Need some help from the mechanic guys
02-15-2006, 12:08 PM
#26
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Re: (94accordsedan)
The independent shop I work for charges 85$ an hour and Honda Dealers charge up to 110$.
Around here, you couldn't get a homeless person to do all that work for 30$ an hour.
I feel like that's a fair price even though it was under quoted.
I would feel like an *** if I did all that work on the -side- for you and only got 300$. Even if you were my friend.
Around here, you couldn't get a homeless person to do all that work for 30$ an hour.
I feel like that's a fair price even though it was under quoted.
I would feel like an *** if I did all that work on the -side- for you and only got 300$. Even if you were my friend.
02-15-2006, 12:08 PM
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Re: Need some help from the mechanic guys (94accordsedan)
the bottom line is that he's charging you over double the original quote. Is it still a good deal? I don't know, don't care. He should have called you when he realized that his quote was wrong, or he should drop the price back down. Either way, contact the BBB because that's just shady business practice.
02-15-2006, 12:09 PM
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Re: Need some help from the mechanic guys (STS_Underdog)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by STS_Underdog »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">$30 an hour is CHEAP! To answer your question AllData quotes 5.5 hours for the rear main seal. Most of the other stuff should overlap with that, you're going to have to pull the axles, trans, timing belt, flywheel, and clutch to get to it so you shouldn't be looking at more time to install that stuff. I'd probably charge .5 to put in the water pump while I was in there and another .5 for the valve cover gasket. Replacing both wheel cylinders pays 2.5 hours and includes bleeding. Not sure how much for a full flush, maybe 1.0? 1.4 for the front brakes, .3 for the oil change, and 1.7 for the radiator.
Looks like I'd charge 13.1 dor the entire job going off AllData time. See if he'll give you a breakdown of time for different stuff. It sounds like he may have charged you the full AllData time for all the work and not given any time back for the overlap. Good luck!</TD></TR></TABLE>
Scott is right, $30/hr is WAY CHEAP! We are up near $90
Math a little off. rear main has nothing to do with timing belt area, you are thinking front crank seal. by my estimates on alldata, I get a hair under 17hrs. is the guy charging for how long it took him to do the work, or by a labor guide?
Looks like I'd charge 13.1 dor the entire job going off AllData time. See if he'll give you a breakdown of time for different stuff. It sounds like he may have charged you the full AllData time for all the work and not given any time back for the overlap. Good luck!</TD></TR></TABLE>
Scott is right, $30/hr is WAY CHEAP! We are up near $90
Math a little off. rear main has nothing to do with timing belt area, you are thinking front crank seal. by my estimates on alldata, I get a hair under 17hrs. is the guy charging for how long it took him to do the work, or by a labor guide?
02-15-2006, 12:12 PM
#29
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Re: (NoAhIDontThinkSo)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by NoAhIDontThinkSo »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The independent shop I work for charges 85$ an hour and Honda Dealers charge up to 110$.
Around here, you couldn't get a homeless person to do all that work for 30$ an hour.
I feel like that's a fair price even though it was under quoted.
I would feel like an *** if I did all that work on the -side- for you and only got 300$. Even if you were my friend.</TD></TR></TABLE>
you can't compare the two. Where he is $30-45 is the norm, so going from $30 x 10 hours to $30 x 22.65 hours, or $67.95 x 10 hours is insane.
Around here, you couldn't get a homeless person to do all that work for 30$ an hour.
I feel like that's a fair price even though it was under quoted.
I would feel like an *** if I did all that work on the -side- for you and only got 300$. Even if you were my friend.</TD></TR></TABLE>
you can't compare the two. Where he is $30-45 is the norm, so going from $30 x 10 hours to $30 x 22.65 hours, or $67.95 x 10 hours is insane.
02-15-2006, 12:27 PM
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Re: Need some help from the mechanic guys (nonsense)
i had something like this happen to me when i had my motor built. the guy was supposed to give me a great price (which he came to i didn't try and lower it), and in return i would tell people about who built my motor.
Well when i went to pick it up it was around 1200 more dollars then he had quoted me, i said WTF no way, we agreed on one price and this is 1200 MORE then that price. He said "things were alittle more then i thought". I ponnied up paid the guy, and haven't said **** about here i got my motor built, and if some one askes about um, i say stay away.
Like 94accord the original price was awsome and even the price that i ended up paying was a good deal, (still about 1000 bellow what a other places charge). But that DOES NOT make it ok that those business did it.
I learned my lesson, when ever im going to do something like that again, i get a writen itemized prize quote sign.
Well when i went to pick it up it was around 1200 more dollars then he had quoted me, i said WTF no way, we agreed on one price and this is 1200 MORE then that price. He said "things were alittle more then i thought". I ponnied up paid the guy, and haven't said **** about here i got my motor built, and if some one askes about um, i say stay away.
Like 94accord the original price was awsome and even the price that i ended up paying was a good deal, (still about 1000 bellow what a other places charge). But that DOES NOT make it ok that those business did it.
I learned my lesson, when ever im going to do something like that again, i get a writen itemized prize quote sign.
02-15-2006, 12:36 PM
#31
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We don't know this guy or anything. All we did was looked at the phone book and called around. He was the cheapest with the quickest turnaround time.
For the price this guy wants to charge I could have trailered the car to our old mechanic and it still would have cost less. I understand fully that you can be off on your estimate. But being off by 2x the quoted value is a little ridiculous to me.
Had he called us and said "Hey my estimate was wrong, its going to be $xxx more." I'd be okay. But, not a single word from the guy until we went to pick the car up and was handed the $670 bill.
For the price this guy wants to charge I could have trailered the car to our old mechanic and it still would have cost less. I understand fully that you can be off on your estimate. But being off by 2x the quoted value is a little ridiculous to me.
Had he called us and said "Hey my estimate was wrong, its going to be $xxx more." I'd be okay. But, not a single word from the guy until we went to pick the car up and was handed the $670 bill.
02-15-2006, 12:45 PM
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Re: Need some help from the mechanic guys (o-man)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by o-man »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Scott is right, $30/hr is WAY CHEAP! We are up near $90
Math a little off. rear main has nothing to do with timing belt area, you are thinking front crank seal. by my estimates on alldata, I get a hair under 17hrs. is the guy charging for how long it took him to do the work, or by a labor guide?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yeah I realized that and corrected it in an IM. I was on a lunch break and typing without thinking too much
And for the record our (GM) shop charges $79/hr.
Scott is right, $30/hr is WAY CHEAP! We are up near $90
Math a little off. rear main has nothing to do with timing belt area, you are thinking front crank seal. by my estimates on alldata, I get a hair under 17hrs. is the guy charging for how long it took him to do the work, or by a labor guide?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yeah I realized that and corrected it in an IM. I was on a lunch break and typing without thinking too much
And for the record our (GM) shop charges $79/hr.
02-15-2006, 06:01 PM
#33
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Well we did all the math and everything and we came up with $580 after taxes that he should reasonably charge us. Still a $100 delta from what he told us this morning, hopefully the guy is understanding and agrees to it.
Thanks to everyone for your suggestions, hope to have this resolved in the AM tomorrow.
Thanks to everyone for your suggestions, hope to have this resolved in the AM tomorrow.
02-15-2006, 06:22 PM
#34
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Re: (shakedown94)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by shakedown94 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">motors guide says 6.1 on rear main seal
wp/belt/etc. 4.2
axles overlap with rear main seal
the rest does not add up to 9 hrs.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
AXELS do not overlap with rear main!!
tranny must be dropped to change rear main!!!!!!!
i would have charged at least 600 for everything done
300 tbelt
300 clutch/flywheel/rearmain/axels
150 install brakes new rotors (deglazing) front and rear and rest of the work
wp/belt/etc. 4.2
axles overlap with rear main seal
the rest does not add up to 9 hrs.
</TD></TR></TABLE>AXELS do not overlap with rear main!!
tranny must be dropped to change rear main!!!!!!!
i would have charged at least 600 for everything done
300 tbelt
300 clutch/flywheel/rearmain/axels
150 install brakes new rotors (deglazing) front and rear and rest of the work
02-15-2006, 08:14 PM
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Re: (chad)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by chad »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
AXELS do not overlap with rear main!!
tranny must be dropped to change rear main!!!!!!!
i would have charged at least 600 for everything done
300 tbelt
300 clutch/flywheel/rearmain/axels
150 install brakes new rotors (deglazing) front and rear and rest of the work</TD></TR></TABLE>
huh what, you take the axles out to remove trans to pull rear main seal. so can't charge time to do both seperately. so just parts on axles.
am i missing something
overlap= rear main seal time includes remove and replace axles and trans
Modified by shakedown94 at 2:11 AM 2/16/2006
AXELS do not overlap with rear main!!
tranny must be dropped to change rear main!!!!!!!
i would have charged at least 600 for everything done
300 tbelt
300 clutch/flywheel/rearmain/axels
150 install brakes new rotors (deglazing) front and rear and rest of the work</TD></TR></TABLE>
huh what, you take the axles out to remove trans to pull rear main seal. so can't charge time to do both seperately. so just parts on axles.
am i missing something
overlap= rear main seal time includes remove and replace axles and trans
Modified by shakedown94 at 2:11 AM 2/16/2006
02-16-2006, 03:39 PM
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Re: (shakedown94)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by shakedown94 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
huh what, you take the axles out to remove trans to pull rear main seal. so can't charge time to do both seperately. so just parts on axles.
am i missing something
overlap= rear main seal time includes remove and replace axles and trans
Modified by shakedown94 at 2:11 AM 2/16/2006</TD></TR></TABLE>
you're right.
BTW: That's cheap, if you came out here to MD at our shop to get that work done, it would have been a least a grand even if you brought you're own parts. But I would also be a little dissapointed about getting a bill twice the amount quoted.
Good luck,
AJ
huh what, you take the axles out to remove trans to pull rear main seal. so can't charge time to do both seperately. so just parts on axles.
am i missing something
overlap= rear main seal time includes remove and replace axles and trans
Modified by shakedown94 at 2:11 AM 2/16/2006</TD></TR></TABLE>
you're right.
BTW: That's cheap, if you came out here to MD at our shop to get that work done, it would have been a least a grand even if you brought you're own parts. But I would also be a little dissapointed about getting a bill twice the amount quoted.
Good luck,
AJ
02-16-2006, 04:03 PM
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Re: (shakedown94)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by shakedown94 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
huh what, you take the axles out to remove trans to pull rear main seal. so can't charge time to do both seperately. so just parts on axles.
am i missing something
overlap= rear main seal time includes remove and replace axles and trans
Modified by shakedown94 at 2:11 AM 2/16/2006</TD></TR></TABLE>
Actually, you don't have to take the axles right out to yank out the tranny. You only have to undo the lower ball joints, pop the axles out of the tranny, and then support the knuckles out 5 or 6 inches to give you enough room for the diff to go past the inner joints. Because 8 times out of 10 the lower shock fork bolt is going to be seized in the bushing, and you don't want to go there.
Flat rate = only undo what you absolutely have to.
Now that I thought about it, I would prob be charging extra for the axles.
huh what, you take the axles out to remove trans to pull rear main seal. so can't charge time to do both seperately. so just parts on axles.
am i missing something
overlap= rear main seal time includes remove and replace axles and trans
Modified by shakedown94 at 2:11 AM 2/16/2006</TD></TR></TABLE>
Actually, you don't have to take the axles right out to yank out the tranny. You only have to undo the lower ball joints, pop the axles out of the tranny, and then support the knuckles out 5 or 6 inches to give you enough room for the diff to go past the inner joints. Because 8 times out of 10 the lower shock fork bolt is going to be seized in the bushing, and you don't want to go there.
Flat rate = only undo what you absolutely have to.
Now that I thought about it, I would prob be charging extra for the axles.
02-16-2006, 04:12 PM
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Re: (MightyMouseTech)
I don't know how it is out there..but in the shop I worked for, if I deviated from the quote by ANY amount, I had to call the customer, get an approval, intial the work order, write the name, date and time I received modified authorization and provide the new out the door total. This was required by the Department of Consumer Affairs
Bureau of Automotive Repair
http://www.smogcheck.ca.gov/St...4.htm
By the way... for all that work.... you didn't get screwed.
The rear main/clutch and timing belt /water alone would be around $600 plus
the radiator, brakes, and other little things..
I'd bet this job could easily quote up to over $1000.00
Bureau of Automotive Repair
http://www.smogcheck.ca.gov/St...4.htm
By the way... for all that work.... you didn't get screwed.
The rear main/clutch and timing belt /water alone would be around $600 plus
the radiator, brakes, and other little things..
I'd bet this job could easily quote up to over $1000.00
02-16-2006, 04:43 PM
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I don't even wanna get into this anymore. 
He didn't even touch the rear seal. Charged me for 19 hrs of labor for water pump, timing belt, thermostat, tightening the oil pan bolts, replacing the radiator, brakes and rear wheel cylinders. Didn't budge on the price, ended up paying the full $679.xx.
Oh well... car is all buttoned down... few more last minute checks and we are on the road tomorrow.
He didn't even touch the rear seal. Charged me for 19 hrs of labor for water pump, timing belt, thermostat, tightening the oil pan bolts, replacing the radiator, brakes and rear wheel cylinders. Didn't budge on the price, ended up paying the full $679.xx.
Oh well... car is all buttoned down... few more last minute checks and we are on the road tomorrow.
02-16-2006, 05:54 PM
#41
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Re: (94accordsedan)
this is very important
DO YOU HAVE A COPY OF THE WORK ORDER WITH A LABOR QUOTE?
if you DO you are only obligated to pay that amount unless they called you and informed you that it would cost more. if you DONT you are kinda screwed.
DO YOU HAVE A COPY OF THE WORK ORDER WITH A LABOR QUOTE?
if you DO you are only obligated to pay that amount unless they called you and informed you that it would cost more. if you DONT you are kinda screwed.
02-16-2006, 06:05 PM
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Re: (Kamin)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Kamin »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">this is very important
DO YOU HAVE A COPY OF THE WORK ORDER WITH A LABOR QUOTE?
if you DO you are only obligated to pay that amount unless they called you and informed you that it would cost more. if you DONT you are kinda screwed. </TD></TR></TABLE>
Wish we had that, would make it so much easier.
OT: Total for the car... including cost, registration, repairs, etc, etc, etc - $3800. And the car cost $1750 of that.
DO YOU HAVE A COPY OF THE WORK ORDER WITH A LABOR QUOTE?
if you DO you are only obligated to pay that amount unless they called you and informed you that it would cost more. if you DONT you are kinda screwed. </TD></TR></TABLE>
Wish we had that, would make it so much easier.
OT: Total for the car... including cost, registration, repairs, etc, etc, etc - $3800. And the car cost $1750 of that.
02-16-2006, 07:54 PM
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Re: (MightyMouseTech)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by MightyMouseTech »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Actually, you don't have to take the axles right out to yank out the tranny. You only have to undo the lower ball joints, pop the axles out of the tranny, and then support the knuckles out 5 or 6 inches to give you enough room for the diff to go past the inner joints. Because 8 times out of 10 the lower shock fork bolt is going to be seized in the bushing, and you don't want to go there.
Flat rate = only undo what you absolutely have to.
Now that I thought about it, I would prob be charging extra for the axles.</TD></TR></TABLE>
we were taking book time, not tech short cuts.
Actually, you don't have to take the axles right out to yank out the tranny. You only have to undo the lower ball joints, pop the axles out of the tranny, and then support the knuckles out 5 or 6 inches to give you enough room for the diff to go past the inner joints. Because 8 times out of 10 the lower shock fork bolt is going to be seized in the bushing, and you don't want to go there.
Flat rate = only undo what you absolutely have to.
Now that I thought about it, I would prob be charging extra for the axles.</TD></TR></TABLE>
we were taking book time, not tech short cuts.
02-17-2006, 09:25 AM
#44
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Re: (Honda318dx)
$30 dollars an hour is super cheap
My hourly rate at the bicycle shop I worked at was $50...and that is working on bicycles.
I do however understand the frustration with the difference between the bill and the quote
My hourly rate at the bicycle shop I worked at was $50...and that is working on bicycles.
I do however understand the frustration with the difference between the bill and the quote
02-17-2006, 10:14 AM
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Re: (Solo1B16Hatch)
hope you signed a quote sheet. your local BBB would probably be pretty interested in hearing about this, and i'd bet the shop would be pretty interested in keeping the BBB from finding out.
02-17-2006, 10:26 AM
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Re: (94accordsedan)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 94accordsedan »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I don't even wanna get into this anymore.
He didn't even touch the rear seal. Charged me for 19 hrs of labor for water pump, timing belt, thermostat, tightening the oil pan bolts, replacing the radiator, brakes and rear wheel cylinders. Didn't budge on the price, ended up paying the full $679.xx.
Oh well... car is all buttoned down... few more last minute checks and we are on the road tomorrow. </TD></TR></TABLE>
that sucks ... post his name and stuff here just in case anyone else is in your area .... call the BBB too.
He didn't even touch the rear seal. Charged me for 19 hrs of labor for water pump, timing belt, thermostat, tightening the oil pan bolts, replacing the radiator, brakes and rear wheel cylinders. Didn't budge on the price, ended up paying the full $679.xx.
Oh well... car is all buttoned down... few more last minute checks and we are on the road tomorrow. </TD></TR></TABLE>
that sucks ... post his name and stuff here just in case anyone else is in your area .... call the BBB too.
02-17-2006, 12:36 PM
#47
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Re: (Solo1B16Hatch)
this kind of crap is exactly why i do all my own work. did you pay by check? cancel your check. credit card? challenge the charge. you still have options. sometimes a lawyer just writing a letter threatening small claims court will get you back much of your money.
btw, if you're ever in MA and you need work done on your car, look up Chang Ho Kim at FunHonda's in Maynard, MA. probably the only automotive tech in the world that still actually uses a proper torque wrench. straight up honest guy too.
nate
btw, if you're ever in MA and you need work done on your car, look up Chang Ho Kim at FunHonda's in Maynard, MA. probably the only automotive tech in the world that still actually uses a proper torque wrench. straight up honest guy too.
nate
02-18-2006, 03:22 AM
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Re: (solo-x)
Commentary and I'll try not to hi-jack.....
Around here in the Gotham land of plenty, $679 will barely get you an oil change. I haven't ever heard of shop labor of $30-45 ever, well, maybe I have, but it would have been 25 years ago.
Dealer rates here are $95-100/hr. Independents $75-85. Still, I understand your beef on the 100% plus increase.
I try to do my own work, but at this point in my busy almost middle-aged life something's gots to give, and lately it is working on the cars. Case in point: CEL on the Toyota last month. I know the shortcut to get codes blinking by morse code ont he light by jumping out pins in the OBD II plug, but it was cold out in the garage and my schedule sucked that week. So to the dealer it went, for diagnosis only, besides having two recalls taken care of.
After telling/trying to sell me either a) a new engine - "your car is burning oil!" to b) a tune-up and new MAF (really just plugs/filters), I took the $95 of diagnostic info, went to the parts counter the next day and spent $60 for plugs/filters/pcv, along with $5 at AutoZone for some Electronics Sensod cleaner (after 100k the MAF did look like a Chia Pet with so much oily fuzz). In an hour, including the trip to the dealer, AutoZone, and the weekly dry-cleaner errand, all was R&R'ed. Car did run alot better.
YMMV.
Around here in the Gotham land of plenty, $679 will barely get you an oil change. I haven't ever heard of shop labor of $30-45 ever, well, maybe I have, but it would have been 25 years ago.
Dealer rates here are $95-100/hr. Independents $75-85. Still, I understand your beef on the 100% plus increase.
I try to do my own work, but at this point in my busy almost middle-aged life something's gots to give, and lately it is working on the cars. Case in point: CEL on the Toyota last month. I know the shortcut to get codes blinking by morse code ont he light by jumping out pins in the OBD II plug, but it was cold out in the garage and my schedule sucked that week. So to the dealer it went, for diagnosis only, besides having two recalls taken care of.
After telling/trying to sell me either a) a new engine - "your car is burning oil!" to b) a tune-up and new MAF (really just plugs/filters), I took the $95 of diagnostic info, went to the parts counter the next day and spent $60 for plugs/filters/pcv, along with $5 at AutoZone for some Electronics Sensod cleaner (after 100k the MAF did look like a Chia Pet with so much oily fuzz). In an hour, including the trip to the dealer, AutoZone, and the weekly dry-cleaner errand, all was R&R'ed. Car did run alot better.
YMMV.
02-18-2006, 06:40 AM
#49
Re: (preparedcivic)
I've seen shops charge up to $200 to change a SOHC timing belt/wp in Austin. Changing the clutch would be another $200 or more.
It sucks that they went over and didnt tell you, but even at 679 you're getting a good deal. If you pay up and dont burn your bridges a reasonably cheap shop like that would be good to have on friendly terms.
PS: Make them give back all the old parts.
It sucks that they went over and didnt tell you, but even at 679 you're getting a good deal. If you pay up and dont burn your bridges a reasonably cheap shop like that would be good to have on friendly terms.
PS: Make them give back all the old parts.
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