notoriousB

Hi all,

My freshly built motor will not start when the motor is cold when using my AEM EMS.

Setup:
F23A1
8.5:1 CP pistons/crower billet rods
AEM EMS 30-1010 w/ GM 3 bar MAP
RC 750 cc injectors
techedge 2A0 wideband

Once I get it to start (via pop-start or rediculously violent persistance) it runs and runs well.

The weirdest part: If allowed to warm up fully the car will start up again right away. No problem at all.

I used this EMS on the previous (blown) motor and never had a starting problem. It sat out in the car for about 6 months unused while I got the motor together.

I was told my cam/crank sensor is not reading right during start conditions and to try a different distributor:

I've tried three different distributors with the same exact result - no start.

I've torn the engine down to the timing belt & inspected the crank sensors. Found no problem at all.

Changed back to the stock ECU, MAP, and stock injectors and the car will start up immediately every time, cold or warm, doesn't matter. No CELs on the stock ECU.

Swapped the AEM box back into the car w/ the stock injectors & MAP, uploaded a basemap for my car in stock form, and wham: no-start condition.

Swapped the stock ECU right back in and it started right up - no CELs.

Can someone please push, kick, or drag me in the right direction? I have no clue what to do next. Thanks!

-B

(I tried to post this on the AEM forum, but it's down??)

alpha

Looks like AEM is working on their forum software. Can you post a cal and a datalog?

Jared

did you re zero your timing with the new engine?

Tooned

Could there maybe be a issue in your Crank time table or the warm up enrichment tables. i know I had a hard time starting my car when warm so I took some fuel outta the crank time table.

timg

Is the start sync coming on while you're cranking when cold?

Tim

mstolars

Definetly try lowering your crank injector time table, I've had to lower mine from 80 to around mid 50s for a better cold/warm startup. Just make sure to try it hot/cold startup when you change it a lot to make sure it still starts ok in both conditions.

JDogg

shoot me an email w/a log and you cal... i had a 99 accord doing the same thing here. took a little time but i got it straight, might be able to do the same thing to yours..

ninesecteg

try adding fuel around 10% at a time to your warm up enrichment unitil it idles. you afr's should be on the rich side(12.5ish) and rpm in the 1300-1500rpm. follow the temp and add fuel when its starts to idle rough. for example, I have an evo and i'm running about 80% enrichment right at cold start tapering. I/m me with any other questions.

notoriousB

I can't post it here (no host) but I'm happy to email it to anyone who's willing to help.

What parameters would you all like to see logged?

Regarding the cal - I can send my current cal, but the car won't start with a basemap either running all stock components, so I'm starting to feel like it's not the calibration, but maybe something w/ the wiring?? I don't know... <sobs softly> LOL

The F23 dizzy is not adjustable - I synched the timing w/ the motor using a timing light and it's right on. Even checked the cam timing vs the crank pulley twice and it's right on also.

I've added and subtracted fuel from the crank time table to no avail.

yes I'm pretty sure it is. I will double check that tho because I didn't look at that parameter last night. (I've been bashing my head off this for literally months now)

What would you like me to log? I'll definitely do that, I actually got Jae's cal from him and pasted in his timing settings for the interim until I get this thing tuned because the old settings were too high. I have not tried running his cal directly yet tho, maybe I'll give that a shot tonight too (assuming that's who you're referring to).

I'll try that as well but shouldn't the basemap cal be OK for start w/ stock components? Once started (on my tuned cal) it idles fine. Once warmed up fully it will start over and over again. I haven't been persistant enough to get it to start with the basemap & stock injectors, basically just tried that to see if it was cal related. (sanity check after the car started perfect first try with stock ECU & injectors)

Thank all for the input, keep it coming!!

JDogg

idle position, idle learned, o2, rpm, engine load, engine speed, coolant temp, air temp

and your calibration

notoriousB

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JDogg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">idle position, idle learned, o2, rpm, engine load, engine speed, coolant temp, air temp </TD></TR></TABLE>
during a no-start condition or running? I can't guarantee that I can get it to start at all.

right now I still have the 240c stock injectors installed - supposed to rain tonight so won't be changing injectors, but I'll try to get these values w/ the stock injectors & accord basemap, is that worthwhile?

JDogg

yeah, that will be fine even if it dosnt start...

add cam-crank, fuel tooth and stat sync to that list above

notoriousB

done, you've got email on your gmail account J. thanks for any help. let me know if you need another log and I'll get it to you.

start sync *does* come ON almost right after I start cranking the motor over.

forgot to mention this I think: the car seems to want to start when I let go of the key. It will crank and crank but nothing at all happens, when I let go of the key it "shudders" like it wanted to start but I let go too soon?!?

Flr Power

I feel your pain. I am curently pushing 18 psi on that thing. Send me your cal.