hey guys.. new to this forum, not sure if this topic belongs in here or not, but i just registered and this is the only place i can post, so here it is... just bought my first civic, its a 98 hx, the car has a mozart muffler, CAI, MSD ign. and a short throw shifter, as fas as i know that is it performance wise. now my question is, i have a friend who will sell me a ZEX n20 wet system for my car for $350, this includes guages and all, the kit was only used a few times on a 200sx, i thought the price sounded real good, but my question is, is it safe to run a 55shot on my motor, ive heard good and bad things about nitrous, i just want your guys opinions.. i also plan on researching this a bit, but itd be nice to have a few opinions from the start.
also id like this car to last for awhile at least, so not planning on blowing anything up...

thanks

 

stock motor? swapped ,whatsup? I dont think a Dry shot will be too bad for you. In terms of pricing that doesn't sound too bad. You will probably get hassled about searching first but whatever. But ya, I dont think you will mess with anything

 

9 times out 10 its the user not the nitrous that blows the motor! Do your research and tune your car for it and you will be fine!

 

with that amount of nitro you should be fine, but to be on the safe side I would do something to get a little bit more fuel into the mixture. seems like you already have the spark

 

sorry, but can't you blow your motor if you miss a gear while spraying?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by gobblebox59 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">sorry, but can't you blow your motor if you miss a gear while spraying? </TD></TR></TABLE>

With a wet kit the danger of this happening is no greater than blowing your NA motor while missing a shift. Normally when you miss a shift you let off on the gas and don't blow your motor.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Biotech0123 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">with that amount of nitro you should be fine, but to be on the safe side I would do something to get a little bit more fuel into the mixture. seems like you already have the spark </TD></TR></TABLE>

Throwing more fuel in there will accomplish nothing since the stock kits settings are conservative anyway and it tends to run a little on the rich side normally.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by hybrid_vtec &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">9 times out 10 its the user not the nitrous that blows the motor! Do your research and tune your car for it and you will be fine!</TD></TR></TABLE>

EXACTLY...

To the original poster of this thread, you are getting a good deal on that kit for only $350 and you will be more than happy with it set at 55hp without any reliability problems (barring extreme stupidity). At that setting as long as you always run premium fuel you probably won't need to retard the timing from a stock setting unless you drive in warm weather or want to increase the nitrous shot. A -1 retard on ignition timing would be adequate if you need to due to warm weather and a -2 if you were to up the shot to like 65hp at the track.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 00Red_SiR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

EXACTLY...

To the original poster of this thread, you are getting a good deal on that kit for only $350 and you will be more than happy with it set at 55hp without any reliability problems (barring extreme stupidity). At that setting as long as you always run premium fuel you probably won't need to retard the timing from a stock setting unless you drive in warm weather or want to increase the nitrous shot. A -1 retard on ignition timing would be adequate if you need to due to warm weather and a -2 if you were to up the shot to like 65hp at the track. </TD></TR></TABLE>


some good info!

most N2O kits recommend 2 degrees retard for every 75hp worth of a shot(es.150shot = -4 degrees, 225shot = -6 degrees, etc.)! Hondas are different however for a 55 shot listen to 00Red_SiR, for a 65 shot = -2 degrees, 75shot = -4 degrees! Also having a better fuel pump and FPR is recommended and most ppl set there fuel pressure to 44-45 psi! AQnother thing too is to run colder plugs, I recommend the NGK BKR7E's and gap the plugs a little smaller than the factory .044"! Also do not spray in 1st or 5th gear and do not spray until 3500 rpm and your peak power will normally be made 600-800rpm before your normally shift point(ex. if you make peak power at 7600 rpm, on spray you more than likely make peak #'s at 6800-7000rpms now; Dyno tune to be sure and get best results)!

Another tip I may offer is most kits recommend to put the nozzle 6-15 inches from the TB! For a wet kit keep it in this range, however for a dry kit you can put the nozzle right behind the filter on a CAI and it will help draw in more air as well dispurse and mix a little better!


I hope this helps!

 

alright sounds pretty good, i should hopefully pick up the kit from my friend sometime next week, so do you guys recomend a bigger fuel pump/fpr or is it not necessarily needed? as far as i know my motor has all the stock internals as well as 116k on the clock.. but its honda miles mean nothing

also for you guys that do run nitrous.. how do you have it set up?? i.e. at what rpm range do you recomend having it come on, and do you guys just run it off wot and a toggle switch or toggle switch/button? what are my options? sorry for all the questions im new at this

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by notguilty411 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">alright sounds pretty good, i should hopefully pick up the kit from my friend sometime next week, so do you guys recomend a bigger fuel pump/fpr or is it not necessarily needed? as far as i know my motor has all the stock internals as well as 116k on the clock.. but its honda miles mean nothing

also for you guys that do run nitrous.. how do you have it set up?? i.e. at what rpm range do you recomend having it come on, and do you guys just run it off wot and a toggle switch or toggle switch/button? what are my options? sorry for all the questions im new at this </TD></TR></TABLE>


WOT activated!


read my post, it'll tell you basically all need to know!

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by hybrid_vtec &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

most N2O kits recommend 2 degrees retard for every 75hp worth of a shot(es.150shot = -4 degrees, 225shot = -6 degrees, etc.)! Hondas are different however for a 55 shot listen to 00Red_SiR, for a 65 shot = -2 degrees, 75shot = -4 degrees! Also having a better fuel pump and FPR is recommended and most ppl set there fuel pressure to 44-45 psi! AQnother thing too is to run colder plugs, I recommend the NGK BKR7E's and gap the plugs a little smaller than the factory .044"! Also do not spray in 1st or 5th gear and do not spray until 3500 rpm and your peak power will normally be made 600-800rpm before your normally shift point(ex. if you make peak power at 7600 rpm, on spray you more than likely make peak #'s at 6800-7000rpms now; Dyno tune to be sure and get best results)!

Another tip I may offer is most kits recommend to put the nozzle 6-15 inches from the TB! For a wet kit keep it in this range, however for a dry kit you can put the nozzle right behind the filter on a CAI and it will help draw in more air as well dispurse and mix a little better!


I hope this helps! </TD></TR></TABLE>

 

so what is the usual recommended fuel pump and regulator/ cheapest place to buy??? cheap is good

wot is what i figured most people do.. anybody else have anything different??

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by notguilty411 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">so what is the usual recommended fuel pump and regulator/ cheapest place to buy??? cheap is good

wot is what i figured most people do.. anybody else have anything different??</TD></TR></TABLE>

You do not need a bigger fuel pump or regulator to run nitrous. The kit you'll be buying is a wet kit and will supply the required fuel it needs by skimming what it needs from the fuel that would normally get diverted back to the tank so it places NO additional load on the stock fuel system. If you have an adjustable fuel pressure regulator keep it set at factory stock psi. the kit already will run slightly rich as a safety anyway so tweaking the pressure up will only make your car run rich, burn more fuel and LOSE power.

Your nitrous kit, like all street kits has a master arming (on/off) toggle switch that you will use to arm your system when ready to use it. The ZEX kit also has a TPS switch that hooks into your TPS wire to determine when WOT (wide open throttle) is reached, only then will the nitrous flow. You CAN use nitrous in ANY gear, but as a rule of thumb you don't want to engage it below 3500 rpm. If you do it's not the end of the world but it is harder on the engine like that and should be limited. In first gear below 3500 rpm you'd just get total wheel spin and no traction so it's pointless obviously which is another reason why 3500 + rpm is ideal.

Keep your stock plugs unless they are platinum, don't worry about your plug gaps unless you find the car "misses" a little under acceleration with nitrous in which case you'll want to close the gaps slightly on them and don't worry about using a colder plug because you aren't running enough of a shot to need any of this stuff. I run a 75hp shot and don't use any of it.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by notguilty411 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">so what is the usual recommended fuel pump and regulator/ cheapest place to buy??? cheap is good

wot is what i figured most people do.. anybody else have anything different??</TD></TR></TABLE>

Walboro 255lph is what I used to have! $79

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by hybrid_vtec &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Walboro 255lph is what I used to have! $79</TD></TR></TABLE>
He would be fine with a 190lph


No need to get it though....<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 00Red_SiR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

You do not need a bigger fuel pump or regulator to run nitrous. The kit you'll be buying is a wet kit and will supply the required fuel it needs by skimming what it needs from the fuel that would normally get diverted back to the tank so it places NO additional load on the stock fuel system. If you have an adjustable fuel pressure regulator keep it set at factory stock psi. the kit already will run slightly rich as a safety anyway so tweaking the pressure up will only make your car run rich, burn more fuel and LOSE power.

Your nitrous kit, like all street kits has a master arming (on/off) toggle switch that you will use to arm your system when ready to use it. The ZEX kit also has a TPS switch that hooks into your TPS wire to determine when WOT (wide open throttle) is reached, only then will the nitrous flow. You CAN use nitrous in ANY gear, but as a rule of thumb you don't want to engage it below 3500 rpm. If you do it's not the end of the world but it is harder on the engine like that and should be limited. In first gear below 3500 rpm you'd just get total wheel spin and no traction so it's pointless obviously which is another reason why 3500 + rpm is ideal.

Keep your stock plugs unless they are platinum, don't worry about your plug gaps unless you find the car "misses" a little under acceleration with nitrous in which case you'll want to close the gaps slightly on them and don't worry about using a colder plug because you aren't running enough of a shot to need any of this stuff. I run a 75hp shot and don't use any of it.</TD></TR></TABLE>

This is a great short write up to help anyone who is new.... well put my man.

 

WTF!


I ran N2O for years on one of my cars and the upgrades and tips I provided are what was recommended by the Nitrous manufactures and by those who ran nitrous on their cars and what I learned from my own experience!

The mods I listed are not required but are recommended, and I feel that it is best to exercise every precaution possible to run a sucessful setup! So choose the route you want! If running only a 50-55 shot dont worry too much about the mods I listed and go with what 00RED_SiR said; however if you start planning on 65, 75, or bigger then listen to what I have to say! I have ran nitrous on several different cars and never ran into any problems, other than 1 busted spark plug! The key to a succesful setup is to properly tune your motor!

Good luck!


And in case you overlooked my post, here it is again:

 

You should be cool.. I threw a zex dry kit with the 65 jets and I had no problems with it other than the smell of burning clutch but its all GOOOOOOD I had my fun Some how I didn't have the WOT activation.. I wired it so it would pull the power of a fuse that would have electricity when the car was on and ran that to a shift **** I had which had a button and that activated it.. It was pretty cool. If I knew I wasn't gonna get addicted I'd still have it..

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by hybrid_vtec &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
WTF!


I ran N2O for years on one of my cars and the upgrades and tips I provided are what was recommended by the Nitrous manufactures and by those who ran nitrous on their cars and what I learned from my own experience!

The mods I listed are not required but are recommended, and I feel that it is best to exercise every precaution possible to run a sucessful setup! So choose the route you want! If running only a 50-55 shot dont worry too much about the mods I listed and go with what 00RED_SiR said; however if you start planning on 65, 75, or bigger then listen to what I have to say! I have ran nitrous on several different cars and never ran into any problems, other than 1 busted spark plug! The key to a succesful setup is to properly tune your motor!

Good luck!
</TD></TR></TABLE>

LOL...don't sweat it hybrid_vtec, you weren't really that far off with what you said. Like you said your info came from nitrous manufacturers, other nitrous users and your own experience. Nitrous manufacturers "recommend" a lot of unnecessary stuff because they are ultra conservative and have to plan for the worst possible scenario in case the guy on the street tries something very stupid. Information from other nitrous users is both good and bad depending on their level of experience and knowledge. Unfortunately there is still more misinformation floating around out there than accurate info when it comes to nitrous use and your posts had some of both. Personal experience can give you limited insight into nitrous use because it is limited to usually only a couple vehicles.

In my case I use to own the largest performance shop in my city and we were known for our knowledge and nitrous installation and tuning abilities. All my knowledge comes from years of using it on my own cars, racing, customer cars, working directly with all the nitrous manufacturers and constant tuning of these systems on a new Dynojet 248C. All my knowledge is first hand information rather that stuff I picked up from guys at the track or that hang out at the local coffee shops. The answers I gave in my posts were directly related to what I have learned about these kits over the last 10 years. It's also why it may have varied a little from what you had previously heard because it's what's actually required rather than what's often recommended by manufacturers etc.

The best thing you said was to tune the system on a dyno! It's amazing how much more power you can pull from a nitrous system compared to factory settings and still be safe. By factory settings I mean by leaning out the fuel curve while on nitrous by altering the fuel jets and not retarding the timing as much, specifically. The only way to do this of course is on a dyno but also having a good understanding of what's still safe and what's considered to be a little on the risky side. TUNING IS EVERYTHING when it comes to setting up a car in any configuration for maximum performance and reliability.

 

yes it will be fine

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 00Red_SiR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

LOL...don't sweat it hybrid_vtec, you weren't really that far off with what you said. Like you said your info came from nitrous manufacturers, other nitrous users and your own experience. Nitrous manufacturers "recommend" a lot of unnecessary stuff because they are ultra conservative and have to plan for the worst possible scenario in case the guy on the street tries something very stupid. Information from other nitrous users is both good and bad depending on their level of experience and knowledge. Unfortunately there is still more misinformation floating around out there than accurate info when it comes to nitrous use and your posts had some of both. Personal experience can give you limited insight into nitrous use because it is limited to usually only a couple vehicles.

In my case I use to own the largest performance shop in my city and we were known for our knowledge and nitrous installation and tuning abilities. All my knowledge comes from years of using it on my own cars, racing, customer cars, working directly with all the nitrous manufacturers and constant tuning of these systems on a new Dynojet 248C. All my knowledge is first hand information rather that stuff I picked up from guys at the track or that hang out at the local coffee shops. The answers I gave in my posts were directly related to what I have learned about these kits over the last 10 years. It's also why it may have varied a little from what you had previously heard because it's what's actually required rather than what's often recommended by manufacturers etc.

The best thing you said was to tune the system on a dyno! It's amazing how much more power you can pull from a nitrous system compared to factory settings and still be safe. By factory settings I mean by leaning out the fuel curve while on nitrous by altering the fuel jets and not retarding the timing as much, specifically. The only way to do this of course is on a dyno but also having a good understanding of what's still safe and what's considered to be a little on the risky side. TUNING IS EVERYTHING when it comes to setting up a car in any configuration for maximum performance and reliability.</TD></TR></TABLE>




Thanks for clearing that up!

 

lots of good info here guys.. please keep it coming.. although i have one change.. i actually found out this is a dry kit.. stupid me, i just assumed it was wet until i was talking to my friend and he gave me all the info on what he had.. so taking that in.. does any of this info change at all.. are there any other precautions i would need to take with running a dry shot instead of wet.. still most likely wont run anything more then the 55 shot.. hence the car is my daily driver and i dont want to take too many risks...

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by notguilty411 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">lots of good info here guys.. please keep it coming.. although i have one change.. i actually found out this is a dry kit.. stupid me, i just assumed it was wet until i was talking to my friend and he gave me all the info on what he had.. so taking that in.. does any of this info change at all.. are there any other precautions i would need to take with running a dry shot instead of wet.. still most likely wont run anything more then the 55 shot.. hence the car is my daily driver and i dont want to take too many risks...</TD></TR></TABLE>

Dont pay $350 for it! Pay like $250 for it!

 

so your saying a dry kit will make it worth less money.. he is throwing in both guages with that price as well.. not sure if that would make it worth the extra 100 or not??? what do you guys think?

all i would be getting is the 10lb bottle half full all the necessary hardware to install with the exception of the feed line which he said he fried?? nitrous gage and fuel pressure i beleive?? the piller to mount the gauges.. although this was on a 200sx not sure if it would fit my civic or not and he said hed help install..

 

i have a zex kit on my jdm gsr motor.

i'm using a 60 shot and i did not upgrade the fuel pump or the fpr.

i do have a full msd ignition kit.

i set the timing back 4 degrees just to be on the safe side.

i also use a colder plug to be on the safe side also.

i don't use the kit much though. i've only used it 3 times and the times i did use it, i had no problems. i have kenji chipped ecu, thats what makes me not use it that much. i don't know how much his program advances timing.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by notguilty411 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">so your saying a dry kit will make it worth less money.. he is throwing in both guages with that price as well.. not sure if that would make it worth the extra 100 or not??? what do you guys think?

all i would be getting is the 10lb bottle half full all the necessary hardware to install with the exception of the feed line which he said he fried?? nitrous gage and fuel pressure i beleive?? the piller to mount the gauges.. although this was on a 200sx not sure if it would fit my civic or not and he said hed help install.. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Yes a dry kit cost less than a wet kit! I would seriously only pay $250 for it, But thats just me! You can try to talk him down to $300! Wish I knew you 2 monthes ago b/c I sold my wet kit w/ everything for $400!

 

ah ic.. yeah i wish i knew you two months ago also.. ill see what i can do to get it down to 300.. that i could handle.

now as far as fuel pump and pressure regulator.. where is the cheapest place to pick these up at??

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by notguilty411 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">ah ic.. yeah i wish i knew you two months ago also.. ill see what i can do to get it down to 300.. that i could handle.

now as far as fuel pump and pressure regulator.. where is the cheapest place to pick these up at??
</TD></TR></TABLE>

lightning motorsports Walboro Fuel pumps are $79-109

Just get a B&M FPR They are cheap! $35-55 Or you can spend more for an AEM, but I wouldnt buy one new they are around $150!