knowing what a k can do, you are going to need to bring them in somehow or give other motors a way to catch up.

Personally, I would like to see them allow ITB's on the b-series and keep weights the same, that might level things out quite a bit. I also wouldn't have a problem with dropping the displacement limit as well.

How about this for a crazy rule change, make the cars do a 15 minute drive on Saturday. That will keep the class more honest then anything else. They do this in other series that run true street classes and it keep those guys really honest in what they build.

 

Well I guess my C4 set up is all wrong then
And I am sure they don't have to change anything from race to race.

I think they need to limit the Ks alittle more.
It may make more sense to help the B as the K will be able to over come what ever you do to it.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by CDR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Personally, I would like to see them allow ITB's on the b-series and keep weights the same, that might level things out quite a bit.</TD></TR></TABLE>

hahaha i cant belive you just said that...earlier in the year when i ran ITBS i wanted nothing more then to have NHRA allow them...everyone and theyre mother including you thought it was the dumbest idea and its not affordable to run itbs and tru street cars dont run them and now you think its a good idea to have them?to be honest i spent more on my full race manifold,skunk2 TB and custom intake with v-stack then i did on my ITBS

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by CDR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
How about this for a crazy rule change, make the cars do a 15 minute drive on Saturday. That will keep the class more honest then anything else. They do this in other series that run true street classes and it keep those guys really honest in what they build.</TD></TR></TABLE>

i think is would not be a good rule either..not sayin that i would have a problem with it but i mean cmon how many of us racers that run the sportsman classes constantly actually drive their car on the street...i used to al the time but once i started competing the way i am i put that to a stop

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by CDR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

How about this for a crazy rule change, make the cars do a 15 minute drive on Saturday. That will keep the class more honest then anything else. They do this in other series that run true street classes and it keep those guys really honest in what they build.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Chris is your car street driven, taged ?
They do this at other big events like you said and it does help but not all the cars running have tags on them. That would just be something else to add to the cost of the class for the people who race in it.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by AllMoToRB18c &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

hahaha i cant belive you just said that...earlier in the year when i ran ITBS i wanted nothing more then to have NHRA allow them...everyone and theyre mother including you thought it was the dumbest idea and its not affordable to run itbs and tru street cars dont run them and now you think its a good idea to have them?

i think is would not be a good rule either..not sayin that i would have a problem with it but i mean cmon how many of us racers that run the sportsman classes constantly actually drive their car on the street...i used to al the time but once i started competing the way i am i put that to a stop</TD></TR></TABLE>

You have to find a way to allow b-series to make anything close to a half well built k-series. I hate the idea but I don't think there is much more you can do to a b-series to even get it close to a k-series.

I am not saying drive it on the street or even that it is a good idea, it is just something to toss out there. I can tell you that this year I wouldn't have been able to it with how many band-aids where on some of the motors I ran.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by jdmoutlaw &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Chris is your car street driven, taged ?
They do this at other big events like you said and it does help but not all the cars running have tags on them. That would just be something else to add to the cost of the class for the people who race in it.</TD></TR></TABLE>

yes it is, it just doesn't have up-to-date registration. If you read the rules, the car has to run a license plate which implys that it had to have been an actual street car at one time and not a salvage or anything else. Mine was purchased brand new from an Acura dealer in April of 2003 and actually still carrys a loan and full insurance on it. I treat it like any one of my other cars, I just choose to only race it. I could put a stock motor in it tomorrow and go to the store, shopping, etc.

 

my car is registered and ins. up to date and everything for the reason of the rules they have stating that it has to be...i just dont rock the plate due to thieves in my area ...you cant really make tht many rule changes to the K cuz there s so much R&D to be done still that they will find a way to make power around the rules regardless

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by CDR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">. I could put a stock motor in it tomorrow and go to the store, shopping, etc.</TD></TR></TABLE>

While you out there shopping can you buy me a K24 TSX long block

Allowing ITB's on Bseries motors will help just a tad. Some of us have noticed under personal experiance it is best to run an Intake manifold. More consistant. But what worked for me might not work for others.

 

I think Street Stock needs more marketing and media coverage. It is a heads up class just like SFWD but somehow the internet media coverage in the class is thin with maybe a pic of Chris's Blue RSX (bad *** paint job in person ) and of Loan's EK.

We need some of the magazine and online magazine guys to get more coverage and spotlight/interview of the racers of this class.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by vivid 02 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

While you out there shopping can you buy me a K24 TSX long block

</TD></TR></TABLE>

i need one too to go along with my rsx 6 speed tranny...

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by CDR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

How about this for a crazy rule change, make the cars do a 15 minute drive on Saturday. That will keep the class more honest then anything else. They do this in other series that run true street classes and it keep those guys really honest in what they build.</TD></TR></TABLE>

a true street car....i wouldnt mind seeing that....keep the race cars out and give the average joe the ability to compete.

 

Even though I don't race in it SS is my favorite class by far. Watching all motor street cars that could have driven in, aired down, and rip off 11 sec passes is insane. I think the drag radial/full interior component is what makes the class so interesting.

In order to attract new/other racers I think the class should be slowed down/kept at the low 12/high 11 sec range. The reason I feel this way is two fold. One depending on the weights this is a reasonable perfomance goal withough having to make a ton of power. All it takes is reasonable power and good driving and you could be competitive. Two keeping the class above the 11.49 cut-off would keep racers from having to put a cage.bar in their street car. I think we all agree a bar takes away from the "streetability" of a car. Only one car has run fast enough to need a bar this year but as racing goes I am sure cars will only get faster next year. As others have said there are a number of different platforms that could be competitive if the class stays in the low 12's given the right chance.

I also think that the minimum weights should be arranged more to meet these performance goals rather than an arbitrary penalty placed on a car based on number of cylinders or displacement alone. I don't understand why in sfwd a 6cyl only has to weigh 2500lbs but in SS it has to weigh 2650? There aren't many fwd 6cyl cars that can make enough power to be competitive at 2650 - and if they did the torque would be so high that hooking up on drag radials would be tough. At the same time its hard to get the newer cars light enough to meet the minumum. Maybve a weight penalty for a motor newer than the chassis of the car? Maybe turning the class into a hybrid index type class where there is a lower E.T. limit you can't run under without a penalty?

I would also say allow itbs - I know rule was originally to keep costs/performance down but many people have found that a full intake manifold can make more power and in some cases cost more than itbs. Why should someone with itbs be kept from running just based on some perceived cost/perfomance savings that aren't really there? Granted the number of people staying away from the class because of this rule is probably limited but still. As far as I see it rules that are meant to keep racers from spending money in reality usually cost the racer more. Strict rules limit innovation and force racers to spend more time/money ssearching for smaller gains in more limited areas. Racers being racers they will always look for an edge over the other guy no matter the cost or how small of an edge.

Having said all this if you look at other tire limited classes in drag racing (10.5, drag radial Mustang, F.A.S.T., etc.) they have some of the most restrictive rules but also some of the most competetive fields.

 

That's all I ever hear from Honda owners is weight, weight, weight.

Why is weight such an issue?

Let's be honest, you bought a CX, VX or CRX because you already knew you were on a limited budget but wanted to run all motor. Its alot easier when your car only weighs 1800lbs soaking wet.

I don't want to buy a Honda. Why should I be forced into buying one? You weren't forced into buying your car.

1st gen Neons come in around 2325lbs with no driver, full interior, a/c and ps all operational.

Under the rulebook, I can get weight down to about 2200lbs. I weigh 190lbs. I can maybe loose weight myself and get my weight down to 175lbs - Race Weight: 2375

Lighter than Chris' car and about 50lbs heavier than Loan's.

It would be alot harder for newer cars to get down to that weight. However, the Toyota Yaris Hatchback is right around 2300lbs. I know the 2.0L DOHC motor should fit with some modified mounts and such...

Listen -

All of compact drag racing is experiencing a growth problem. That's because 80% of the Honda pilots can't look at it from another angle. They refuse. I say, get together, start your own series, nobody would bother you.

After all NASA already has Honda Challenge, why not throw the NHRA in that hat too?

With no weight limit, where is it going to stop? Until somebody shows up with a all carbon fiber car?

Then you'll cry "foul" because you can't afford a $6,000 rebody of your Civic.

SSK is fine the way it is.

I would like to see the class grow and get some competition from other makes. That makes it more interesting, the playing field is leveled as the rules stand.

I have no illusions of getting a Neon down to 2,000lbs, it won't happen and be under the rulebook, and franky I don't need it to be that light, I can make the power to be competitive, I aint worried about it.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by dj4monie &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> I would like to see the class grow and get some competition from other makes. That makes it more interesting, the playing field is leveled as the rules stand. </TD></TR></TABLE>

so then stop talkin about it and build something other then a honda and come race in the class...i love how ppl who dont race in the class think they know whats best for it...and the reason ppl buy crx,vx and cx civics is because you know we do race at other places other then NHRA...places that have lower weight limit and some no limit at all...im not gonna buy a 3000lbs car just to make it fair for NHRA when i run NDRA,BOTI,IDRC and all my local events at etown like Honda Day,Summer Slam and the 3 or 4 Import Survival Series that has no weight limit...yea i would like to see other makes in the SS class but dont penalize the hondas that are light from the factory...every car that runs the class is a civic except for Chris Dye..so you wanna add weight to the cars that make the class interesting to watch just so its fair for a neon or some toyota to run?

 

I dont race the class, but I see this argument going round in circles....i think you need to make it where its a certain year cut off for cars. since the older civics are lighter, then they need to run another class. EK and up for street stock and if you have to add weight, then so be it. I think if you are going to race, you need to step it up with a newer chassis because thats were the sponsor dollars are going to be at. Thats why most people have left the honda camp. If im a sponsor would I want to sponsor a car not in production? or a 06 Civic Si or RSX? I think a RSX/Civic Si because they are newer cars.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by f@sth@tch89 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I dont race the class, but I see this argument going round in circles....i think you need to make it where its a certain year cut off for cars. since the older civics are lighter, then they need to run another class. EK and up for street stock and if you have to add weight, then so be it. I think if you are going to race, you need to step it up with a newer chassis because thats were the sponsor dollars are going to be at. Thats why most people have left the honda camp. If im a sponsor would I want to sponsor a car not in production? or a 06 Civic Si or RSX? I think a RSX/Civic Si because they are newer cars.</TD></TR></TABLE>

if Loan was in a EG chassis would you have still said EK and up or would you have said EG and up?....and why would you make the cutoff at EK..theyre not in production anymore?..oh thats right cuz the class champion is in a EK so you cant exclude her...majority of the class runs the EG chassis...how can you make the class record holder and the 2nd,3rd and 4th place in points racers change their chassis...i tell you one thing if they did do that i can guarantee you that you wont see me back in the street stock class and im sure others will follow

 

I think NHRA should try to do whatever it takes to make Street Stock into a high-11 second to mid-12 second class.. It is very discouraging for average joes like myself to compete it these events with FULLY BUILT RACE MOTORS being put in a streetable chassis...

Many people argue about racing in general, how its too hard to compete against big dollar sponsorship teams... Well, this does seem to apply to Street Stock very well...

Racing is just a hobby for me and I dont like to spend loads of cash on my car and definately dont expect to make a living out of racing... I dont want to, and can't afford to be building a new motor each year to keep up with the big dollar sponsorship teams.. I want to make due with what I have, a B-series motor...

Just seeing how fast the class is getting discourages me and I am sure many people who have competed in the class may feel the same way.. The appeal of the class is fading away for us B-motor owners... Something has to be done to level the playing field so the little guys can run competetively in this class..

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by E-Town4229 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">it would be good to see some variety in the class. bring the car out and see how it does. if there is a huge disparity bring it up to nhra and maybe something can be done.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

Damn straight. Still I'm 4 valves down on a K series and I have to be heavier, that's almost comical.

I think some weight breaks on the 6cyl cars will bring a few VW's over that haven't been racing much lately. Don't worry they're all low 13sec cars at best, nothing to worry about

Heck even the quickest 6cyl VW that's prepped like a Comp car only goes 12.00s and that's with a 3.2L and 2300lbs. Toss on DRs, knock off .2L and 350lbs and it's a 12.70 car at best. Competitive but not a class winner by far. That car has about 70whp on me too, so don't worry about me either!

 

Allow slicks and turbos!

 

I personally like how the class is set up. It is very differentiated from Pro All Motor. I don't want to see cars that are a half second from the pro cars. Adding slicks might be ok, and giving a little weight break to the B series cars, but other than that I think the class is great.

 

just use cc to lb's
1.0 lb to one cc
1.1 to one cc k's ?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ALLMOTOR18 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I think NHRA should try to do whatever it takes to make Street Stock into a high-11 second to mid-12 second class</TD></TR></TABLE>

thats wat the class is now and has been all season..except for when Brian Fisher came out for one race at fallnationals and did mid 11's...but all season its been Loan in th high 11's and everyone else in the 12's

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by fast is fun &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> just use cc to lb's
1.0 lb to one cc
1.1 to one cc k's ?</TD></TR></TABLE>

The problem that I see is that is over working an already unstaffed tech department.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by CDR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Right now Street Stock, for Honda's is a k-series or go home, and that is not fair.

I know that when I won a bunch of events last season it wasn't that much fun and I would bet the Loan would say the same thing. Winning is great but most of us race because we are competitive and want to beat people in a close race, not in a walk.

We need to make the b-series, the Fords, the Mazdas, the Dodges all able to compete on the same level. That is going to take some creative rules but I think that it can happen, it is just going to take people racing in the class to give the NHRA a baseline for the rules.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I totally agree with you...

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by AllMoToRB18c &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

thats wat the class is now and has been all season..except for when Brian Fisher came out for one race at fallnationals and did mid 11's...but all season its been Loan in th high 11's and everyone else in the 12's</TD></TR></TABLE>

Brian Fisher has run low 11s and Loan is capable of doing so too... You can see it in their trap speeds.. The rest of the competitors are running 5-10mph slower with B-series motors...

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by CDR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

yes it is, it just doesn't have up-to-date registration. If you read the rules, the car has to run a license plate which implys that it had to have been an actual street car at one time and not a salvage or anything else. Mine was purchased brand new from an Acura dealer in April of 2003 and actually still carrys a loan and full insurance on it. I treat it like any one of my other cars, I just choose to only race it. I could put a stock motor in it tomorrow and go to the store, shopping, etc.</TD></TR></TABLE>

last time i checked ss required valid registration and tags, anyone can keep an old tag and throw it on their race car. might want to update yours

its real simple, most guys hate drs because they tear **** up, its a fact. not very many people want to spend $$ and time to change their existing setup for slicks that is allowed in all other sanctions as well as several other unsanctioned events to properly setup the car for radials. basically giving most racers the dilema of either tearing up driveline parts and costing $$ or not racing in nhra street stock

if nhra would like to see more racers run ss, they should allow slicks to make it easier to transition from one sanction to the other. i think its safe to say that most racers want to race as many events as possible and this would make it a hell of alot easier.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Missing Gears &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

last time i checked ss required valid registration and tags, anyone can keep an old tag and throw it on their race car. might want to update yours

</TD></TR></TABLE>

valid is much different from current. valid means that it was a registered car at one time, not that it is current. I am not trying to split hairs but my car has been picked over more then just about any other sportsmans car if there was something illegal about the car it would have been found by now.