that is as reliable and bulletproof as ever.
Esintally a B16 Stroker kit with longer rods stuffed into a GSR block.
whadda think? am i barkin up the right school of thought or would i be just as better off building a GSR with factory dimensions? How do all you guys out there with 92 or 95mm stroker cranks feel about your turbo charged performance in terms of power linearity and driveability?
appreciate all feedback</TD></TR></TABLE>
sounds good i've seen a few drag guys use 86mm pistons and around 90mm cranks with a turbo and the car worked fined although i dont know what their RPM range was. just something for you to look into tho. goodluck with your build and remember keeping the oil and water cool are gonna keep your engine happier in road racing tracks
10-24-2007, 04:07 PM
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Re: Ultimate B-series Turbo Touring (tony413)
I believe a B17 crank is 81.4mm,
as for using an 89mm LS crank, it would make great bottom end but wouldnt work well in a road course beacuse of excessive wheelspin from the overwhelming torque and then it would be anemic on the top end. also, agian rod/stroke ratio would have the pisont pounding the sidewall with very short TDC dwell, ETC. I would in all realitly like to rev up to and past 10,000 rpm's but thats not going to happen...
as for using an 89mm LS crank, it would make great bottom end but wouldnt work well in a road course beacuse of excessive wheelspin from the overwhelming torque and then it would be anemic on the top end. also, agian rod/stroke ratio would have the pisont pounding the sidewall with very short TDC dwell, ETC. I would in all realitly like to rev up to and past 10,000 rpm's but thats not going to happen...
10-24-2007, 06:43 PM
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Re: Ultimate B-series Turbo Touring (all_motorsi)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by all_motorsi »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I believe a B17 crank is 81.4mm,
as for using an 89mm LS crank, it would make great bottom end but wouldnt work well in a road course beacuse of excessive wheelspin from the overwhelming torque and then it would be anemic on the top end. also, agian rod/stroke ratio would have the pisont pounding the sidewall with very short TDC dwell, ETC. I would in all realitly like to rev up to and past 10,000 rpm's but thats not going to happen...</TD></TR></TABLE>
you are right sorry for the misinformation.
as for using an 89mm LS crank, it would make great bottom end but wouldnt work well in a road course beacuse of excessive wheelspin from the overwhelming torque and then it would be anemic on the top end. also, agian rod/stroke ratio would have the pisont pounding the sidewall with very short TDC dwell, ETC. I would in all realitly like to rev up to and past 10,000 rpm's but thats not going to happen...</TD></TR></TABLE>
you are right sorry for the misinformation.
10-24-2007, 09:27 PM
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Re: Ultimate B-series Turbo Touring (all_motorsi)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by all_motorsi »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I believe a B17 crank is 81.4mm,
as for using an 89mm LS crank, it would make great bottom end but wouldnt work well in a road course beacuse of excessive wheelspin from the overwhelming torque and then it would be anemic on the top end. also, agian rod/stroke ratio would have the pisont pounding the sidewall with very short TDC dwell, ETC. I would in all realitly like to rev up to and past 10,000 rpm's but thats not going to happen...</TD></TR></TABLE>
you can rev up to 11,000 + with a spoon engine or jun engine its just gonna take you $10,000 to get there and thats just in motor
honestly keep the b16 and bore the **** out of it. next upgrade the head like tomorrow oversized valves, P-n-P, very stiff valve springs, ect... you get it if you plan on spinning pass 10K RPMs get the flywheel lightened and some carrillo rods
keep the crank stock just get it micropolished
as for using an 89mm LS crank, it would make great bottom end but wouldnt work well in a road course beacuse of excessive wheelspin from the overwhelming torque and then it would be anemic on the top end. also, agian rod/stroke ratio would have the pisont pounding the sidewall with very short TDC dwell, ETC. I would in all realitly like to rev up to and past 10,000 rpm's but thats not going to happen...</TD></TR></TABLE>
you can rev up to 11,000 + with a spoon engine or jun engine its just gonna take you $10,000 to get there and thats just in motor
honestly keep the b16 and bore the **** out of it. next upgrade the head like tomorrow oversized valves, P-n-P, very stiff valve springs, ect... you get it if you plan on spinning pass 10K RPMs get the flywheel lightened and some carrillo rods
keep the crank stock just get it micropolished
10-25-2007, 01:25 AM
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Re: Ultimate B-series Turbo Touring (tokesGTR)
buy a different car?>? Ive actually been thinking about building a miata... i just dont like the stock motor at all.
I also have a '71 Corolla that will soon be receiving a fire breathing N/A 351W and a C-6 with a 9" rear end and slicks... hehe 10's here i come!!!
meh i really like the civic.. i mean its competitive as it is... i've invested alot of time and money into it to get it where it is with coil overs, polyurethane bushings, steering rack, braces, traction bars, etc etc the list goes on. paid 10K for the car got 5K invested easy. i dont think im going to start any more projects until i get this motor built. hence my thread. +i want to be different, EVERYONE tells me to stroke and poke the B16... but expletive that noise i can do much better with the aforementioned setup.
I also have a '71 Corolla that will soon be receiving a fire breathing N/A 351W and a C-6 with a 9" rear end and slicks... hehe 10's here i come!!!
meh i really like the civic.. i mean its competitive as it is... i've invested alot of time and money into it to get it where it is with coil overs, polyurethane bushings, steering rack, braces, traction bars, etc etc the list goes on. paid 10K for the car got 5K invested easy. i dont think im going to start any more projects until i get this motor built. hence my thread. +i want to be different, EVERYONE tells me to stroke and poke the B16... but expletive that noise i can do much better with the aforementioned setup.
10-25-2007, 08:46 AM
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Re: Ultimate B-series Turbo Touring (all_motorsi)
You're scared to get rid of it because you have 5000 bucks into that and think it's a ton of work done? haha, I'm ~17K into my GTR and seriously considering selling it because I'm getting tired of just ordering parts and feeling no closer to the end.
A stroked B16 would be stupid, so would destroking a GSR. An 84mm GSR motor would be reliable all day at 400 WHP and 9000+ RPM's. It just doesn't make sense to destroke it, you gain absolutely nothing at the end of the day.
If you want to keep the civic, keep it. But don't expect 450 WHP on a road course to do much of anything except spin. A miata would be a much better platform for a higher power track car, IMHO.
FWIW, skip out on the C6 and a 9". You can go 8's on an 8.8 and a C4, you don't need the heavier power sucking parts for a N/A motor.
A stroked B16 would be stupid, so would destroking a GSR. An 84mm GSR motor would be reliable all day at 400 WHP and 9000+ RPM's. It just doesn't make sense to destroke it, you gain absolutely nothing at the end of the day.
If you want to keep the civic, keep it. But don't expect 450 WHP on a road course to do much of anything except spin. A miata would be a much better platform for a higher power track car, IMHO.
FWIW, skip out on the C6 and a 9". You can go 8's on an 8.8 and a C4, you don't need the heavier power sucking parts for a N/A motor.
10-25-2007, 09:18 AM
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If i where to build a motor for that class it would be a Stock b16 with a set of eagle and cp's and a gt30R
the sleeves will hold up under that power with that kind if heat and load and the price would be way down You can make power with a b16 with a smaller turbo 5K-10K just make sure the head is in top notch shape
the sleeves will hold up under that power with that kind if heat and load and the price would be way down You can make power with a b16 with a smaller turbo 5K-10K just make sure the head is in top notch shape
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chrisxmichael
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08-31-2011 10:02 AM
