donut.

what do you guys recommend? so far im thinking on going with itr valves but which aftermarket valves would be better suited for this setup? Ive been looking into retainers but honestly dont know what to look for when choosing. Ive heard of some people using a certain retainer and their valve seals get crushed. anyway, i want to opt for the best bang for the buck and do this once without any problems while getting some good numbers

Lubo_25

if you really think about it for a second...there is no such thing as which to use just find out the specs of the springs before hand according to your cams lift blah blah its all chrome silicone steel wire...and that certain retainer would be a stock one they are typically deeper than aftermarket titanium ones which have a .030 reduction for that much needed seal clearance...my .02 cents

DonF

Toda. They probably know the correct rates for their cams.

donut.

my cams have a 12mm lift

bks84

iTrader: (9)

I myself am going with SuperTech valves, springs and retainers. I might switch out the retainers for stock. Im not sure what Lubo_25 meant by his statement saying aftermarket retainers were .030" shallower, hopefully he will clearify for us.

Good luck donut.

EDIT ---

Just came across some specs.

The Toda Spec B has 12mm of lift. If Im understanding this correctly you want to haev a spring that is capable of operating at a lift rate greater than what your cam produces.

Toda Valve Springs
Variable or Linear: Variable
Seat Pressure: ???
Max Lift: 12.5mm
Coil Bind: 12.9mm
Pressure @ 12.5mm/.492" lift: 190lbs

Supertech B-Series Valve Springs PN SPR-H1002D-KIT
Variable or Linear: Linear
Seat Pressure:
Max Lift: 12.5mm
Coil Bind 19.5mm
Pressure @ 12mm/.472" lift: 190lbs

Supertech B-Series Valve Springs PN SPR-H100DR-KIT
Variable or Linear: Linear
Seat Pressure: ???
Max Lift: 14mm
Coil Bind ???
Pressure @ 14mm/.551" lift: 266lbs

I'm not the sharpest tool in the shed, but it appears the 2D kit would be plenty, as well as Toda's kit, but Toda's will be very expensive.

I hope this helped you out, it actually solidified my decision!

Lubo_25

sorry what i meant to say was if you compare the thickness of a stock retainer to a supertech retainer you will notice a different height for instance take a digi caliper and measure the top to bottom thicknessess of each and look at the differences in the machining of a supertech for instance it has a reduced overall height of approx. .030" or so...this is what allows that little extra for those big cams...no one likes crunched valve seals especially if you just bought a nice set of those blue viton seals

bks84

iTrader: (9)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Lubo_25 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">sorry what i meant to say was if you compare the thickness of a stock retainer to a supertech retainer you will notice a different height for instance take a digi caliper and measure the top to bottom thicknessess of each and look at the differences in the machining of a supertech for instance it has a reduced overall height of approx. .030" or so...this is what allows that little extra for those big cams...no one likes crunched valve seals especially if you just bought a nice set of those blue viton seals </TD></TR></TABLE>

So its better to run the aftermarket ones or stock?

Lubo_25

it all depends on what cams youre using you have to calculate your spring coil bind, spring pressures, spring seat thickness, and cam lift blah blah...if youre gonna run lets say a skunk2 pro2 cam the stock retainers are history...the spring seat thickness is about .190" on all dohc vtec heads i believe id have to double check it...id run aftermarket retainers with aftermarket cams you almost have no choice if youre pushing close to .500" of lift...

bks84

iTrader: (9)

Im planning on using all supertech valve train as well as toda b's... oem spring seats... good or bad?

Lubo_25

almost every kit supertech has has a max lift of 13.5mm...im not sure on the toda spec b cams what are their specs? i need to know their lift specs for int. and exh.

Lubo_25

once we know those and your spring install height you can start calculating from there for clearances...

bks84

iTrader: (9)

I thought I had posted it earlier in this thread, guess not.

http://www.allmotorhonda.com/t...s.htm

Toda Spec B's
Intake
Lift - 12mm
Duration - 255 @ 1mm

Exhaust
Lift - 12 mm
Duration - 245 @ 1mm

Old Renegade

omni power are good snap fit design with their spring and retainer. also the spingd can support up to 13.5 mm of lift and has a bind in excess of 14mm.

Lubo_25

the supertech valvetrain will work nicely youre way under the coil bind limits my springs bind @ 14mm...toda spring material is the same spec as supertech just the brand name difference...the supertech retainers are your choice titanium or 4340 whichever you choose both will have that underside machined for extra clearance to avoid any seal damage...those cams should pull nicely with your valvetrain i see a possible 25-30bhp difference just make sure you calculate your spring, install height, guide heights, and seal clearances and valve clearances

bks84

iTrader: (9)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Lubo_25 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">the supertech valvetrain will work nicely youre way under the coil bind limits my springs bind @ 14mm...toda spring material is the same spec as supertech just the brand name difference...the supertech retainers are your choice titanium or 4340 whichever you choose both will have that underside machined for extra clearance to avoid any seal damage...those cams should pull nicely with your valvetrain i see a possible 25-30bhp difference just make sure you calculate your spring, install height, guide heights, and seal clearances and valve clearances </TD></TR></TABLE>

This is a entire different monster. Let me give a run down on my setup.

street ported b16 head
supertech valve train
itr lmas
toda spec b's
twm 50mm itbs
rc 310 injectors

gsr block
stock gsr crank
eagle rods
cp 11.5:1 pistons

is my compression too low for the spec b's?

Lubo_25

your compression isn't too low but a .5 increase wouldnt hurt either...youre fine if you ask me if you do raise your compression dont mill your head .030"depending how straight your block and cylinder head are you can run a single layer hg from mugen just make sure you hondabond those pesky oil drain corners...

bks84

iTrader: (9)

Thats what I was afraid of, so its better to run 12:1 CR on the spec b's... will i get the add .5:1 bump if run a 1 layer?

thanks for you help. i didnt anticipate needed 12:1, thats gonna be difficult on 91 pump gas huh?

Lubo_25

cant really tell you off by heart but it would be ****** close...lol youre losing about .020" of depth so i can see a .5 increment...

CRX1600_GK

Hi my friends, i have a b16a2 with ctr pistons 81.5
now i would like to put toda spec a2 and my question is what retainers and springs to put on?
i will need and cam gear for this cams or with stock is ok?

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

Toda A2 cams work with OEM or similar to oem