M.A.R.C.

I'm curious because I'm not a tuner and I don't quite have this concept down. What is it or when is it that a motor has reached the max power it can make on pump gas. I'm asking because I see some b-series motors making over 400whp on pump gas and as some may know I have a built sohc motor that I'm gonna be boosting again soon. I wanted to have an idea what kinda power I'd be able to make on pump gas with a relatively conservative tune since it's a daily driven street car and my only car. The motor is a 77mm (~1.7L) d16z6 with Golden Eagle sleeves, 9:1 JE pistons, Eagle rods, Cometic standard headgasket, ARP Headstuds, stock z6 head with Skunk2 IM with a 62mm tb. The turbo is a PTE SC60 (60-1 hi-fi), stage 3 .63 a/r turbine. Tuning will be done with a Hondata 2B, fuel is supplied by 880cc injectors and a 255lph pump. With a setup like that what would determine the limit of power it can produce safely on pump gas?

GruvyTune

well.
its dependent on lots of things but on my 89mm bored H22, 18psi was the limit then I must have detonated and blew an oring.

M.A.R.C.

yah i figured that would be dependent on a lot of factors that's why i posted my setup. I've heard in the past that like 14-15psi was max most honda motors with 9:1 cr could do safely on pump but i've been talking to a few people who say possibly even 18psi. My guess is that it also depends on how aggressive u run ur timing. anyone have more input?

omahaturbocivic

I would like to know also! Someone on this board(i forget who) said they use 20psi or 450whp, whichever come first then they switch to race gas. I am also building a sohc right now so I know 20psi will come first but is even that too much?

g2turbo

Think WHP not boost level, that being said i would say 400 is a good stopping point. I personally wouldnt want to push anything over that on a pump tune, cause in all honesty you never know what is coming out of the pump.

Mase

On honda's id typically stop around 400 whp.

you can make more on pump gas, no question, but cylinder temps/pressure can get out of hand.

5thgencivic

and 400whp on a sohc would be 20+ psi I would think.

Mase

boost pressure doesnt matter...

5thgencivic

I know, I was just making a statement that it would probably be 20+

Nid Styles

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 5thgencivic &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I know, I was just making a statement that it would probably be 20+</TD></TR></TABLE>

On which turbo, though? I don't think you'd need 20+psi on a t76. You need to specify which turbo it would take that much otherwise what you are saying isn't true. Even then it may not be true if they did other work to help the turbo out. IE head work, cams, compression, nd a few others. Try not to make broad statements like that. That's how people become mis-informed.

5thgencivic

which is why I put "I would think" Next time I will keep my opinions to myself.... I was mearly implying it will take a lot of boost to see 400whp without nitrous on a sohc. 1 examples for instance. TurbodCX made 343Whp and 285WTQ on ~19psi fully built head and all with a .60/.63 Ar garret T3/T04E. Every situation is different. My opinions only Peace

Nate

hpfsi

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Mase &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">On honda's id typically stop around 400 whp.

you can make more on pump gas, no question, but cylinder temps/pressure can get out of hand. </TD></TR></TABLE>

400whp on a d-series? pump gas? really?

trbob16a

I think boost pressure does matter. The thermodynamics change as you increase boost pressure, which can be directly linked to detonation regardless of the power you're making.

lazerus

it would be more accurate to use sae corrected HP and torque figures to determine max possible hp..

But there are so many variables that its a generalisation when it comes down to it, because most every turbo motor and its accessories are configured differently..

Mase

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by trbob16a &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I think boost pressure does matter. The thermodynamics change as you increase boost pressure, which can be directly linked to detonation regardless of the power you're making.</TD></TR></TABLE>

hrmm i dont think you know what you're talking about...