B16A Turbo build
09-23-2014, 11:57 AM
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B16A Turbo build
Going Turbo......NA is pointless on a 1.6 where I live.....In the middle of aquiring the parts to build but need some help figuring out some of the more Technical aspects of what I can expect from my setup.
(some of these parts I already have others are coming soon)
P28 (chipped+live data) going to run Crome
Moates Ostrich 2.0+Hulog(purchased)
00' ITR Cams(purchased)
SuperTech* hi lift/boost turbo rated dual valve springs+Ti retainers
CP 9:1 CR 81.5mm (purchased)
Eagle Rods
FIC 775CC injectors(purchased)
400LPH walbro pump(too much?)
ARP Head studs(purchased)
Gates Racing/kevlar timing belt
AEM wideband
Friend Donated IC+piping(rated for 400HP) 44mm waste gate+BOV
Will be running full 3'' exhaust.
So thats the basic mechanical setup I've planned out but need help identifying what Turbo is going to best suit my build and goals as well as CR I should expect.
From my calculations I should expect 9.1+:1 with 3 layer style gasket and .020 Head milling. or 8.7-8 with no milling. are these numbers correct?
I'm aiming for having this tuned in 2-3 specs
1. low boost daily driver..around 12-14psi should deliver around 320-60HP/230+Tq
2. Hi boost for "Fun" around 16-19 psi 440+HP/265+Tq.
3. E85 tune...dont know what to expect with that but figure it would be smart if Temps get too high on pump gas.
As for Fuel I have mostly E10 91 octane but E85 is available too.....Race fuel would be considered for extra "fun" tune.
I don't want to tune it so it has 500 over 250 rpm just before redline Id much rather have 450+ usuable HP over as wide a rpm range as possible with as much torque that I can get.
As for Turbo I'm considering 3 different models at this time but need help figuring out which one and what housing setup would be best for overall response/spool time with the ability to achieve higher output when wanted.
Garrett T-3/60-1: w .63 or.82 AR? Cheapest of the bunch.
Garrett GT3071R BB: dont know what AR I should look for since the results I've seen the can be expected based off its comp map would be good spool time but limited past 450HP.
Garrett GT3076R/GT3037 BB: should be quicker spooling the 60-1 but slower the GT3071 but has higher HP potential.
The price difference between the GT3071R and 3076R is negligible but the t3/60-1 is the cheapest and probably the worst performing regarding spool speed. I prefer to save money but for an exceptionally performing turbo that fits that 300-500HP range that is cheaper I would take a serious look. Above all else this is a daily driver and will normally be run well under the breaking point of any major componets...I think
Anyways thanks for any solid help.
(some of these parts I already have others are coming soon)
P28 (chipped+live data) going to run Crome
Moates Ostrich 2.0+Hulog(purchased)
00' ITR Cams(purchased)
SuperTech* hi lift/boost turbo rated dual valve springs+Ti retainers
CP 9:1 CR 81.5mm (purchased)
Eagle Rods
FIC 775CC injectors(purchased)
400LPH walbro pump(too much?)
ARP Head studs(purchased)
Gates Racing/kevlar timing belt
AEM wideband
Friend Donated IC+piping(rated for 400HP) 44mm waste gate+BOV
Will be running full 3'' exhaust.
So thats the basic mechanical setup I've planned out but need help identifying what Turbo is going to best suit my build and goals as well as CR I should expect.
From my calculations I should expect 9.1+:1 with 3 layer style gasket and .020 Head milling. or 8.7-8 with no milling. are these numbers correct?
I'm aiming for having this tuned in 2-3 specs
1. low boost daily driver..around 12-14psi should deliver around 320-60HP/230+Tq
2. Hi boost for "Fun" around 16-19 psi 440+HP/265+Tq.
3. E85 tune...dont know what to expect with that but figure it would be smart if Temps get too high on pump gas.
As for Fuel I have mostly E10 91 octane but E85 is available too.....Race fuel would be considered for extra "fun" tune.
I don't want to tune it so it has 500 over 250 rpm just before redline Id much rather have 450+ usuable HP over as wide a rpm range as possible with as much torque that I can get.
As for Turbo I'm considering 3 different models at this time but need help figuring out which one and what housing setup would be best for overall response/spool time with the ability to achieve higher output when wanted.
Garrett T-3/60-1: w .63 or.82 AR? Cheapest of the bunch.
Garrett GT3071R BB: dont know what AR I should look for since the results I've seen the can be expected based off its comp map would be good spool time but limited past 450HP.
Garrett GT3076R/GT3037 BB: should be quicker spooling the 60-1 but slower the GT3071 but has higher HP potential.
The price difference between the GT3071R and 3076R is negligible but the t3/60-1 is the cheapest and probably the worst performing regarding spool speed. I prefer to save money but for an exceptionally performing turbo that fits that 300-500HP range that is cheaper I would take a serious look. Above all else this is a daily driver and will normally be run well under the breaking point of any major componets...I think
Anyways thanks for any solid help.
Last edited by NubR1; 09-23-2014 at 03:02 PM.
09-23-2014, 12:58 PM
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Re: B16A Turbo build
this has been covered countless of times.
BUT seeing that your post is decently written and organized... it makes helping a little easier. = )
BUT seeing that your post is decently written and organized... it makes helping a little easier. = )
Going Turbo......NA is pointless on a 1.6 where I live.....In the middle of aquiring the parts to build but need some help figuring out some of the more Technical aspects of what I can expect from my setup.
(some of these parts I already have others are coming soon)
P28 (chipped+live data) going to run Crome
Moates Ostrich 2.0+Hulog(purchased) ...don't need it
00' ITR Cams(purchased) ...very nice...
ST hi lift/boost turbo rated dual valve springs+Ti retainers .... what is ST? I would look into getting rocket motorsports SL dual valve springs. They are snapfit design to work with stock seats & retainers. Make sure to inspect your keepers and install new ones if needed.
CP 9:1 CR 81.5mm (purchased) .... 1.6 with 9.1-8.7cr will feel pretty un inspiring out of boost. Even with 91octane you'll can easily go with 10.1cr with a decent tuner.
Eagle Rods
FIC 775CC injectors(purchased) ...... sell them, too small for e85 use even up to 400whp. if your goal is 300-500whp with e85 you'll need at least 1000cc injectors. I have the FIC 1050cc injectors and at 520whp e85 maxing out injectors.
400LPH walbro pump(too much?).... nope that's prefect size. make sure you buy a relay kit so that you can get direct 12v power from battery. Old stock wiring isn't going to be enough to fully power the aftermarket pump.
ARP Head studs(purchased)
Gates Racing/kevlar timing belt .... I always reccomend stock. Gates are nice, but i've seen a few people over tension them (not knowing) and destroying the belt prematurely
AEM wideband
Friend Donated IC+piping(rated for 400HP) 44mm waste gate+BOV.... as long as it's 2.5" you'll be fine. make sure the end of the pipes have a bead roll.
Look into CNCwerx cylinder support system if you have the extra cash.
Will be running full 3'' exhaust.
So thats the basic mechanical setup I've planned out but need help identifying what Turbo is going to best suit my build and goals as well as CR I should expect.
From my calculations I should expect 9.1+:1 with 3 layer style gasket and .020 Head milling. or 8.7-8 with no milling. are these numbers correct?
I'm aiming for having this tuned in 2-3 specs
1. low boost daily driver..around 12-14psi should deliver around 320-60HP/230+Tq
2. Hi boost for "Fun" around 16-19 psi 440+HP/265+Tq.
3. E85 tune...dont know what to expect with that but figure it would be smart if Temps get too high on pump gas.
As for Fuel I have mostly E10 91 octane but E85 is available too.....Race fuel would be considered for extra "fun" tune.
having 3 tunes is nice but it's a lot of additional expense.
Realitically, you only need 2 tunes. a full tune on 91octane & a tune on e85.
You can have 2 boost settings of low & high on 91octane. The tuner should provide you more details as to boost resolution/scaling so the engine doesn't get too pissy under various boost.
As for Turbo I'm considering 3 different models at this time but need help figuring out which one and what housing setup would be best for overall response/spool time with the ability to achieve higher output when wanted.
Garrett T-3/60-1: w .63 or.82 AR? Cheapest of the bunch.
When picking a turbo, there's more too it then just price. I would go with smaller turbo with that smaller displacment motor.
Garrett GT3071R BB: dont know what AR I should look for since the results I've seen the can be expected based off its comp map would be good spool time but limited past 450HP.
Garrett GT3076R/GT3037 BB: should be quicker spooling the 60-1 but slower the GT3071 but has higher HP potential.
The price difference between the GT3071R and 3076R is negligible but the t3/60-1 is the cheapest and probably the worst performing regarding spool speed. I prefer to save money but for an exceptionally performing turbo that fits that 300-500HP range that is cheaper I would take a serious look.
realistically will need to spend upward of $1,000 for a nice turbo which can provide decent powerband and not run out of breath before reaching your 500whp goal.
You don't "have to" go with bb turbo as there are some newer JB turbos out there which can get the job done with similar characteristics. PM TheShodan for more info
Anyways thanks for any solid help.
(some of these parts I already have others are coming soon)
P28 (chipped+live data) going to run Crome
Moates Ostrich 2.0+Hulog(purchased) ...don't need it
00' ITR Cams(purchased) ...very nice...
ST hi lift/boost turbo rated dual valve springs+Ti retainers .... what is ST? I would look into getting rocket motorsports SL dual valve springs. They are snapfit design to work with stock seats & retainers. Make sure to inspect your keepers and install new ones if needed.
CP 9:1 CR 81.5mm (purchased) .... 1.6 with 9.1-8.7cr will feel pretty un inspiring out of boost. Even with 91octane you'll can easily go with 10.1cr with a decent tuner.
Eagle Rods
FIC 775CC injectors(purchased) ...... sell them, too small for e85 use even up to 400whp. if your goal is 300-500whp with e85 you'll need at least 1000cc injectors. I have the FIC 1050cc injectors and at 520whp e85 maxing out injectors.
400LPH walbro pump(too much?).... nope that's prefect size. make sure you buy a relay kit so that you can get direct 12v power from battery. Old stock wiring isn't going to be enough to fully power the aftermarket pump.
ARP Head studs(purchased)
Gates Racing/kevlar timing belt .... I always reccomend stock. Gates are nice, but i've seen a few people over tension them (not knowing) and destroying the belt prematurely
AEM wideband
Friend Donated IC+piping(rated for 400HP) 44mm waste gate+BOV.... as long as it's 2.5" you'll be fine. make sure the end of the pipes have a bead roll.
Look into CNCwerx cylinder support system if you have the extra cash.
Will be running full 3'' exhaust.
So thats the basic mechanical setup I've planned out but need help identifying what Turbo is going to best suit my build and goals as well as CR I should expect.
From my calculations I should expect 9.1+:1 with 3 layer style gasket and .020 Head milling. or 8.7-8 with no milling. are these numbers correct?
I'm aiming for having this tuned in 2-3 specs
1. low boost daily driver..around 12-14psi should deliver around 320-60HP/230+Tq
2. Hi boost for "Fun" around 16-19 psi 440+HP/265+Tq.
3. E85 tune...dont know what to expect with that but figure it would be smart if Temps get too high on pump gas.
As for Fuel I have mostly E10 91 octane but E85 is available too.....Race fuel would be considered for extra "fun" tune.
having 3 tunes is nice but it's a lot of additional expense.
Realitically, you only need 2 tunes. a full tune on 91octane & a tune on e85.
You can have 2 boost settings of low & high on 91octane. The tuner should provide you more details as to boost resolution/scaling so the engine doesn't get too pissy under various boost.
As for Turbo I'm considering 3 different models at this time but need help figuring out which one and what housing setup would be best for overall response/spool time with the ability to achieve higher output when wanted.
Garrett T-3/60-1: w .63 or.82 AR? Cheapest of the bunch.
When picking a turbo, there's more too it then just price. I would go with smaller turbo with that smaller displacment motor.
Garrett GT3071R BB: dont know what AR I should look for since the results I've seen the can be expected based off its comp map would be good spool time but limited past 450HP.
Garrett GT3076R/GT3037 BB: should be quicker spooling the 60-1 but slower the GT3071 but has higher HP potential.
The price difference between the GT3071R and 3076R is negligible but the t3/60-1 is the cheapest and probably the worst performing regarding spool speed. I prefer to save money but for an exceptionally performing turbo that fits that 300-500HP range that is cheaper I would take a serious look.
realistically will need to spend upward of $1,000 for a nice turbo which can provide decent powerband and not run out of breath before reaching your 500whp goal.
You don't "have to" go with bb turbo as there are some newer JB turbos out there which can get the job done with similar characteristics. PM TheShodan for more info
Anyways thanks for any solid help.
09-23-2014, 01:16 PM
#3
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Re: B16A Turbo build
Hah well thanks I guess lol. I tried being as thorough reading through thee forums for as much info as possible but seems no one really addresses exactly what CR should be expected or is actually at with their setups. An then I've seen a bunch on .AR stuff but was hoping someone like Shodan could chime in on what will give good response an spool speed without bottle necking In a higher boost tune since most compression maps available list the turbo's .ar in a diff spec then my planned use.
09-23-2014, 01:53 PM
#4
Honda-Tech Member
Re: B16A Turbo build
Check the Hunter turbo from Shodan. 50-51 lbs/min with journal bearing. Will be responsive and near 1000 dollars. Comes in .63 ar and is garrett based. Pm Shodan, he Is very helpful.
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