AaronJ

Hey everyone, i am just about ready to purchase my turbo kit. It will be going on a stock b16, shooting for about 250-270 hp, and then it will be getting forged internals and then i am shooting for about 350hp. I was going to go with the .63ar T3/To4e 57 trim turbo, but then my mind started wandering thinking that maybe i should use the .48 ar to get a little quicker spool and more fun on the street.

Any opinions that people have about spool times, powerbands, and max power that can be pushed on these 2. TIA

RyanEJ8

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by AaronJ &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Hey everyone, i am just about ready to purchase my turbo kit. It will be going on a stock b16, shooting for about 250-270 hp, and then it will be getting forged internals and then i am shooting for about 350hp. I was going to go with the .63ar T3/To4e 57 trim turbo, but then my mind started wandering thinking that maybe i should use the .48 ar to get a little quicker spool and more fun on the street.

Any opinions that people have about spool times, powerbands, and max power that can be pushed on these 2. TIA</TD></TR></TABLE>

There are some people who have made 400+whp on the .48A/R so for only 250-270hp you might want to just go with the .48.

JDMs1eeper

-turbobygarrett.com

Turbine A/R - Turbine performance is greatly affected by changing the A/R of the housing, as it is used to adjust the flow capacity of the turbine. Using a smaller A/R will increase the exhaust gas velocity into the turbine wheel. This provides increased turbine power at lower engine speeds, resulting in a quicker boost rise. However, a small A/R also causes the flow to enter the wheel more tangentially, which reduces the ultimate flow capacity of the turbine wheel. This will tend to increase exhaust backpressure and hence reduce the engine's ability to "breathe" effectively at high RPM, adversely affecting peak engine power.

Conversely, using a larger A/R will lower exhaust gas velocity, and delay boost rise. The flow in a larger A/R housing enters the wheel in a more radial fashion, increasing the wheel's effective flow capacity, resulting in lower backpressure and better power at higher engine speeds.

When deciding between A/R options, be realistic with the intended vehicle use and use the A/R to bias the performance toward the desired powerband characteristic.

Here's a simplistic look at comparing turbine housing geometry with different applications. By comparing different turbine housing A/R, it is often possible to determine the intended use of the system.

Imagine two 3.5L engines both using GT30R turbochargers. The only difference between the two engines is a different turbine housing A/R; otherwise the two engines are identical:
1. Engine #1 has turbine housing with an A/R of 0.63
2. Engine #2 has a turbine housing with an A/R of 1.06.

What can we infer about the intended use and the turbocharger matching for each engine?

Engine#1: This engine is using a smaller A/R turbine housing (0.63) thus biased more towards low-end torque and optimal boost response. Many would describe this as being more "fun" to drive on the street, as normal daily driving habits tend to favor transient response. However, at higher engine speeds, this smaller A/R housing will result in high backpressure, which can result in a loss of top end power. This type of engine performance is desirable for street applications where the low speed boost response and transient conditions are more important than top end power.

Engine #2: This engine is using a larger A/R turbine housing (1.06) and is biased towards peak horsepower, while sacrificing transient response and torque at very low engine speeds. The larger A/R turbine housing will continue to minimize backpressure at high rpm, to the benefit of engine peak power. On the other hand, this will also raise the engine speed at which the turbo can provide boost, increasing time to boost. The performance of Engine #2 is more desirable for racing applications than Engine #1 where the engine will be operating at high engine speeds most of the time.

AaronJ

thanks for the post jdms1eeper, now what type of spool time with a log mani can i expect with a .48 ar? how about the powerband? I have heard that the .48 will choke up at around 7000 rpm

yee SERIOUS

iTrader: (1)

for 250-270, go with a .48a/r cause it'll be more fun. for more than 300hp, i think you'll want the .63 a/r

i had the .48 a/r on my gsr first. great for quick spool. i had to replace the turbo cause of some issues and so i got a .63 a/r. it's a big difference on my butt dyno. i think the .63 can put more whp.

92cxturbo

I ran a .57 trim .63A/R turbo on my stock b16 and it was great. It reached 10psi by 4500 and pulled hard till rev limit. IMO a .48 a/r is a little to small.

StylishDOHC

I have a .48a/r 50trim t3/to4e on my stock b16 and love it....no falloff in power as long as your not going too far past the stock rev limit..I get 10 lbs. by 3300-3500 and it pulls hard from there on out.perfect street turbo IMO.

Mugencrxsir1

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 92cxturbo &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I ran a .57 trim .63A/R turbo on my stock b16 and it was great. It reached 10psi by 4500 and pulled hard till rev limit. IMO a .48 a/r is a little to small. </TD></TR></TABLE>

I agree, the .57trim/.63 A/R is perfect for you application. The .48 A/R in my mind is for D-series motors, and are really fun on small applications.

92cxturbo

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by StylishDOHC &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I have a .48a/r 50trim t3/to4e on my stock b16 and love it....no falloff in power as long as your not going too far past the stock rev limit..I get 10 lbs. by 3300-3500 and it pulls hard from there on out.perfect street turbo IMO.</TD></TR></TABLE>
How much power did you make @ 10psi.

StylishDOHC

241/188....but I have a cometic .074 hg (lowers c/r to 9.2:1) and i'm running a Spoon N1 cat back, 2.38" piping, so that's part of the reason why my numbers are a little lower in addition to running the .48 housing.

Basically the only way I would upgrade to the .63 is if

A; I wanted to rev past 8k rpm
B; I changed to a 1.8L bottom end
C; If I wanted more than 300whp.

edit...just read the OP again and saw that 350whp is the eventual goal....63 A/R would probably be the better choice in this case.

EG civic

.48 A/R is a little small for for vtec head. (if u have one). I definently suggest the .63. It will give you more into the 300whp range, and will keep boost until redline.

_entropy

A .48 housing isn't going to fall off before redline, SBR made 640 WHP on a .48 A/R GT35R, even though it took a good amount of boost to do it you're going to be able to make 350 WHP no problems on a .48 housing. I vote start off smaller to begin with, and upgrade to a .63 if you don't meet your goals. The car will be more fun to drive on the street with the .48.

JDMs1eeper

Ive had both, for your goals I recommend .63a/r completely.

yeah w/ a lot of boost a .48 will make power but so will a DSM turbo or Saab T3 (.48ar) lol they are around the same turbine ar and turbine ar has a lot to do w/ what kinda power you'll be makeing. If your gonna spend your money on a turbo do it right the first time so you wont have to upgrade in 2 months when you deside you want more then 250.

for a street car and your goal, .63 is where its at.

methos713

good info

InfamousDC2FI

personally i think the .63 is better to have as a daily driver because when your just cruzing from 1500-4000 rpms shifting between gears your not building boost as quick as the .48.

vtec.dc2

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by InfamousDC2FI &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">personally i think the .63 is better to have as a daily driver because when your just cruzing from 1500-4000 rpms shifting between gears your not building boost as quick as the .48. </TD></TR></TABLE>

for daily driver.. your car will respond quicker with .48 a/r.. i have T04b 50 trim .48 a/r stage 2 ~267whp 207wtq.. max torque at 4500rpm is a lot of fun for everyday driving, you don't want to sit there and wait.. theres nothing wrong with hitting boost all day long.. but i can't say its great for top end.. i can only speak from experience

Runnerdown

go with the 63. we just did this on my buddys b16 and the powerband is really nice.

AaronJ

thanks for the info guys, i'm just gonna go with the .63ar...i really don't want to have to push 20 psi out of it to get 350

yee SERIOUS

iTrader: (1)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by _entropy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">A .48 housing isn't going to fall off before redline, SBR made 640 WHP on a .48 A/R GT35R, even though it took a good amount of boost to do it you're going to be able to make 350 WHP no problems on a .48 housing. I vote start off smaller to begin with, and upgrade to a .63 if you don't meet your goals. The car will be more fun to drive on the street with the .48.</TD></TR></TABLE>

i don't know if i'd compare a .48a/r gt35r to a regular garrett t3/to4e .48a/r. lol


a garrett t3/to4e .48a/r is maxed out at 440whp @ 20psi. you'll be fine with either turbo i think. i just recommend the .63 like what if you're going with the .48a/r is great for street usage though.

RyanEJ8

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by undercoverdc2 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">a garrett t3/to4e .48a/r is maxed out at 440whp @ 20psi. </TD></TR></TABLE>

How did you come up with this number?

yee SERIOUS

iTrader: (1)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RyanCivic2000 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

How did you come up with this number?</TD></TR></TABLE>

secret https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1645686

i just asked TheShodan cause my friend is running the same turbo.

boostincoupe

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by undercoverdc2 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

i don't know if i'd compare a .48a/r gt35r to a regular garrett t3/to4e .48a/r. lol


a garrett t3/to4e .48a/r is maxed out at 440whp @ 20psi. you'll be fine with either turbo i think. i just recommend the .63 like what if you're going with the .48a/r is great for street usage though.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Yeah but that's a 57-trim. Let's see some 50-trims.

JDMs1eeper

.63 &gt; .48