Incorrect Block Guard install>>?>>
03-15-2005, 05:06 PM
#1
Honda-Tech Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: IL
Posts: 1,753
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Incorrect Block Guard install>>?>>
Ok...i installed my block guard a few hours ago.
I was trying not to file too much off so it would fall down and defeat the purpose...and thinking back, i had to use somewhat of a force to get it in there.
now im scared that i warped/egg shaped my cylinder walls.
What are my options?
take it to shop to get it honed? will honing be enough?
how much is something like this going to cost?
i cant really think of any other options....****!
i dont want to put all my new parts together knowing that stupid block guard is in there...i probably would have been better off no using one.
Me for not letting someone else do it in the first place
What do you guys think?
I was trying not to file too much off so it would fall down and defeat the purpose...and thinking back, i had to use somewhat of a force to get it in there.
now im scared that i warped/egg shaped my cylinder walls.
What are my options?
take it to shop to get it honed? will honing be enough?
how much is something like this going to cost?
i cant really think of any other options....****!
i dont want to put all my new parts together knowing that stupid block guard is in there...i probably would have been better off no using one.
Me for not letting someone else do it in the first place
What do you guys think?
03-15-2005, 06:07 PM
#2
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: USA
Posts: 2,802
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Incorrect Block Guard install>>?>> (Die-Laughing)
take it out with a hanger. In order to warp and oval of the sleeves you have to have to motor running. The engine is a huge chunk of aluminum. If you cannot realize that metal doesn't move/warp that easily, YES please take it to someone else b/c you're going to break something for sure. 
03-15-2005, 06:16 PM
#4
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Chicagoland, usa
Posts: 5,695
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Incorrect Block Guard install>>?>> (dustin)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by dustin »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">block guards are poo</TD></TR></TABLE>
I think they used to be. But guard designs like the GE one help me have faith in them. Much cleaner design, more oriented upon coolant flow.. etc...
I think they used to be. But guard designs like the GE one help me have faith in them. Much cleaner design, more oriented upon coolant flow.. etc...
03-15-2005, 07:55 PM
#5
Honda-Tech Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: IL
Posts: 1,753
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Incorrect Block Guard install>>?>> (splitime)
yeah..i got the golden eagle one.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by racinskittle »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">take it out with a hanger. In order to warp and oval of the sleeves you have to have to motor running. The engine is a huge chunk of aluminum. If you cannot realize that metal doesn't move/warp that easily, YES please take it to someone else b/c you're going to break something for sure. </TD></TR></TABLE>
i dont think a hanger is going to cut it.
ok..now that i think about it, it makes sense that the motor has to be running in order for the warpage to occur although..it does seem possible for damage to occur while the motor is cold. maybe im wrong? maybe i could get away with taking the block guard back out and taking it somewhere to get it installed or just leave it out?
what do you guys think about that?
possible to remove block guard and everythings back to normal?
possible to distort/warp cylinder walls while engine is cold?
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by racinskittle »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">take it out with a hanger. In order to warp and oval of the sleeves you have to have to motor running. The engine is a huge chunk of aluminum. If you cannot realize that metal doesn't move/warp that easily, YES please take it to someone else b/c you're going to break something for sure. </TD></TR></TABLE>
i dont think a hanger is going to cut it.
ok..now that i think about it, it makes sense that the motor has to be running in order for the warpage to occur although..it does seem possible for damage to occur while the motor is cold. maybe im wrong? maybe i could get away with taking the block guard back out and taking it somewhere to get it installed or just leave it out?
what do you guys think about that?
possible to remove block guard and everythings back to normal?
possible to distort/warp cylinder walls while engine is cold?
03-15-2005, 08:21 PM
#6
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Brownsville, tx, 78520
Posts: 680
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Just leave it in, have someone work with it as is and if need be let them hone it. Let a professional take care of it. Its not worth u losing your motor.
03-15-2005, 09:25 PM
#7
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: USA
Posts: 2,802
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Incorrect Block Guard install>>?>> (Die-Laughing)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Die-Laughing »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">yeah..i got the golden eagle one.
i dont think a hanger is going to cut it.
ok..now that i think about it, it makes sense that the motor has to be running in order for the warpage to occur although..it does seem possible for damage to occur while the motor is cold. maybe im wrong? maybe i could get away with taking the block guard back out and taking it somewhere to get it installed or just leave it out?
what do you guys think about that?
possible to remove block guard and everythings back to normal?
possible to distort/warp cylinder walls while engine is cold?
</TD></TR></TABLE>
lol you're joking right?....... doing drugs wasn't part of the instructions....maybe you should lay off of them while installing this piece.
You'd be warping the sleeves and there's NO WAY you're going to do that while the engine is apart. YES everything can go back to normal. If you dont think a hanger will work then come up with something....they can come back out.
i dont think a hanger is going to cut it.
ok..now that i think about it, it makes sense that the motor has to be running in order for the warpage to occur although..it does seem possible for damage to occur while the motor is cold. maybe im wrong? maybe i could get away with taking the block guard back out and taking it somewhere to get it installed or just leave it out?
what do you guys think about that?
possible to remove block guard and everythings back to normal?
possible to distort/warp cylinder walls while engine is cold?
</TD></TR></TABLE>lol you're joking right?....... doing drugs wasn't part of the instructions....maybe you should lay off of them while installing this piece.
You'd be warping the sleeves and there's NO WAY you're going to do that while the engine is apart. YES everything can go back to normal. If you dont think a hanger will work then come up with something....they can come back out.
Trending Topics
03-15-2005, 10:17 PM
#8
Honda-Tech Member
Re: Incorrect Block Guard install>>?>> (Die-Laughing)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Die-Laughing »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">What are my options?
take it to shop to get it honed? will honing be enough?
how much is something like this going to cost?
i cant really think of any other options....****!</TD></TR></TABLE>
Honing won't change the OD of the sleeve and help with the install. I don't think using a little force to install the blockguard is bad. I used a rubber mallet to tap mine in. It should naturally set a little below the deck surface when your done.
take it to shop to get it honed? will honing be enough?
how much is something like this going to cost?
i cant really think of any other options....****!</TD></TR></TABLE>
Honing won't change the OD of the sleeve and help with the install. I don't think using a little force to install the blockguard is bad. I used a rubber mallet to tap mine in. It should naturally set a little below the deck surface when your done.
03-16-2005, 12:01 AM
#9
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 3,094
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
You dont drop in block guards. Take your block to a machine shop and have them weld the guard to the block in four spots about 5/16" below the deck. Then have them hone your cylinder walls and then deck the block to get a flush finish.
(look at cylinders #1 and #4 and you can see the welds)
Block guards work great when installed right.
Race eng. makes a great block guard; IMO better then GE.
(look at cylinders #1 and #4 and you can see the welds)
Block guards work great when installed right.
Race eng. makes a great block guard; IMO better then GE.
03-16-2005, 01:16 AM
#10
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Toronto, ON, Canada
Posts: 2,859
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Incorrect Block Guard install>>?>> (racinskittle)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by racinskittle »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">take it out with a hanger. In order to warp and oval of the sleeves you have to have to motor running. The engine is a huge chunk of aluminum. If you cannot realize that metal doesn't move/warp that easily, YES please take it to someone else b/c you're going to break something for sure. </TD></TR></TABLE>
I've seen enough times that the cylinders become oval after lightly tapping in the blockguard. It can happen with a cold motor. I have seen it probably 3-4 times which guys have to rehone the cylinders back to specs when the blockguard wasn't installed perfectly.
</TD></TR></TABLE>I've seen enough times that the cylinders become oval after lightly tapping in the blockguard. It can happen with a cold motor. I have seen it probably 3-4 times which guys have to rehone the cylinders back to specs when the blockguard wasn't installed perfectly.
03-16-2005, 08:38 AM
#11
Honda-Tech Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: IL
Posts: 1,753
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Incorrect Block Guard install>>?>> (Tony the Tiger)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Tony the Tiger »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I've seen enough times that the cylinders become oval after lightly tapping in the blockguard. It can happen with a cold motor. .</TD></TR></TABLE>
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by racinskittle »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
there's NO WAY you're going to do that while the engine is apart. YES everything can go back to normal.</TD></TR></TABLE>
who doesnt know what they are talking about besides me?
I've seen enough times that the cylinders become oval after lightly tapping in the blockguard. It can happen with a cold motor. .</TD></TR></TABLE>
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by racinskittle »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
there's NO WAY you're going to do that while the engine is apart. YES everything can go back to normal.</TD></TR></TABLE>
who doesnt know what they are talking about besides me?
03-16-2005, 09:02 AM
#12
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: NYC bitchessss
Posts: 9,555
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Incorrect Block Guard install>>?>> (splitime)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by splitime »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I think they used to be. But guard designs like the GE one help me have faith in them. Much cleaner design, more oriented upon coolant flow.. etc...</TD></TR></TABLE>
But what's the point? maybe they help the cylinder from moving up top, but people think they make the cylinders stronger and prevent them from cracking. . . wrong, if there is too much pressure, the sleeve will crack with or without the blockgaurd in there.
Stock sleeves with no blockguard
I think they used to be. But guard designs like the GE one help me have faith in them. Much cleaner design, more oriented upon coolant flow.. etc...</TD></TR></TABLE>
But what's the point? maybe they help the cylinder from moving up top, but people think they make the cylinders stronger and prevent them from cracking. . . wrong, if there is too much pressure, the sleeve will crack with or without the blockgaurd in there.
Stock sleeves with no blockguard
03-16-2005, 09:31 AM
#13
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Milwaukee, WI
Posts: 4,887
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Incorrect Block Guard install>>?>> (m R g S r)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by m R g S r »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
But what's the point? maybe they help the cylinder from moving up top, but people think they make the cylinders stronger and prevent them from cracking. . . wrong, if there is too much pressure, the sleeve will crack with or without the blockgaurd in there.
Stock sleeves with no blockguard </TD></TR></TABLE>
I'd be more concerned about the heat transfer where the blockguard contacts the top portion of the cylinders. Considering that is where the combustion takes place, I'd rather keep it clear so the coolant can do it's job. With a properly torqued set of ARP headstuds, the cylinders shouldn't rock at all, which is really what a blockguard is meant to prevent. The sleeves will crack due to detonation.
BTW, I've removed blockguards by screwing bolts into a few of the coolant passages and slowly tapping it off.
But what's the point? maybe they help the cylinder from moving up top, but people think they make the cylinders stronger and prevent them from cracking. . . wrong, if there is too much pressure, the sleeve will crack with or without the blockgaurd in there.
Stock sleeves with no blockguard
</TD></TR></TABLE>I'd be more concerned about the heat transfer where the blockguard contacts the top portion of the cylinders. Considering that is where the combustion takes place, I'd rather keep it clear so the coolant can do it's job. With a properly torqued set of ARP headstuds, the cylinders shouldn't rock at all, which is really what a blockguard is meant to prevent. The sleeves will crack due to detonation.
BTW, I've removed blockguards by screwing bolts into a few of the coolant passages and slowly tapping it off.
03-16-2005, 10:14 AM
#14
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Portland, Oregon
Posts: 5,735
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Incorrect Block Guard install>>?>> (m R g S r)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by m R g S r »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">. . wrong, if there is too much pressure, the sleeve will crack with or without the blockgaurd in there.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Can someone post pics of an engine with a blockguard correctly installed and a cracked sleeve?
I've heard that blockguards don't help many times but I've never seen first hand an engine that had a blockguard installed and cracked a sleeve...
I'm not saying it doesn't happen, just that I've never seen pics of it and everyone always talks about how pointless blockguards are...
I wanna see some pics!
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Can someone post pics of an engine with a blockguard correctly installed and a cracked sleeve?
I've heard that blockguards don't help many times but I've never seen first hand an engine that had a blockguard installed and cracked a sleeve...
I'm not saying it doesn't happen, just that I've never seen pics of it and everyone always talks about how pointless blockguards are...
I wanna see some pics!
03-17-2005, 11:04 AM
#16
Honda-Tech Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: IL
Posts: 1,753
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re:
I'm still undecided...
I dont know if i should remove it and hope nothing happened to my cylinder walls considering the engine was never hot, or leave it in like it is and hope nothing happens to my cylinder walls when it does get hot.
im not too worried about it because i do have another car and i would like to have the block sleeved in the future.
do you guys have any idea on how unreliable an incorrect block guard install will make my block? time wise?
what exactly will it do to my engine if failure occurs, because i want to sleeve the block anyways...but will anything else be affected when failue occurs?
I dont know if i should remove it and hope nothing happened to my cylinder walls considering the engine was never hot, or leave it in like it is and hope nothing happens to my cylinder walls when it does get hot.
im not too worried about it because i do have another car and i would like to have the block sleeved in the future.
do you guys have any idea on how unreliable an incorrect block guard install will make my block? time wise?
what exactly will it do to my engine if failure occurs, because i want to sleeve the block anyways...but will anything else be affected when failue occurs?
03-17-2005, 11:23 AM
#18
Junior Member
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: TX, USA
Posts: 492
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Incorrect Block Guard install>>?>> (racinskittle)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by racinskittle »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
lol you're joking right?....... doing drugs wasn't part of the instructions....maybe you should lay off of them while installing this piece.
You'd be warping the sleeves and there's NO WAY you're going to do that while the engine is apart. YES everything can go back to normal. If you dont think a hanger will work then come up with something....they can come back out.</TD></TR></TABLE>
They CAN be warped while the engine is apart. Don't give advice if you don't know what the hell you're talking about.
lol you're joking right?....... doing drugs wasn't part of the instructions....maybe you should lay off of them while installing this piece.
You'd be warping the sleeves and there's NO WAY you're going to do that while the engine is apart. YES everything can go back to normal. If you dont think a hanger will work then come up with something....they can come back out.</TD></TR></TABLE>
They CAN be warped while the engine is apart. Don't give advice if you don't know what the hell you're talking about.
03-17-2005, 04:40 PM
#19
Honda-Tech Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: IL
Posts: 1,753
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Incorrect Block Guard install
aww **** it..
im gonna leave it in there and expect failure...i have another car to drive.
and i plan on sleeving the block in the future.
off to torque my arp headstuds now
ill let you know what happens in the future.
im gonna leave it in there and expect failure...i have another car to drive.
and i plan on sleeving the block in the future.
off to torque my arp headstuds now
ill let you know what happens in the future.
03-17-2005, 05:01 PM
#21
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Nutley, NJ
Posts: 1,699
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Incorrect Block Guard install>>?>> (Tony the Tiger)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Tony the Tiger »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I've seen enough times that the cylinders become oval after lightly tapping in the blockguard. It can happen with a cold motor. I have seen it probably 3-4 times which guys have to rehone the cylinders back to specs when the blockguard wasn't installed perfectly.</TD></TR></TABLE>
And what type of honing process is this?
And what type of honing process is this?
03-17-2005, 05:15 PM
#22
Honda-Tech Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: IL
Posts: 1,753
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Incorrect Block Guard install
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by eg cookiemonster »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">just curious, how would you know if the walls are warped after u ran the car?</TD></TR></TABLE>
if failure occurs rapidly or the set-up doesnt last all that long even with a good tune?
im not sure exactly.
ill let everyone know what happens when i run it for a while.
if failure occurs rapidly or the set-up doesnt last all that long even with a good tune?
im not sure exactly.
ill let everyone know what happens when i run it for a while.
03-17-2005, 05:52 PM
#23
Member
Re: Incorrect Block Guard install>>?>> (Stewie)
If the blockguard is putting an extreme amount of pressure on one point in the cylinder wall, it can deform("warp", "egg") after a heat cycle or two.
Having the cylinder walls deformed a significant amount will affect ring seal.
Having the cylinder walls deformed a significant amount will affect ring seal.
03-17-2005, 07:13 PM
#24
O.G. triple O.G.
Re: Incorrect Block Guard install>>?>> (Die-Laughing)
Blockguards are alright...if you want to boost around 7-9psi. It surely didn't help me any when I was in 4th gear and @ 19psi....Say "bye bye" to #2 cylinder wall!!
03-17-2005, 08:15 PM
#25
Junior Member
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: san jose, ca, US
Posts: 240
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Incorrect Block Guard install>>?>> (NVturbo)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by NVturbo »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Blockguards are alright...if you want to boost around 7-9psi. It surely didn't help me any when I was in 4th gear and @ 19psi....Say "bye bye" to #2 cylinder wall!!</TD></TR></TABLE>
7 or 9 psi?.....you can do that with out a block guard
4th gear 19psi and a bad tune= priceless
lets think about this a bit..why would your engine blow on fourth gear and not other gears? maybe because your engine is exposed to a BAD tune longer?....An engine built for 300..400.500hp should handle what ever psi it takes to make that hp if its tuned right. Engines will almost always last for the first 3 gears on slightly bad tune but 4th gear pull will own you. Take a factory Evo or Wrx Sti and smash on it on 4th or even 5th gear they will not blow and they don't have aftermarket sleeves
7 or 9 psi?.....you can do that with out a block guard
4th gear 19psi and a bad tune= priceless
lets think about this a bit..why would your engine blow on fourth gear and not other gears? maybe because your engine is exposed to a BAD tune longer?....An engine built for 300..400.500hp should handle what ever psi it takes to make that hp if its tuned right. Engines will almost always last for the first 3 gears on slightly bad tune but 4th gear pull will own you.
Take a factory Evo or Wrx Sti and smash on it on 4th or even 5th gear they will not blow and they don't have aftermarket sleeves