is uberdata better than hondata????????
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From: Seattle, Wa, USA
Re: is uberdata better than hondata???????? (94goldjungsr)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">also, as stated, anyone who can tune hondata can tune uberdata.</TD></TR></TABLE>
What don't you understand about dynos in my area not tuning with Uberdata. I never said that they didn't have the ability to tune with it, I just said that they wouldn't. Obviously it conflicts with their Hondata tuning and sales.
What don't you understand about dynos in my area not tuning with Uberdata. I never said that they didn't have the ability to tune with it, I just said that they wouldn't. Obviously it conflicts with their Hondata tuning and sales.
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Re: is uberdata better than hondata???????? (slim9300)
you clearly have no idea what moot means if you are bashing my use of it. to call a point, 'moot', or irrelevant, is very common, especially in a legal environment.
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From: Seattle, Wa, USA
Re: is uberdata better than hondata???????? (94goldjungsr)
"The adjective moot is originally a legal term going back to the mid-16th century. It derives from the noun moot, in its sense of a hypothetical case argued as an exercise by law students. Consequently, a moot question is one that is arguable or open to debate. But in the mid-19th century people also began to look at the hypothetical side of moot as its essential meaning, and they started to use the word to mean “of no significance or relevance."
What don't you understand about the word moot after reading the link. You are clearly bastardizing the word in a legal and traditional sense. Like I said before:
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">But if you insist on using the word moot, at least you realize where your english is weak.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Maybe your legal environment is a weak one.
What don't you understand about the word moot after reading the link. You are clearly bastardizing the word in a legal and traditional sense. Like I said before:
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">But if you insist on using the word moot, at least you realize where your english is weak.
</TD></TR></TABLE>Maybe your legal environment is a weak one.
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From: Longmont, CO, usa
Re: is uberdata better than hondata???????? (slim9300)
did you forget that i said i would help you tune your uberdata? i live like 5 minutes from you. if you are gonna spend the money to buy hondata (at LEAST 400) and then have someone tune it (at LEAST 200), youy are looking at 600, probably more like a g when you add on features and dyno time. i'll hook you up. PM me if you are interested in saving some money.
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From: Seattle, Wa, USA
Re: is uberdata better than hondata???????? (ndogg)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">did you forget that i said i would help you tune your uberdata? i live like 5 minutes from you. if you are gonna spend the money to buy hondata (at LEAST 400) and then have someone tune it (at LEAST 200), youy are looking at 600, probably more like a g when you add on features and dyno time. i'll hook you up. PM me if you are interested in saving some money.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Actually I didn't remember. Do you have a number I can reach you at? Also, I have a PLX M-300 wideband unit, so tuning should go pretty smooth if you can help me. Also, obviously I can pay you pretty well.
But I was under the impression that Uberdata didn't work with the p13 ecu. Is this true? So you can datalog with the Uberdata now right?
Actually I didn't remember. Do you have a number I can reach you at? Also, I have a PLX M-300 wideband unit, so tuning should go pretty smooth if you can help me. Also, obviously I can pay you pretty well.
But I was under the impression that Uberdata didn't work with the p13 ecu. Is this true? So you can datalog with the Uberdata now right?
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From: Seattle, Wa, USA
Re: is uberdata better than hondata???????? (94goldjungsr)
Just to further reinforce my point, take a look at this LAW website. http://dictionary.law.com/
Enter the word moot and here is what you get...
"moot: adj. 1) unsettled, open to argument or debatable, specifically about a legal question which has not been determined by any decision of any court. 2) an issue only of academic interest."
Like a said before, "Maybe your legal environment is a weak one." I would suggest finding a better law school.
Next time E-thug someone who isn't smarter then you.
Enter the word moot and here is what you get...
"moot: adj. 1) unsettled, open to argument or debatable, specifically about a legal question which has not been determined by any decision of any court. 2) an issue only of academic interest."
Like a said before, "Maybe your legal environment is a weak one." I would suggest finding a better law school.
Next time E-thug someone who isn't smarter then you.
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From: Los Angeles/San Francisco, CA, USA
Re: is uberdata better than hondata???????? (slim9300)
How did this thread turn into the, "Definition of Moot". Basically if you can afford to pay someone to tune your car and dont care about learning anything new, then go Hondata. But if youre on a limited budget (like most of us), want to learn, and dont want to be at the mercy of a tuner, then go Uberdata.
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From: Utah, foo, usa
Re: is uberdata better than hondata???????? (Alchemist)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Alchemist »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">How did this thread turn into the, "Definition of Moot". Basically if you can afford to pay someone to tune your car and dont care about learning anything new, then go Hondata. But if youre on a limited budget (like most of us), want to learn, and dont want to be at the mercy of a tuner, then go Uberdata.</TD></TR></TABLE>
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From: Islip, CA, USA
Re: is uberdata better than hondata???????? (slim9300)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by slim9300 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Just to further reinforce my point, take a look at this LAW website. http://dictionary.law.com/
Enter the word moot and here is what you get...
"moot: adj. 1) unsettled, open to argument or debatable, specifically about a legal question which has not been determined by any decision of any court. 2) an issue only of academic interest."
Like a said before, "Maybe your legal environment is a weak one." I would suggest finding a better law school.
Next time E-thug someone who isn't smarter then you.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
i don't need online definitions, im a political science major, we use the term all the time. real world > your little online examples. I also used to go to Johns Hopkins, what a shitty school that is.
Modified by 94goldjungsr at 11:05 PM 4/15/2004
Enter the word moot and here is what you get...
"moot: adj. 1) unsettled, open to argument or debatable, specifically about a legal question which has not been determined by any decision of any court. 2) an issue only of academic interest."
Like a said before, "Maybe your legal environment is a weak one." I would suggest finding a better law school.
Next time E-thug someone who isn't smarter then you.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
i don't need online definitions, im a political science major, we use the term all the time. real world > your little online examples. I also used to go to Johns Hopkins, what a shitty school that is.
Modified by 94goldjungsr at 11:05 PM 4/15/2004
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From: Islip, CA, USA
Re: is uberdata better than hondata???????? (94goldjungsr)
http://www.quinion.com/words/qa/qa-moo1.htm
It used to be used how you are using it, now no one does that. Once again, read your little dictionary.com when you don't understand a word all day, I do not care. I use this word in legal debate all the time and not a single law professor flinches an eye. If you were so smart you would look beyond the ancient meaning of the word.
Here is Andred Card using the word just a few months ago to describe iraq:
http://www.cleveland.com/news/...0.xml
Go give him a call and tell him how smart you are, while you are at it, tell him how hard hondata is to use.
It used to be used how you are using it, now no one does that. Once again, read your little dictionary.com when you don't understand a word all day, I do not care. I use this word in legal debate all the time and not a single law professor flinches an eye. If you were so smart you would look beyond the ancient meaning of the word.
Here is Andred Card using the word just a few months ago to describe iraq:
http://www.cleveland.com/news/...0.xml
Go give him a call and tell him how smart you are, while you are at it, tell him how hard hondata is to use.
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From: Islip, CA, USA
Re: is uberdata better than hondata???????? (94goldjungsr)
Also if you are so damn smart, tune your own uberdata and quit being a mindless fool who pays more than he should for hondata. If you cannot figure out uberdata, there is no way you are smart. IBhesaysnotenoughtime, it took me 20 minutes, abotu the time he's put into learning the word moot.
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From: Canada City
Re: is uberdata better than hondata???????? (J. Davis)
Prices vary though.
and whoever was trying to "teach me" with whats involved..thanks.. Im well aware..been here long enough and am pretty much in the loop for most things discussed here.
and whoever was trying to "teach me" with whats involved..thanks.. Im well aware..been here long enough and am pretty much in the loop for most things discussed here.
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From: Islip, CA, USA
Re: is uberdata better than hondata???????? (SiRkid)
hey let him teach you everything, he's smarter than elected government officials, although he can't figure out uberdata (he doesn't have enough time).
I am sick of trying to tell people about uberdata, their weak minds just want the easy and comfortable solution-hondata- it is like the child's teddy bear for honda-tech's moronic. just hug it and hold it, itwill treat you right, don't worry- you don't need to think.
I am sick of trying to tell people about uberdata, their weak minds just want the easy and comfortable solution-hondata- it is like the child's teddy bear for honda-tech's moronic. just hug it and hold it, itwill treat you right, don't worry- you don't need to think.
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From: Islip, CA, USA
Re: is uberdata better than hondata???????? (94goldjungsr)
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From: ashEVILle, NC, USSR
Re: is uberdata better than hondata???????? (SiRkid)
Prices may vary, but not enough to have Uberdata cost as much as Hondata, as per your insinuation. If that is not what you meant to say... it is late and entirely possible I misread you, but much more likely you misspoke.
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From: Planet BOOOST
Re: is uberdata better than hondata???????? (slim9300)
A prime example of how H-T is turning more and more into a non-technical forum. Bloody time wasters! Take your cat fight outside where it belongs and keep HT the way it should be - A TECHNICAL RESOURCE.. No wonder all the good ol techies are hardly in here anymore....
People come in here to look for good technical advice, not to see people bitching between thenselves
This is not an Thesaurus/Dictionary thread.
People come in here to look for good technical advice, not to see people bitching between thenselves
This is not an Thesaurus/Dictionary thread.
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Re: is uberdata better than hondata???????? (94goldjungsr)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 94goldjungsr »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I am sick of trying to tell people about uberdata, their weak minds just want the easy and comfortable solution-hondata- it is like the child's teddy bear for honda-tech's moronic. just hug it and hold it, itwill treat you right, don't worry- you don't need to think.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Werd... that's all I can say about that comment. I'm getting so frustrated trying to explain this to you mindless bandwagoners. There is no way you can convince me that uberdata and hondata can ever equal the same price, even if the hondata unit is bought used. What you hardcore hondata buffs don't seem to grasp is that hondata and uberdata require the exact same equipment, except for the hondata box itself. Pound for pound you're going to save the cost of the hondata unit every time.
Hondata costs more, hands down, whether you're willing to accept that or not. Wise up to this fact, or hang on to 94goldjungsr's teddy bear.
EDIT: slim9300, your attack on 94goldjungsr's English doesn't have anything to do with the topic at hand. If you feel that your argument has been disproved, then accept it. His use of 'moot' was perfectly acceptable, it's the common use of the word. Who cares if it does have two meanings? Don't resort to cheap-shots, just argue your point.
Modified by MadCow at 11:07 AM 4/16/2004
Werd... that's all I can say about that comment. I'm getting so frustrated trying to explain this to you mindless bandwagoners. There is no way you can convince me that uberdata and hondata can ever equal the same price, even if the hondata unit is bought used. What you hardcore hondata buffs don't seem to grasp is that hondata and uberdata require the exact same equipment, except for the hondata box itself. Pound for pound you're going to save the cost of the hondata unit every time.
Hondata costs more, hands down, whether you're willing to accept that or not. Wise up to this fact, or hang on to 94goldjungsr's teddy bear.
EDIT: slim9300, your attack on 94goldjungsr's English doesn't have anything to do with the topic at hand. If you feel that your argument has been disproved, then accept it. His use of 'moot' was perfectly acceptable, it's the common use of the word. Who cares if it does have two meanings? Don't resort to cheap-shots, just argue your point.
Modified by MadCow at 11:07 AM 4/16/2004
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From: Los Angeles/San Francisco, CA, USA
Hondata S200B - $425
Tuning - on average $300
---------------------------------------
$725
Uberdata Software - Free
Chipping Supplies - $20
Eprom Burner - $100
Techedge DIY Wideband - $290
--------------------------------------------
$410
So basically you save yourself about $300 by tuning yourself and you have a wideband which you can keep or sell back on HT and make back your money. You also can retune your car anytime that you make changes in your setup and wont have to shell out more cash to a tuner.
Tuning - on average $300
---------------------------------------
$725
Uberdata Software - Free
Chipping Supplies - $20
Eprom Burner - $100
Techedge DIY Wideband - $290
--------------------------------------------
$410
So basically you save yourself about $300 by tuning yourself and you have a wideband which you can keep or sell back on HT and make back your money. You also can retune your car anytime that you make changes in your setup and wont have to shell out more cash to a tuner.
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Joined: Mar 2002
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From: Midwest, USA
Re: (Alchemist)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Alchemist »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Hondata S200B - $425
Tuning - on average $300
---------------------------------------
$725
Uberdata Software - Free
Chipping Supplies - $20
Eprom Burner - $100
Techedge DIY Wideband - $290
--------------------------------------------
$410
So basically you save yourself about $300 by tuning yourself and you have a wideband which you can keep or sell back on HT and make back your money. You also can retune your car anytime that you make changes in your setup and wont have to shell out more cash to a tuner.</TD></TR></TABLE>
nice breakdown there
perhaps it is safe to come to the conclusion that the cost of hardware is about the same between hondata and uberdata. however, after spending that nominal $400, with uberdata you now have all the equipment necessary to tune what you want when you want. with hondata, you're at the mercy of a tuner. dont forget, even though the wideband may seem expensive, you can always tune your friends car's too
Tuning - on average $300
---------------------------------------
$725
Uberdata Software - Free
Chipping Supplies - $20
Eprom Burner - $100
Techedge DIY Wideband - $290
--------------------------------------------
$410
So basically you save yourself about $300 by tuning yourself and you have a wideband which you can keep or sell back on HT and make back your money. You also can retune your car anytime that you make changes in your setup and wont have to shell out more cash to a tuner.</TD></TR></TABLE>
nice breakdown there
perhaps it is safe to come to the conclusion that the cost of hardware is about the same between hondata and uberdata. however, after spending that nominal $400, with uberdata you now have all the equipment necessary to tune what you want when you want. with hondata, you're at the mercy of a tuner. dont forget, even though the wideband may seem expensive, you can always tune your friends car's too
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Re: (Alchemist)
[QUOTE=Alchemist]Hondata S200B - $425
Tuning - on average $300
---------------------------------------
$725
Uberdata Software - Free
Chipping Supplies - $20
Eprom Burner - $100
Techedge DIY Wideband - $290
--------------------------------------------
$410
QUOTE]
Don't forget the $75 Hondata charges to socket the ecu. Its also hard to put a price on the knowledge, etc you can gain by learning things on your own
Tuning - on average $300
---------------------------------------
$725
Uberdata Software - Free
Chipping Supplies - $20
Eprom Burner - $100
Techedge DIY Wideband - $290
--------------------------------------------
$410
QUOTE]
Don't forget the $75 Hondata charges to socket the ecu.
Its also hard to put a price on the knowledge, etc you can gain by learning things on your own
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From: Palm Bay, FL
Re: (keebler65)
All I know is:
Roughly, I have $8000 into my project 1995 Civic now.. and I'm glad it isnt $9000 because I had to buy a full Hondata system.. to get 80% of the functionality Uberdata has. I think most people know where I stand, hell I host the Uberdata site.
I think that at this stage *I* can assume (barring total new users) the following things:
1.) Most Honda-Tech enthusiasts/readers know what Uberdata, Crome & Turboedit are.
2.) Many Honda-Tech members I've met have migrated to the 'freeware' editors. Not because we're all cheap, but we like to know more about our cars. You don't learn anything handing Bubba 500 bucks to replace a clutch, y'know? Well its the same thing for ECU's. However the low cost is a big plus :D
3.) While Uberdata/Crome/Turboedit lack some of the 'features' of a Zdyne or Hondata unit... I can safely say that every feature I ever used on my Hondata 4b is functioning, in OBDI land anyway. I have closed loop disable, 3bar, boostcut, full throttle launch and shift.. plus all the other stuff (some of which my old 4b DIDNT have) like VTEC under 20mph, no VTEC coolant check, PA/ELD/Injector test disable for JDM/EDM ECU's and the list goes on and on. I wrote my own Palm Pilot datalogger, so I have datalogging anyway (and yes im planning on releasing it soon)
4.) For the more advanced users like myself and others, the scripting abilities in the freeware editors allow us to easily test theories and deploy them to the end-users. It would be a big hassle if for every new lil feature we find, I had to bug blake to hard code it into Uberdata.
5.) Freeware is not a copy of Hondata/Zdyne/EMS, nor is it a fluke or gimmick to be laughed at. Its the culmination of a lot of smart people making a stand and being men/women and figuring it out. And for people to continually accuse pgmfi.org members or anyone else of plagiarism is OFFENSIVE, WRONG and ***-BACKWARDS.
People like so rub backs around here on engine building tips, groupbuys, 'tuning events' (whatever the hell that is) etc. Well I'm here to tell you (as a long-time avid Honda enthusiast) that pgmfi.org and all the good things that have come from it (ie: Uberdata, Crome, Turboedit, Ghettodyne, Ecucontrol.. the list just goes on and on) has done MORE for the Honda community than anything else I've seen in a long time. Dave B is a very modest person, and would never say that... but someone has to.
6.) I (and I think most other HT members) could give a **** what the proper usage of moot is. I use it in 94goldjungsr's mannor all the time, so get bent...
---
This is how I feel/my opinions on the matter.... if you don't like them I guess thats your call. I usually stay out of fruitless threds like this, but I felt compelled to post. I'm sure j davis will now trample my feelings and make me cry softly in a corner :~(
Roughly, I have $8000 into my project 1995 Civic now.. and I'm glad it isnt $9000 because I had to buy a full Hondata system.. to get 80% of the functionality Uberdata has. I think most people know where I stand, hell I host the Uberdata site.
I think that at this stage *I* can assume (barring total new users) the following things:
1.) Most Honda-Tech enthusiasts/readers know what Uberdata, Crome & Turboedit are.
2.) Many Honda-Tech members I've met have migrated to the 'freeware' editors. Not because we're all cheap, but we like to know more about our cars. You don't learn anything handing Bubba 500 bucks to replace a clutch, y'know? Well its the same thing for ECU's. However the low cost is a big plus :D
3.) While Uberdata/Crome/Turboedit lack some of the 'features' of a Zdyne or Hondata unit... I can safely say that every feature I ever used on my Hondata 4b is functioning, in OBDI land anyway. I have closed loop disable, 3bar, boostcut, full throttle launch and shift.. plus all the other stuff (some of which my old 4b DIDNT have) like VTEC under 20mph, no VTEC coolant check, PA/ELD/Injector test disable for JDM/EDM ECU's and the list goes on and on. I wrote my own Palm Pilot datalogger, so I have datalogging anyway
(and yes im planning on releasing it soon)4.) For the more advanced users like myself and others, the scripting abilities in the freeware editors allow us to easily test theories and deploy them to the end-users. It would be a big hassle if for every new lil feature we find, I had to bug blake to hard code it into Uberdata.
5.) Freeware is not a copy of Hondata/Zdyne/EMS, nor is it a fluke or gimmick to be laughed at. Its the culmination of a lot of smart people making a stand and being men/women and figuring it out. And for people to continually accuse pgmfi.org members or anyone else of plagiarism is OFFENSIVE, WRONG and ***-BACKWARDS.
People like so rub backs around here on engine building tips, groupbuys, 'tuning events' (whatever the hell that is) etc. Well I'm here to tell you (as a long-time avid Honda enthusiast) that pgmfi.org and all the good things that have come from it (ie: Uberdata, Crome, Turboedit, Ghettodyne, Ecucontrol.. the list just goes on and on) has done MORE for the Honda community than anything else I've seen in a long time. Dave B is a very modest person, and would never say that... but someone has to.
6.) I (and I think most other HT members) could give a **** what the proper usage of moot is. I use it in 94goldjungsr's mannor all the time, so get bent...
---
This is how I feel/my opinions on the matter.... if you don't like them I guess thats your call. I usually stay out of fruitless threds like this, but I felt compelled to post. I'm sure j davis will now trample my feelings and make me cry softly in a corner :~(
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From: Canada City
Re: is uberdata better than hondata???????? (J. Davis)
I think its a bit of both! I know hondata costs more ..but I was referring to people calling uberdata "cheap" cause its not really "cheap" imo.
cheaper then hondata by a bit..yes .
I know hondata costs more ..but I was referring to people calling uberdata "cheap" cause its not really "cheap" imo.cheaper then hondata by a bit..yes .