<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Dturbocivic &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">since you seem to bee on his nuts perhaps you can get him to chime in </TD></TR></TABLE>

his are quite adequate for my astute taste....but, he's on limited internet access/time lately..but, i'm sure he'll chime in on his on...if not, i'll make him post from here

 

oh come on its better than my idea?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SOHC_MShue &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">oh come on its better than my idea? </TD></TR></TABLE>

J.davis = electronics.

 

small amp...headphones....
not sure where he took the idea from or who gave him the idea, but he's talked to me about it but i'm FAR too lazy to ever do soemthing the "right" way

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by boosted94cx &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">pm J.Davis and ask him about his audibale knock detector idea....it's a FUCKTON better than this mess </TD></TR></TABLE>


Tell me more

 

happen to have a pic of the 'headphone' setup?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by boosted94cx &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">small amp...headphones....
not sure where he took the idea from or who gave him the idea, but he's talked to me about it but i'm FAR too lazy to ever do soemthing the "right" way</TD></TR></TABLE>

that's what the engine ear posted above is, but it has multiple channels so you can switch between different spots on the car/engine.

There are lots of variations to this too. One of our sponsored drivers has an STi with the TXS tuner pro, which has a Bosch KS and headphones that plug into a multifunction box mounted in the dash.

 

oh snap...a production unit! any idea on the price of that?

 

for the DIY guys, I think the setup SOHC_Mshue as listed was VERY nice.

He has already been able to put it to use, wich went beyond "pulling plugs" and VERY pratical VS. electronic devices.

I say and lets put this bad boy on my car

 

Psttt everyone loooky!

http://www.imagestation.com/pi...d.jpg

 

Is that your setup MidShip? I'd be interested in seeing that thing work too.

 

What is that exactly?

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by MidShipCivic &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Psttt everyone loooky!

http://www.imagestation.com/pi...d.jpg

</TD></TR></TABLE>

 

Modified radio shack hearing aid.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by MidShipCivic &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Modified radio shack hearing aid.</TD></TR></TABLE> Can you elaborate, please.. Looks pretty simple would you mind sharing how it works/ how you made it.

SOHC_MShue, have you tested this with any luck? Very interesting..

 

yes It works wonderful

 

Ok now, someone make a write up of how to and were to buy everything to put one of these suckers together. Whats the Radio Shack part number for the hearing aid??





They both seem promising.

 

mine is pretty basic. You just need some thick hard rubber hose about 3/8" diameter, about a 3/8" metal pipe a few inches long, and some way to attach the hose to the tube. You just crush the end of the tube flat so its air tight and bolt it to the block. Then you get some ear protectors, t the hose off and run the hoses into holes drilled in the ear protectors.

 

Huh, that looks interesting. Never having used one, I can't say how well it would work, but I don't see any reason why it shouldn't work well. Frankly, this design should sidestep certain KS design limitations, but don't go quoting me until a couple people have tried it both ways and we have a consensus, eh?


FYI, I like to listen to the KS myself, I don't let a machine do it for me.

bigmoose would be a good guy to show this thread to... he'd have a snappy comment or two worth hearing!

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by J. Davis &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Huh, that looks interesting. Never having used one, I can't say how well it would work, but I don't see any reason why it shouldn't work well. Frankly, this design should sidestep certain KS design limitations, but don't go quoting me until a couple people have tried it both ways and we have a consensus, eh?


FYI, I like to listen to the KS myself, I don't let a machine do it for me.

bigmoose would be a good guy to show this thread to... he'd have a snappy comment or two worth hearing!</TD></TR></TABLE>

'' Sounds like rice hitting aluinum foil ''

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by J. Davis &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Huh, that looks interesting. Never having used one, I can't say how well it would work, but I don't see any reason why it shouldn't work well. Frankly, this design should sidestep certain KS design limitations, but don't go quoting me until a couple people have tried it both ways and we have a consensus, eh?


FYI, I like to listen to the KS myself, I don't let a machine do it for me.

bigmoose would be a good guy to show this thread to... he'd have a snappy comment or two worth hearing!</TD></TR></TABLE>
I got the idea from some of the guys over at the EFI101 forum and they say its been tested against other much more expensive knock detectors and this simple design has seemed to always work the best. I agree i'd rather be able to listen myself too. That way you can distinguish between what is and what is not knock.

 

very interesting concept...after taking the efi101 courses, this device or method (w/e) looks like youll have a VERY good idea of what timing the motor wants/needs aside from running on a dynapack (or other steady state dyno). my question is the knock plain as day to hear/decifer or is there lots of ambient noises typical from a motor running?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ...Lost &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">very interesting concept...after taking the efi101 courses, this device or method (w/e) looks like youll have a VERY good idea of what timing the motor wants/needs aside from running on a dynapack (or other steady state dyno). my question is the knock plain as day to hear/decifer or is there lots of ambient noises typical from a motor running?</TD></TR></TABLE>
The knock is pretty easy to hear. There is ambient noise, but if you know what knock sounds like then you can detect it. I'm pretty sure if I found a good spot to bolt it in the back of the block then I'd have an even better sound.

What kinds of methods do they teach for detecting knock in efi101? I'd like to attend that coarse if they ever have it somewhere close to where I live.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by boosted94cx &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">oh snap...a production unit! any idea on the price of that?</TD></TR></TABLE>

its designed to work with the UTEC and does liek 3 oter things...so its about a million US dollars.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SOHC_MShue &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I agree i'd rather be able to listen myself too. That way you can distinguish between what is and what is not knock.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I've bitched about the inefficiency of using DSP to allow electronics do a half-assed job the human ear does easily. Joe/falcongsr has a nice comment and tech link in re the human ear/brian being capable of massively parallel signal processing on a level it requires some large technological mojo equal.

I've been using a Bosch KS (convenient fuel injector clip connection) run down some mini-coax that terminates into an RCA plug. I run it through a RadioSlack 9v powered audio amp to a set of earbuds. I'm not wholly happy with it, as it still picks up some RF noise from the ignition system, but it is a functional tool that works. My problems with it are both due to the nature of the tool as well as my construction:

1) KS are attuned to certain frequencies, freq at which your engine may or may not resonate during detonation. You can still pick up the detonation by ear, it is just not as pronounced as the background noise.

2) I think my ignition noise problem is cheap mini-coax... for a 0-1v milli-milli-milli-amp signal generated by the KS being vibrated, I am sure it is being molested by my not using low-loss coax, coax similar to what is used in good wifi antennas. Fleeman Anderson & Bird (fab-corp.com) has the stuffs. Compared to the *thick* ground shield found on the Saab KS line I stole this Bosch KS from, I am sure I am using some wholly inadequate ****.

Still, for $20 spent I am happy with it.


I'd be curious as to getting a good audio rip of these det-can's output. With KS you can run audio rips through a spectrum analyser and end up with graphical representations of the audio. While it's hard to attune simple electronics to pick up on what you are looking for, doing this renders a ppicture that the human eye can pick det signatures from, even when the audio is muddy muddy muddy. Keep in mind I've not done this, but I have the site describing it bookmarked on my desktop. Poke at me in a day or two if I or someone else hasn't posted it, and I'll dig for it.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SOHC_MShue &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
What kinds of methods do they teach for detecting knock in efi101? I'd like to attend that coarse if they ever have it somewhere close to where I live. </TD></TR></TABLE>

for the basic 101 class, simple dyno-power feedback stuff, nothing terribly sophisticated. They do mention some methods of listening for detonation... I believe HKS has had an "engine ear" type thing on the market for some time, and the KS to audio amp to headphones rigjob was discussed... I think I mentioned mine, but I believe Strader brought it up first.

There's a LOT more that could be covered, but given the timeframe of the EFI classes it's unreasonable to expect. What you pay for in the EFI classes is to hit the high points, network with ppl, and the instructors are going to hate me for saying this but pulling them aside before/after class and grilling them for everything you are worth.

Dave Blundell is a very very very good person to spend a day with, as well.