Joined the site just to get some info, I'm a tech at a Honda dealer so I know Hondas quite well.. Anyways I bought a 99 Em1 thats turbo'd and got it on the pretense that it had zero compression in cyl 2 which I confirmed before I bought it and was promised no metal. Which I was hesitant on but it was a good price! So I got it back and found metal in the filter coolant in the oil when I got it back so I'm hoping rod or crank bearing no big deal! Just wondering when B16A2 go to the dark side... What's the culprit that people have seen? It's getting torn down next Friday just wondering what some of you guys have experienced?

 

I really hope it's in the block I'm ok with spending some money on pistons and Rods if need be it was getting all the bearing regardless. I all ready planned on getting Pistons anyways! I just hope it's not In the head

 

<p>Metal in the oil filter, and coolant in the oil? &nbsp;This is 101 type stuff that you, as a professional tech,&nbsp;should know. &nbsp;Metal in the oil filter is spun bearings. &nbsp;Coolant in the oil is a blown head gasket, or cracked sleeves, or (rarely, but it happens) a crack in the head. &nbsp;It's time to strip that sucker down and give it a complete once over.</p>

 

Yeah fully aware of the 101 stuff! i was actually ok with the coolant in the oil and metal in the filter that means nothing to me on a N/A motor but what does that do to a turbo? Thats the kinda stuff im asking about... I know really little about turbo hondas Im kinda just wondering if i can decide if this is gonna be a flip for me or if I'm gonna make this a money pit like my last and at least have some fun with it.

 

<p>Never trust a used turbo, regardless of condition. &nbsp;It's always a crapshoot. &nbsp;As for the whole metal in the oil thing, that depends entirely on if the turbo was getting a filtered oil feed or not. &nbsp;How is the feed line hooked up?</p>

 

Im not entirely sure on the turbo setup as i dont know a ton about the stuff.From what i do know i dont think its the best stuff you can buy! It looks like a smaller braided line thats coming off the back of the block where the oil pressure sensor usually is the oil pressure switch and i think its T'd off there not a 100%. Does that sound right? I do know that there is a bigger line from the bottom of the turbo heading to the oil pan which im assuming is the drain...

 

<p>Yep, that bigger line is the drain. &nbsp;Yes, teeing into the oil pressure sensor is a common way to feed oil to the turbo. &nbsp;Unfortunately, it's an unfiltered source. &nbsp;Is there an inline filter anywhere on the braided line, or does the line just go straight from the tee to the turbo? &nbsp;Without a filter, that's a bad sign. &nbsp;Not necessarily a &quot;your turbo is fucked&quot; sign, since it would take some effort for those metal flakes to actually get into the turbo, but definitely not good.</p>

 

Awesome! As im typing this I'm replaying my past experience as an owner of a supercharged OG TypeR Fully Built about 5 years ago... Cant wait to "try it again" haha with a turbo setup now that I own the car! Total dumb question any way to flush and or clean a turbo out? Last ditch effort... Just in case

 

<p>Not that I'm aware of, but Shodan or wantboost could probably give you a better answer to that question. &nbsp;Like I said, though, never trust a used turbo. &nbsp;Just properly filter it, run it, and make sure you have some money laid aside to replace it when it ***** on you.</p>

 

Have you even identified the turbo? do ypu even know what you have? Depending it might be a waste of time and perhaps it belongs in the trash anyway if its a Chinese snail. That would be my first step and pulling the block apart of course since your fining metal shavings to really assess what it is you are working with

 

There isn't any way to "flush" out a turbocharger persay.

However you could try removing the turbocharger, placing it drain side up, filling it partially with fresh oil, then using low air pressure (10-15psi at most) pressurize the turbo from the drain side. This could dislodge small debris stuck in the feed passages. However once something happens like a bearing failure inside the engine once that debris reaches the feed ports and bearings inside the turbocharger they severely reduce oil flow to the bearings and seals and will almost instantaneously cause irreversible shaft damage, especially if it was under heavy load (high boost/shaft speed) because the loss of the oil film would generate immense heat that damages the turbine shaft on a molecular level.

So more than likely the turbo is toast and will need a full rebuild plus a new turbine shaft. Check the turbo for shaft play. If the starvation was severe enough and lasted long enough the thrust bearing will die which will allow the wheels to contact the housings. If you hear/feel metal on metal then you just need to cut your losses and buy a new turbocharger as the cost in parts alone would be nearly as much depending on the turbocharger not to mention the time and effort you'll have to pay someone for to rebuild and rebalance the turbo.

Now sometimes a turbocharger won't show initial signs of damage from oil contamination. It won't smoke or start making noises right away because it can take time for heat to build up within the shaft and CHRA until it reaches a critical point where everything let's go at once. On the other hand some starvations can be bad enough to grenade a turbocharger within seconds, especially under high loads.

I'm willing to bet that if I pulled your turbocharger apart right now I would see the signs of excess heat buildup within the shaft. For most people a typical rebuild and balance runs no less than 250. Replacing wheels can more than double that. I hope you aren't continuing to drive this car. The more you do, even letting it idle in your garage/driveway is only further irreversibly damaging the turbocharger. If it's leaving your house to be torn down it absolutely needs to be towed.


I'm going to go on a slight rant now...

When I see people spending thousands of dollars on modern turbochargers plus the other expenses surrounding forced induction yet almost no one takes step to protect the turbocharger from damaging debris in the oil, especially when feeding the turbocharger oil from the stock pressure sender port which is UNFILTERED OIL! You wouldn't run your engine without an oil filter would you? A turbocharger is no different. I see all of these unnecessary failures due to oil contamination killing turbochargers when spending maybe 55 dollars on an inline filter for the feed line could have saved your potentially 1500+ dollar turbocharger. It's literally the cheapest form of insurance for one of the most expensive components of forced induction yet literally 99% of people ignore it.

End rant lol.

 

Thanks for the info everyone! No Im not driving it. Im just gonna tear it down and go from there

 

Just for the record Wantboost, i've literally just bought my water & oil kits from B&R fittings, the inline filter for the turbo feed was $39 .. Not even $40 bucks to safe guard your turbo.

OP - Listen to these chaps, they are very very good.

 

Haha got it apart pretty sure I found the reason for zero compression!!!

 

That looks like the result of not being tuned. Hard to kill a piston that way and that bad with a proper tune at reasonable power levels.

 

Ive seen melted pistons before but holy **** that thing went into total meltdown.

 

Haha everyone at my dealer got a kick out of it. Surprising the cylinder wall wasnt in the bad of shape just a little bit of the aluminum melted to the side wall. Bought some 81.5mm pistons and block at the machine shop. It was tuned with Ectune which is pretty much obsolete I think so I guess gotta find some new software for it to be tuned with.

 

It's not about whether or not the features are obsolescent, its the tuner behind the software. Many of us here have software / hardware that might or might not be "the bee's knees", but they still work for a speed density-based application like a Honda.

 

Yeah

Ive never melted a piston that bad and in nar eyes im the shittiest tuner around

 

do you guys really trust these inline filters?
I about to run my second BB turbo of the 17 years I've been boosting, I was always a fan of journal bearing due to rebuildability (if thats a word) with my last journal bearing turbo I used a 3an feed, most reliable turbo I ever ran, BWS300, now planning to run the Garrett GTW6765 already have it. my sandwich plate is the golden eagle one, I was always thinking of running an inline filter but due to the size I am scared that a particle may jam the orifice closed and starve the turbo, same way I think now that I have to use a restrictor, my oil is Motul v300 20w50. sorry for the partial thread jack, but this might also help OP in his decisions while building.

 

Yes. I will PM you in a minute.

 

My god, yes.. All the more reason to run an inline oil filter. for a $1600 piece of equipment, why wouldn't you? That's like asking if you think its best to run a big oil filter in the engine block....which is a fraction of the speed of the turbocharger.

It's just a matter of getting the correct one, although you can't go wrong with the few popular options out there. You have to go beyond what a sandwich plate's "filter" can provide, because its not enough. Like auto security, you need several levels of protection.

 

Thank you.

 

Hey everyone 1 last question Im getting my block back tomorrow or Monday and I have the new over sized pistons and rings. I have the stock measurements for the ring gaps per the manuals. Added the pic below... Does everyone just follow those measurements in the middle area or try to get a little tighter or looser? Just wondering since it gonna be boosted.